Outside Pommel Nut Key

[EdGardner]

So, I recently coverted all my weapons to visconti grips, and in a move I can only describe as stupid fueled by lack of coffee, managed to get a bunch of outside pommel nuts instead of the inside, so I needed a tool for those.

I have been through 2 Absolute keys, both have shattered just trying to screw the nuts into the pommel.

Does someone make one that is not die cast? These absolute keys don't seem to be able to take even the slightest torque....

[SJCFU#2]

While I've seen a few outside hex tools crack (the wall can get pretty thin at the corners of the hex-shaped recess) I don't think that I've ever seen one shatter, so my first reaction upon reading this was to wonder what you are doing that's causing these things to break. Are you putting a lock washer in there or trying to deform the pommel to match the shape of the bottom of the recess in the grip?

You might want to try a tool from a different vendor (or maybe even a deep recess 8mm socket, assuming you can find one that will fit into your grip). I've had my various outside hex tools for so many years that I don't even recall who I bought them from.

Or you could simply replace all your pommels with inside hex (it sounds like you're spent that much on tools already). Just stay away from the ones with both inside hex and screwdriver slots (they don't hold up well) and be aware that you will have to much more careful about your tang length.

[EdGardner]

Lock washers yes, and I thought I was over torquing it too, the first time, but the second time it wasn't even all the way down.

The walls of the die cast tool were just really thin on one side and the metal was really brittle.

Yeah, I have gone ahead and ordered some inside nuts, was a stupid mistake to begin with, but this should be a conquerable problem

[Mergs]

What I've done in the past is to drill out the grips to 1/2" and use a 3/8" drive, 8mm deep-well socket and ratchet wrench.

If you really want to make it slick, also use a 1/2" reamer, or if you have access to one, a 1/2" endmill, to flatten out the bottom of the hole, so lock washers will work better.

[brtech]

Some vendors have a cast wrench. Others have a hex tube stock: no casting, no welding.

I've never broken my cast handle.

I think outside hex is a superior pommel nut. It is much more forgiving on tang length, less likely to get buggered up, and costs less.

[KD5MDK]

Who sells the cast handles? The corners on my cheapie have worn down a bit and don't grip reliably.

[EdGardner]

I'd like to get a realiable tool, without doing more work to the grips. Have I simply had bad luck with these Absolutes being thin on one side and brittle? Those seem to be the only ones f.net sells...

[Nolano]

Hmm. If I find myself in need of an outside hex wrench, I think I'll get the right size socket and take it down on a lathe until it'll fit the grip.

[Mergs]

Hmm. If I find myself in need of an outside hex wrench, I think I'll get the right size socket and take it down on a lathe until it'll fit the grip.

Or do as I suggested above, especially if you have access to machine tools.

[Nolano]

Or do as I suggested above, especially if you have access to machine tools.

For my own grips, yes. Being the armorer though, I can't guarantee that all the grips I'll use will have been modified in such a fashion.

[Dr Epee]

The big disadvantage of outside hex nuts is that the business end of the wrench has, of necessity, to be quite thin to fit between the nut and the edge of the hole in the grip.This causes them to break very easily. My advice would be to stop throwing good money after bad. Get some inside hex nuts and an Allen wrench.

[EdGardner]

I should take a picture of these, it might illustrate the problem.

I ordered some inside nuts, I have some already on some of the weapons, and I have an allen wrench, but I also located a vendor who sells a different brand, and will try one more 10$ spend.

I will report back if it is a success and quietly slink away if it fails

[keeper of the swords]

I've not experienced any breakage from the (multiple) BG wrenches I've used/seen. Having more leeway in cutting the tang is my reason to use outside hex nuts. Also try long-reach/"deep" sockets from a higher end vendor (e.g., snap-on); they typically are of a stronger grade steel and can have thinner walls.

[brtech]

The big disadvantage of outside hex nuts is that the business end of the wrench has, of necessity, to be quite thin to fit between the nut and the edge of the hole in the grip.This causes them to break very easily. My advice would be to stop throwing good money after bad. Get some inside hex nuts and an Allen wrench.

Just as a point of view, I've been armoring for, oh, 10 years I guess.
I use a lot of outside hex. That's all I'll buy for any of my fencers unless they insist. I've NEVER broken an outside hex tool. This is the first time I've ever heard of an outside hex tool failing.

I get buggered inside hex nuts handed to me all the time.

I've seen TWO buggered outside hex nuts: the guy had managed to overtorque it, and pretty much destroyed the nut and the handle. You also occasionally see a tang improperly bent which makes it hard to get the wrench on. These pale compared to the problems I've seen with inside hex.

Outside hex is also cheaper.

[Mergs]

Outside hex is also cheaper.

And you can make your own pretty easily, too!

[Pescados666]

Wouldn't it be cheaper and less time consuming just to pick up some inside nuts? If you do decide just to buy new nuts, and your tang is short enough, you could just put a slot in the top of the nut and scew it in with a screwdriver. That should be a good fix until you get new nuts.

[Mergs]

Wouldn't it be cheaper and less time consuming just to pick up some inside nuts? If you do decide just to buy new nuts, and your tang is short enough, you could just put a slot in the top of the nut and scew it in with a screwdriver. That should be a good fix until you get new nuts.

No, because you face the same problem in that you can only go to the point where the tang would push the screwdriver out of the slot.

[SJCFU#2]

Not to mention that the screwdriver slots tend to weaken the pommel, which is usually what leads to them getting buggered up (it can be really hard to get the pommel out when one side has broken off).

[fencerbill]

Outside hex are a God send for a school or a club because you don't have to have specific grips for specific blades.

A quickie outside hex nut tool is a six-way screwdriver. Two sizes of blade and Phillips bits and a quarter inch driver and a five sixteenths driver which is indistinguishable from 8 mm. And you can get one in almost any hardware store for about $5 or less.

Used a lot of them and never broken one.

A quickie savior for a slotted pommel with a too long tang is a blade screwdriver with the center of the blade ground back. I posted a picture of mine a few months ago.