What's It Take?

[veeco]

Originally Posted by C.I.C.

You need to re-read AF's initial post.
"For those of us average fencers, (yes, me) who want to get there, in say 2012 or 2016, what will it take?"

Seems pretty clear to me.

You need to reread his post as well. If I remember correctly, he said:

How are those of you who are making it doing it?

Unless I am severely mistaken, you haven't indicated at this point that you've made the Olympics. If you claim you have, you better tell us who you are, because I don't know of any regular poster on this board who has made the Olympics, or is going to this year as a fencer.

[Applesauce and Foils]

Oh, yes, more clarification is in order. Someone wrote that they were 14, not me.

Also I am a girl.

Af

[KD5MDK]

You need to go to FIT. It's the best foil club in Dallas and its fencers have performed on par with Salle Mauro's, without needing to move. It's also go the highest performing Women's Foilists in the state. (Currently. which means not counting Vinnie Bradford)

[Applesauce and Foils]

If anyone is from FIT or Salle Mauro, I'd love to hear what you do to train.

AF

[erooMynohtnA]

Originally Posted by Applesauce and Foils

If anyone is from FIT or Salle Mauro, I'd love to hear what you do to train.

They fence at FIT or Salle Mauro.

[Applesauce and Foils]

Ha ha. Stop. My side.


Come on.

[Applesauce and Foils]

oh, btw, I love your sig!

[eac]

No, he's not kidding. The club should take over your training, and doing what the club says should really be exactly what you need to do to get to the Olympics.

Presumably their training involves lessons, fencing, footwork drills, and conditioning, and maybe bladework drills.

[C.I.C.]

Originally Posted by veeco

You need to reread his post as well.

Let's both reread those posts shall we?

In her first post, AF said "For those of us average fencers, (yes, me) who want to get there, in say 2012 or 2016, what will it take?"

Then Sabresque said "Guys, applesauce was not asking whether or not its feasable that he/she maks teh team, she was asking what you need to do to make it."

I was pointing out to Sabreque that AF DID, in fact, ask how she could "get there, in say 2012...".

That she also asked "How are those of you who are making it doing it?" did not supersede the sentence that preceded it, where she was clearly asking how she could make the 2012 team!

[posternutbag]

Ok, so I don't really know much about fencing, but I know something about what it takes to be an Olympian. I launched an unsuccessful campaign myself, I have 2 college teammates who were Olympians, I have 2 other friends who had serious but unsuccessful campaigns, and 1 other friend who had a sort of last-minute, half-hearted attempt. Now, before I go too far, all my experience, both first and second hand is from the sailing world; however, there are some important similarities. So please, while this may not have a ton of fencing relavence, it may give some insight into competeing at a high level in a competative sport. I think fencing and sailing have three important similarities.
1) Cost, both are expensive, although sailing is much, much more expensive (think in the hundreds of thousands of US dollars for a campaign).

2) Both tend to require overseas competition to excel (although some Americans make the US Olympic sailing team racing exclusively in the US, they are distinct minorities. In some boats such as the 470, you pretty much have to compete in Europe to have a prayer).

3) Neither fencing nor sailing require a high level of fitness. (This is not to say that they require no fitness. Fitness is simply not the limiting factor for most Olympic sailors. Sailing is rigorous at the highest levels, but its not as physical as gymnastics. Skill can trump fitness.)

Ok, with those ground rules set, what does it take to get to that level.

1) Love of the sport. I spent so much time on the water, I essentially had no life. I'm talking 4-5 hours a day 200+ days a year for years starting in high school, through college (I actually dropped out to sail more, and college sailing is generally considered an excellent proving ground for aspiring Olympians) and as an adult. This then leads directly into #2.

2) Money. If you aren't idependently wealthy, competing at this level requires a rediculous level of commitment. really, 1 and 2 are so interelated that I consider them 1 idea, I just broke them up for clarity. The money factor is huge and I have seen it derail numerous would-be athletes with talent. Talent is never enough. You have to love it enough to live the lifestyle. I know guys that lived in vans for months on end. These were guys (and girls) with some level of sponsorship, but still, without having rich parents, they lived like vagabonds. Sailing is much more expensive than fencing, but still, be prepared to sleep on lots of floors and eat lots of cheap pasta. If you are a trustafarian, you can pretty much ignore the financials.

3) Intagibles. Be prepared for failure. Lots of failure. You will lose...alot on the way to winning. The psychological stuff is pretty much what derailed me. You will be lonely and have alot of time to think about your failures. It hurts way more than you think and really robs you of the love of the game that is absolutely essential. You will see your dreams shredded repeatedly. Supportive parents help. Being involved in the social aspects of the sport can help or hurt depending on your personality.

The Olympics are a realistic goal, especially if you start early. alot of people tend to try to crush dreams because all they see are the obstacles that stopped them. I wouldn't trade my time in the boat for anything, well maybe something, but really, I loved to compete.

[veeco]

Originally Posted by C.I.C.

Let's both reread those posts shall we?

In her first post, AF said "For those of us average fencers, (yes, me) who want to get there, in say 2012 or 2016, what will it take?"

Then Sabresque said "Guys, applesauce was not asking whether or not its feasable that he/she maks teh team, she was asking what you need to do to make it."

I was pointing out to Sabreque that AF DID, in fact, ask how she could "get there, in say 2012...".

That she also asked "How are those of you who are making it doing it?" did not supersede the sentence that preceded it, where she was clearly asking how she could make the 2012 team!

And I was pointing out that your opinion on the matter was irrelevant. The fact that you think she won't be able to make it, in 2012 or later, is completely uninteresting for her: you've never been to the Olympics as a fencer, and aren't going to this year.

[posternutbag]

Clearly OP wants to know what it will take for her to make the Olympics, either in 2012 or 2016. I am a little unclear as to how old she is, but it seems like she is young enough to be able to devote time to the pusuit.

The time is important, but one of the things I learned early was constructive time was very important. Here is where coaching becomes a major issue and access to good coaching is imperative. This holds true across just about every sport, and many posters have already pointed this out. You need good coaching to progress beyond the local level in almost any sport.

This sort of dovetails with parental support. Parents need to support their aspiring athletes, providing funding, transport, food, access to camps, and cross-training. I had some good friends whose parents were unable to provide this level of support/commitment. These athletes worked jobs in high school to help fund their activities. This was a significant hurrdle. I'm not saying you can't make the Olympics if you have to have a part-time job to help finance it, but it is much easier if someone else is footing the bills.

This is why you see a lot of Olympians, in all sports, in their late teens and twenties. Unless you are a female gymnast, it is unlikely that you have hit your physical, genetic potential at 20. However, at some point usually mid 20's, most people fall into an adult life. It is this, the adult life, that is the killer of Olympic dreams.

[C.I.C.]

Originally Posted by veeco

And I was pointing out that your opinion on the matter was irrelevant. The fact that you think she won't be able to make it, in 2012 or later, is completely uninteresting for her: you've never been to the Olympics as a fencer, and aren't going to this year.

That's ridiculous! Using that reasoning, no one here who hasn't personally made an Olympic fencing team should be offering any advice at all on the subject.

You don't have to have been personally mugged in an ally to advise someone not to walk down it! You don't have to be a world-class concert violinist to advise a beginner on the instrument that they won't be a soloist with the New York Philharmonic in a relatively short time!

Anyone, anyone, can look at the records and see that a "U" rated fencer has virtually no chance of winning a spot on the 2012 U.S. Olympic team.

Remember, this is a head-to-head competitive selection process, not a "personal best" solo effort. Scores of other fencers will be working to ensure that that Olympic spot goes to them and not to their opponents.

[Applesauce and Foils]

I believe most of you understand what I was asking for in my original post. And if that wasn't clear enough check out the post where I clarified a second time.

And just in case that's not clear enough, third time's the charm:
I am not asking if you think I'll make it. Or if I have a chance at making it. I'm asking what I can do to make it.

Thanks to everyone who's written in with helpful advice and support.


Now there should be no problem.

AF

[Hauptman]

Posternutbag: while I agree with most of what you say I have to point out one major error - "Neither fencing nor sailing require a high level of fitness."?!?

I can't speak for sailing, but fencing is an extremely physical sport. While knowledge and experience are absolutely necessary, you will also never get to the highest levels of the sport without having significant physical talent and being in superb physical condition.

[keith]

Originally Posted by Applesauce and Foils

I am not asking if you think I'll make it. Or if I have a chance at making it. I'm asking what I can do to make it.

That question has been answered several times.

[TBean]

I go back to the 2012 Olympics being an unrealistic goal in terms of a long-range, big dream type of thing. As one other posted stated her child went from a U to A in four years - not making a team - but to being a competative fencer with the goal of an Olympic team four years from today. That is eight years of training.

So, Miss Applesauce that gives you a plausible timeline. In the next four years, you need to take yourself from a U to competing successfully at the national level. For the four years after that you need to continue to compete successfully nationally AND add successful international competition to your resume. That level of results will win you your big dreams.

You will not get there alone, running in your driveway. Do what you can now to be a fit and conditioned as possible. You can do footwork, you can even do some bladework to stay in shape but you will not improve or make significant headway on your goals. You can get books to read and videos to watch high level fencing, but the sooner you get to a coach and a program that has you training the sooner you will be reaching your goals. That program will be shaped by the philosophies of the coach but you should be drilling with your team mates, footwork, coaching, bouting, conditioning and learning as much about the tactics of the sport as possible - this should be three or four times per week, then additional conditioning and weight work, plus as many competitions as possible.

This sport requires two people at a minimum to make it a go, so find more fencers. Good luck.

[posternutbag]

Fencing (and indeed sailing) requires a high level of fitness to compete at the highest levels, but I stand by my assessment that it will not likely be the limiting factor in the success of an Olympian. Fitness plays a role, but not nearly to the extent that it does in something like gymnastics, or wrestling, or the decathlon. I was well-conditioned when I sailed, as were most other top-level racers, but nowhere near the level of some other sports. I have not fenced at an Olympic level, nor have I met anone who has, but it is difficult for me to believe it requires a level of fitness approaching what is needed to compete at the highest level in something like wrestling or gymnastics.

[BrianH]

Originally Posted by posternutbag

I have not fenced at an Olympic level, nor have I met anone who has, but it is difficult for me to believe it requires a level of fitness approaching what is needed to compete at the highest level in something like wrestling or gymnastics.

It might not be so difficult to believe if you actually knew any high-level fencers. I imagine you know a lot about sailing, but that knowledge doesn't translate well to fencing, in my opinion. In your first post you said, "Ok, so I don't really know much about fencing,..." which leaves me inclined to discount what you have to say specifically about the sport of fencing.

[whtouche]

Originally Posted by posternutbag

I have not fenced at an Olympic level, nor have I met anone who has, but it is difficult for me to believe it requires a level of fitness approaching what is needed to compete at the highest level in something like wrestling or gymnastics.

Those two statements are not a coincidence...