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Carlos37 · 12-26-2007, 10:54 AM

I´m sorry I made a mistake with my other post about this matter.The question I was really asking was:If your opponent yells a lot after scoring every touch,you just have to put up with it and shut up?If you respond to his yells by yelling loud as well as in getting even with him,are you doing wrong?

Jay Young · 12-26-2007, 11:06 AM

Yes. Not only will you aggravate your opponent, it is considered unsportsmanlike and you can receive a G3 red, if you do it out of retaliation.

There was a fencer in the Rocky Mountain section that would scream like a banshee AT her opponents. She was verbally warned against the action and she stopped. If I were reffing her, I'd have thrown the book at her...

telkanuru · 12-26-2007, 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jay Young

If I were reffing her, I'd have thrown the book at her...

There's no real book to throw, unless she was disrupting order on the strip. If you called that for simply yelling, however loudly, you'd get some funny looks.

oiuyt · 12-26-2007, 01:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by telkanuru

There's no real book to throw, unless she was disrupting order on the strip. If you called that for simply yelling, however loudly, you'd get some funny looks.

And probably quite a bit of yelling.... :)

-B

dekko · 12-26-2007, 01:10 PM

When I am reffing I give someone one time to yell/scream at another fencer. I then pull them aside and let them know if they do that again I will consider it unsportsmanlike and penalize them accordingly.

This is all it usually takes as I tell them making noise after a touch, while it may be annoying, is fine but not at the other fencer.

Peach · 12-26-2007, 01:13 PM

Ah, the screaming thing. Should there also be cards for scratching, belching, sly looks, suggestive leers, and dirty uniforms? And really foul-smelling gloves, if only because I finally washed mine and want some recognition for the effort.

Though I admit that when someone screams after scoring a touch on me, I'm rather tickled. Becca Ward maintains a genteel and friendly silence when fencing me, I'm afraid.

rdg · 12-26-2007, 01:44 PM

Something I don't understand as a relatively new epee fencer, and certainly new to competition around saberist, is all of the yelling in saber. It seems like after every touch the combatants yell their heads off, make huge gestures and other wise try to convince the director they have right of way.

It can't be very effective since both sides do the same thing on every touch. So what's up?

Sam

lindajdunn · 12-26-2007, 02:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rdg

Something I don't understand as a relatively new epee fencer, and certainly new to competition around saberist, is all of the yelling in saber. It seems like after every touch the combatants yell their heads off, make huge gestures and other wise try to convince the director they have right of way.

It can't be very effective since both sides do the same thing on every touch. So what's up?

Sam

First, I am a sabre fencer and I do NOT yell. However, I have noticed that some fencers have a build-up that leads to a release after they think they have scored a touch. Think of it as the equivalent of belching after a particularly satisfying meal.

As for why two of them are so often yelling at their fists at the same moment, it's because sometimes they are wrong in thinking they scored that touch.

Then again, there is the belief that yelling at their fists and turning to the director will lead the director to rewarding them with a point.

Some people believe in the tooth fairy, too.

Then again, sometimes fencers who yell DO get touches they probably should not have received by yelling at referees. Sometimes people find money under their pillow after losing a tooth.

I do not believe yelling at the hand or leaving a tooth under the pillow will yield the desired result.

I'm a yelling atheist.

rdg · 12-26-2007, 02:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lindajdunn

I'm a yelling atheist.

Very funny.

dekko · 12-26-2007, 02:58 PM

At the risk of spawning the kind of responses I am sure are coming.......

Yelling in any combat sport is a sign of psychological arousal. Some people can do combat sports and show no emotion, others use this emotion to bring up their physical presence in the matchup to where it needs to be. There is lots more to it but this is the basic reason why. Some react well and fence better others do not and fence worse.

As for yelling in different events, there are plenty of fencers in all 6 events who yell quite a bit. Just because you haven't seen it doesn't mean it doesn't happen. It may be a regional thing but there are plenty of fencers in all the events who yell quite a bit.

telkanuru · 12-26-2007, 08:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dekko

When I am reffing I give someone one time to yell/scream at another fencer. I then pull them aside and let them know if they do that again I will consider it unsportsmanlike and penalize them accordingly.

This is all it usually takes as I tell them making noise after a touch, while it may be annoying, is fine but not at the other fencer.

It's important to differentiate here between "yelling loudly" and "yelling at another fencer". The latter is definitely grounds for an unsportsmanlike card. Card someone for the former, and you prolly won't ref anything important ever, and be laughed at in the street by homeless beggars who smell of wee.

samster · 12-26-2007, 08:49 PM

silly and irksome gestures caused by too much testosterone in the wheaties

Peach · 12-26-2007, 09:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by samster

silly and irksome gestures caused by too much testosterone in the wheaties

I assume you mean the Breakfast of Referees

samster · 12-26-2007, 09:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peach

I assume you mean the Breakfast of Referees

yup.

Schiavona · 12-26-2007, 09:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by telkanuru

Card someone for the former, and you prolly won't ref anything important ever, and be laughed at in the street by homeless beggars who smell of wee.

Such a way with words!

Welted 24/7 · 12-27-2007, 03:44 AM

Quote:

Something I don't understand as a relatively new epee fencer

Well, there's your first problem.

Quote:

, and certainly new to competition around saberist, is all of the yelling in saber. It seems like after every touch the combatants yell their heads off, make huge gestures and other wise try to convince the director they have right of way.

As a sabre fencer who DOES yell, I'd like to think more highly of my ref's competence than to think what I'm doing has any effect on what he calls. If they're visibly altering their judgement because I yell, then I'm probably not going to be happy with most of the rest of their calls anyway.

dekko · 12-27-2007, 11:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by telkanuru

It's important to differentiate here between "yelling loudly" and "yelling at another fencer". The latter is definitely grounds for an unsportsmanlike card. Card someone for the former, and you prolly won't ref anything important ever, and be laughed at in the street by homeless beggars who smell of wee.

I am pretty sure I know the difference.

telkanuru · 12-27-2007, 12:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dekko

I am pretty sure I know the difference.

I never said you didn't; your post, however, was sufficiently vague for me to feel the need to clarify for the benefit of others.

dekko · 12-27-2007, 02:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by telkanuru

I never said you didn't; your post, however, was sufficiently vague for me to feel the need to clarify for the benefit of others.

Actually my post wasn't vague at all, and trust, it's not my first rodeo, I do know the difference.

Don Badowski · 12-27-2007, 03:17 PM

Effective way for the ref or fencer to get the yelling to stop. After the ear busting, walk up to them and say "Excuse me, what did you say?" No explanation they can possibly give will sound reasonable, especially if you tell them you don't understand, and could you clarify that. If they do it again, ask again. Before you know it, they'll be so ticked off at you for constantly asking, they will stop just so they don't have to deal with you.

"There is no emoticon for what I'm feeling" - Comic Book Guy