Maybe a dumb question but........

[cjhutch]

I am actually the mom of a fencer who wants very much to make an Olympic team one day (I sure a lot of people have that particular dream) and he is starting to make the national tournaments. He went to JOs last year and did pretty well (for his first national tournament, that is). Anyway, I want to give him as much support as I can and I am wondering how most people afford to make all these tournaments!!?? He wants to make at least one NAC, JOs, and of course Nationals this year. We just got a credit card that assigns 20,000 travel miles every year and a free $50 companion ticket (we will also try to use it to make most of our household bills and then just pay the credit card off every month-at least that is the plan) so we accrue more miles so that will help but what else? Is everyone out there just better off than us, or are there any suggestions or secrets strategies that you all use to afford all of these trips?? I would LOVE any and all suggestions or tips that you may have picked up over the years.

[kmak_577]

well me (being the fencer) went out and got a job in the evenings, to pay for some of the competitons myself, other than that there maybe some kind of local scheme for talented local athletes, worth looking into. Other thanthat I cant think of anything, but if you can Iam sure thew parents would love to know !!!

Regards KamK_577

[Allen Evans]

Making a National team requires a huge commitment of family resources. This can be alleviated somewhat by learning to travel cheap. There are plenty of websites that let you look for cheap airfares if you're willing to spend some time on line. Sign up for all the airline travel programs you can.

With hotels, don't necessarily default to THS (the hotel broker for the USFA). I've found cheaper rates in the same hotel by using Triple A, for instance. Sometimes there is a cheaper hotel as close or closer to the venue. Again, online research and hotel web sites can be helpful there.

AE

[sleepyweasle]

I don't know how old your fencer is but one way we've been able to cut down a bit on expenses is to have our fencer travel to some comps with a friend and share a room with them - last year with a friend and a parent (we alternated being the chaparone) - this year to National Comps just with a friend. We couldn't afford to keep paying for everything either (although it breaks my heart not to go with her and be there for her). And, for international comps, we still make sure there is a parent involved.

[whtouche]

Likewise unsure how old your son is, but one way to make national tournaments much more affordable is to start refereeing. If you referee you can have most of your travel expenses to a NAC paid for, likewise for nationals, depending on how many days of the tournament you are willing to ref.

[Got_Fenced_In]

Just reading....


It's the same problem for my family, though. I have one younger brother who fences, and two brothers that don't. My dad works, so it's usually my mother driving/flying us to these things. But it's so hard on her (one upset fencer is enough, much less two fencers, and two more small children) and really expensive to fly all of us, as well as pay the fees for the tournaments. So, we're generally confined to tournaments near us, unfortunately.

Although, I will probably be making nationals this year.

[lefty_monster]

Here are my suggestions:

Travel with teammates/friends. Share a room and eat at cheap restaurants.

I got a job because my parents can't pay for all these tournaments. I guess it's also teaching me to be financially responsible, so it counts as a valuable life lesson.

BOOK STUFF EARLY!!! Look at the schedule months in advance and get airfare immediately. Ditto for hotels.

Go to tournaments with multiple events for you. And try to go to the tournaments that are best for you. Listen to coach- if he tells you to fence div2/3, then try to make it to those and not kill yourself in a junior event.

[Fencing Mom]

Why don't you post this in the parent's corner?

[JMcC]

Originally Posted by lefty_monster

BOOK STUFF EARLY!!! Look at the schedule months in advance and get airfare immediately. Ditto for hotels.

While you can book hotels months in advance, you can't really book airline flights that early* because the USFA doesn't announce event days until later in the year/season.

*Unless you're either willing to pay the premium price for cancelable flights or the costs of staying extra days at hotels; neither of which will keep costs down.

[cjhutch]

I am still pretty new to this forum and didn't see the Parent's Corner! Thanks for mentioning it-I will post there as well. BTW-just turned 17.

[lefty_monster]

Originally Posted by JMcC

While you can book hotels months in advance, you can't really book airline flights that early* because the USFA doesn't announce event days until later in the year/season.

*Unless you're either willing to pay the premium price for cancelable flights or the costs of staying extra days at hotels; neither of which will keep costs down.

well, the USFA's new policy of putting things out early has really helped. True, you can't book it 6 months in advance, but booking Richmond 2 months in advance helped more than booking Tucson 3 weeks in advance.

I'll amend that statement: Make plans early and don't procrastinate.

[D+F+P=Hadouken!]

1. Kid needs to get a job. I've got one, lotsa other teens have one, its a sign of dedication and maturity for your son to be employed.

2. Get into this greyhound bus thing. I took it to Richmond last year, the roundtrip was $110. It saved some cash.

3. Its cheaper if your son travels alone. I know its hard on parents (It was hard on mine atleast), but it builds maturity and independance

4. When in rome, shop at a grocery store, like the other romans do. Its cheaper than eating at a restaraunt.

5. Room with a buddy fencer and split the costs of the hotel.


Unless you're obscenely rich or feel like spoiling your kid, make him do some of the work to support himself through his dream. If he isn't willing to sacrifice some comfort, then its not really a dream, its just him riding your mastercard.

[MHS Fencer]

Second mortgage?

Firstly, make sure you're not Penny-wise, pound-foolish.

Secondly, most of this has been said before, but, echoing:

If he's 17 and is just starting national tournaments and wants to make the Olympics some day he's got to get a lot of experience as quickly as possible, which means hitting up pretty much every strong tournament within 200 miles + national ones. You can hope he gets into a school that will pay for his fencing and that will give him lots of financial aid - not from a fencing scholarship, which are far and few between and basically never full - from general school policies - some elite universities offer significant amounts of aid to even relatively comfortable families.

In terms of travel, go for the cheapest comfortable option, which usually means flying when it's farther than ~400 miles - don't take Amtrak halfway across the country because it's cheap 'cause you won't get enough rest on the train and the whole thing won't have been worthwhile.

Find a less expensive hotel (I got mine in Tuscon last April for ~$40 a night), but make sure that you're not going to some seedy dump where the live music is going to play until 2am (just being seedy's fine, assuming the doors have locks).

For food hit up a local grocery store instead of eating out - if you have a hotel with a kitchen that's great. Likewise, never pay for food at the venue.

You know it, but miles miles miles - don't waste them when you can get a ticket for ~$150 - use them when the price is $300 or more (at least that used to be my rule a several years ago).

Equipment-wise get high quality stuff that is less likely to break (assuming he's fencing at a higher level, which I hope he is at this point). I recently broke my last blade from '99 and still use several from 2002 - each one has hundreds of hours of being used.

Jobs are great if he has time to work it into his schedule, but if the short term gain from working is offset by his not getting into his school of choice/one that will help him out best, clearly it's a bad investment. If he can get something around the club to help defray lesson costs that's great - running footwork classes for the coach - fixing other peoples' equipment, if you're good at it, can be a very efficient way for a high school kid to earn money.

Most important thing - as competitive as he gets, make sure he continues to love the sport, which may mean some down time every now and then. You've got to protect the investment.

[JMcC]

Originally Posted by cjhutch

BTW-just turned 17.

At the risk of being a wet blanket; if he's 17, and only in his second year of competitive fencing, he has an incredibly late start to try and to catch up with the other boys who are already on the road to a future Olympic team.

You don't say what his weapon is, but if you take a look at the USFA Senior rolling points lists, and note the birth years of the the points winners, you'll see how many 1990 and younger boys are already up there (well over half for foil). All those boys have been competing for years and years; some for over a decade.

Just thought that fact should be addressed. Good luck!

[fatfencer]

BUT!!! Begin with the end in mind. Work your plan based on successful Olympians/international competitors and see what they have, what they've done and how they do it. At 17 he's a tough road ahead of him. As much as you want to get him to that Olympic podium consider that coaching expenses can be tough to shoulder for a typical middle class family. If you don't have the money and he's starting his Olympic aspirations relatively late then perhaps you should just focus on getting him to the finals on a consistent basis FIRST. Then when thats accomplished then maybe look at the Olympics.

1) Does he have a coach who has had past students compete on a national and INTERNATIONAL basis? Kids like Ariel DeSmet and others are a good example. I don't know what it costs to have Mike Marx fly out to these things but it cannot be inexpensive. It is nigh unto impossible to make it to the upper echelons of fencing without a supremely talented coach to guide your son and the family thru what to expect.

2) Does he really love this ? The sacrifices are just as Olympic in proportion as the glory.

3) Are you willing to, at the expense of other family members, help him obtain his goals?

IF any of these is no then please be realistic. Get him to succeed on the national level first.

Having said the above, here's a few tips to help out.

1)Once tournaments get posted for the year, decide in advance which ones to go to and book them. Make fencing a priority.

2) forget the job thing. It's the most retarded thing I've ever heard. There's only 24 hours in a day. The average 17 year old sleeps for 9-10 of those hours. The rest is school and homework. When will he have time to train fencing as it is?

3)BUY BULK. He's 17 and not likely to be growing much. Whatever weapon he fences buy all necesary fencing items in bulk. Buy a couple of masks and uniforms and as many blades as you can afford. Buying all at once saves you loads of money if you negotiate correctly. If you ever encounter a vendor who will not negotiate with you on this level then do not frequent them. If you've come here to ask for advice for how to get your son to the olympics and for help on affording the process then, reasonably speaking we can assume your son is dedicated enough to spend the money on one large purchase. Don't be afraid to shop around alot and call overseas too. I'd buy 20 blades at once. I have done.

4) learn how to ref. You're going to be at the tournaments anyways and he doesn't need his mommy handing him his water bottle. This will save beaucoup bucks on your traveling expenses.... though at this age he really should travel alone or with friends. If he can't fly by himself then certainly the Olympic podium is farther away then we'd all like. Incidentally... HE should learn how to ref. He needs to become an expert in this sport. YOU just need to whip out the Visa when its appropriate.

5) start a non profit org to benefit your local area fencers. Get fellow parents like yourself involved and share the load. Go around to local businesses and sell your dream to them and get them to sponsor your kid. Make sure to thank them periodically throughout the year and at year's end send them a nice letter dictating your son's successes as a direct result of their generosity.

Just some thoughts,

Fatfencer

[HDG]

Originally Posted by fatfencer

The sacrifices are just as Olympic in proportion as the glory.

Beautifully said.

[Applesauce and Foils]

Encourage him. There'll be plenty of times when he doubts himself and it really helps to know you have someone wanting you to suceed. In fact, send him my encouragement! I'm in the same boat.

[cjhutch]

1) Does he have a coach who has had past students compete on a national and INTERNATIONAL basis? Kids like Ariel DeSmet and others are a good example. I don't know what it costs to have Mike Marx fly out to these things but it cannot be inexpensive. It is nigh unto impossible to make it to the upper echelons of fencing without a supremely talented coach to guide your son and the family thru what to expect.

2) Does he really love this ? The sacrifices are just as Olympic in proportion as the glory.

3) Are you willing to, at the expense of other family members, help him obtain his goals?

Thanks, FatFencer. Actually he is training at Northwest Fencing where Ariel trains so I guess we will find out how expensive Michael really is.

He loves to fence-lives to do it. I think he would sleep at the fencing center if I let him.

I am willing to do whatever I have to to help him obtain his goals. He refs at the club but we do not get a lot of opportunities to certify as refs here. I think that is a great idea for me to learn how to ref. He fences foil and so far I have trouble following the action because the blade work is so fast. Practice makes perfect-I hope??!!? I will see if I can talk my husband into it as well.

Correct me if I am wrong but isn't fencing one of the sports where the athletes compete longer than say gymnastics where the athlete is over-the-hill at 23 or 24? I think Michael was in his mid 30s at his last Olympics (Atlanta) so although my son wants to shoot for 2012, he also knows that 2016 may be more realistic at which time he will be about 25 years old. That should still be plenty young enough to qualify, shouldn't it??

[oiuyt]

Originally Posted by JMcC

the USFA doesn't announce event days until later in the year/season.

What are you talking about?

I can tell right now that I'll be fencing D1MS on Saturday at the National Championships. 6 months from now.

The only national event this season without event days announced is San Jose.

-B

[fatfencer]

I know you. You are indeed in good hands. Mike is a fine coach and i learned alot at the camp I attended. Had a blast too!! Again, fencing is expensive. I don't know what his fees are but this is his living so necessarily he MUST charge for his time. That said you are definitely getting your money's worth. He has a wonderful conception of fencing and he loves kids.

Make sure you are comfortable with setting solid, attainable goals though.

Now that we've all established the idea that the money is being well spent, we should focus on getting more bang out of your buck.

Like I said. Buy in bulk!!! I do. I typically buy blades for much less than most people because I do this. Also masks and uniforms too. I try to make the purchase as big as possible so that the vendors compete for it.

Befriend an airline attendant or something and barter for standby flights. I've done that so that I could buy more stuff. I flew standby to Atlanta for Summer Nats round trip. WOW that saved me money. Same with the camp, I flew for free. Helps to do loans for airline staff(mortgage guy). I do loans in your area btw(shameless plug...)

Also, if your son gets really good the equipment thing will take care of itself. Many companies will sponsor; one of the asst. coaches at NWFC is a LeonPaul sponsored fencer.

You have many good resources. I take all of my whey protein and other supplements with me when I travel and buy food locally and prepare it myself. That saves at least $200.00 or so on me going out.

You can travel on a tight budget. Make sure you have some fun on the way though. This can be a wonderful experience for your son.

Best of Luck,

Fatfencer

PS: your son has plenty of time. Podzniakov is 35 years old and is unstoppable in saber. One thing for sure though. Fencing is fun but don't let him neglect school. School equals salary if you know what I mean. Fencers are cosmopolitan, usually, and so that means a fine education in all things including, of course, fencing.

Finally, remember that fencing is a sport and it helps to be an amazing athlete. Lots of cardio and moderate weights, good nutrition, and lots of sleep make for a great mix.