Alergic to Lame

[SSMSabreMN]

Earlier this summer I finally bought my own equipment after deciding to fence outside of my school's program... and purchased a Leon Paul Ladie's Sabre Lame (the first one on this page: here) And then I didn't fence with it much until a camp I attended for a week and a tournament that followed that weekend, by that sunday the back of my non-weapon hand was covered in bumps simmilar to hives I guess... and I hadn't noticed much and ended up scratching some nasty scars into my hand. I have a known allergy to nickel but I didn't think that was used in lames... not that I'd know... so I'm wondering if there is traces on nickel on the sleeve that would cause me to react that way... or if I'm growing allergic to another metal that I should know about.

Any information you might have on the subject would be greatly appreciated... spending a good deal on money on my equipment to become allergic to it didn't make my parents too happy.

[erooMynohtnA]

Yes, nickel is commonly found in lames. Just a guess, but I imagine a forum search for "nickel" would turn up only posts mentioning lames and maraging steel.

I think even the new lightweights contain nickel, but the chemical structure may be such that you won't react. I would suggest a stainless steel lame other than that.

Edit: I thought LP's lames were made of inox steel, which I guess may not be the same as stainless. My guess is the alloy to keep it from rusting is nickel, but one of the Paul brothers would know better than me. I would hope it wouldn't leach out, but I guess nickel forms a passivation layer over the steel to keep it from oxidizing, and you're reacting to that.

[SSMSabreMN]

Thanks... but for some reason I thought I had read on a post here somewhere the difference between getting a cheaper Absolute lame and the Leon Paul lame was that Absolute used copper and Leon Paul used stainless steel... so I guess I assumed there wasn't any nickel. Hmm... I'll have to look into some form of glove for my off hand to protect it in the future...

Thanks.

[erooMynohtnA]

Originally Posted by SSMSabreMN

Thanks... but for some reason I thought I had read on a post here somewhere the difference between getting a cheaper Absolute lame and the Leon Paul lame was that Absolute used copper and Leon Paul used stainless steel... so I guess I assumed there wasn't any nickel. Hmm... I'll have to look into some form of glove for my off hand to protect it in the future...

Thanks.

There is a difference between inox lames and cheapo Chinese types. While the inox lames are steel alloyed with something, the cheapo ones are just nickel and copper. I think you would be having even greater problems with a cheap lame.

Perhaps the new lightweights are worth looking into, even though they're a pretty hefty investment.

[fencerbill]

Are Infinity Lames available again? I understood that the conductivity of the fibres was based on silver. If so that might sidestep your nickel problem.

[the ancient one]

Inox is just the term used in Europe for Stainless Steel.

Stainless steel is stainless by virtue of the high Chromium content, and although they contain nickel the surface is predominantly chromium provided that the material has been "passivated". Passivation is a chemical treatment of the stainless to bring chromium to the surface and block the oxidation processes that result in rust. This chromium film can heal itself when damaged. A lot of SS used in medical applications is passivated with citric acid, in contrast to more common nitric acid passivation.

Salt solutions (Sweat for example) can block the passivation or re-passivation of the stainless steel. This might increase the nickel exposure.

I really don't know what stainless alloy is used to make "inox lames" there are a lot of possible SS alloys that could be used, and I don't know if there is a passivation step applied during the manufacture. The copper lames can be silver plated or possibly nickel over copper. I bet the Paul brothers could be helpful here.

Nickel allergy can be a really serious problem. If all else fails, switch to epee.

[CvilleFencer]

The INOX/Stainless issue has been well covered by others. One thing to think about are the light weight lames. The better ones are silver bonded onto a nylon or other fiber, and from what I understand are much more friendly to people with nickel allergies. The Leon Paul Ultralight is a silver impregnated lame and one of the better ones. IIRC the FWF, Infinity and TCA lightweight lames are as well. I am not sure about the Absolute lightweights as they are a bit different, so you would want to call and check on those with someone at AF if they don't post in this thread.

[Zilverzmurfen]

I think you're allergic to sabre. It's a known problem with no cure...

[I_luv_saber]

PBT's white Inox lame has no nickel...

[alexsmom]

The bumps appeared only on one hand? I think you need more investigation. Your lame may also touch your neck and even your fencing hand. You could be allergic to almost anything. (When you put it on I assume you used both hands....) You said you were at a fencing camp....anything new there? It is suspicious that the bumps only showed up on one hand. I think a little more investigation would help. Good luck. (And never even consider switching to epee....too boring... ;-)

[Sinestra]

I personally have very strong nickel allergies as well, so I did a lot of research regarding good foil lames that don't contain nickel. (I had a France Lames lame that left huge rashes on my neck, so I pretty much had to find a new one.)
I ended up with one of the Leon Paul foil lames, and I have to say, I haven't had any issues with it producing a rash at all...although I haven't tried using one of those for sabre at all, so I can't vouch for it. I do think, though, that if the metal content of the lame itself were the issue, that you'd experience some more problems than just on your hand...have you used the lame again since then, and have you had the same reaction? It could very well be some other factor that's causing this, but you'd probably want to hear it from a sabreur before from me

[bobb121]

I am also allergic to nickel. This can occur if you don't wash your lame on a regular basis. Also the light weight lames tend to be silver based. Either go with the LP, or TCA. You shouldn't get a rash on your weapon arm, only your neck and nonweapon arm. If your off hand is the issue, just where a glove on both hands, else goto a light weight version.

How this helps

[Army Fencer]

Originally Posted by Zilverzmurfen

I think you're allergic to sabre. It's a known problem with no cure...

...except epee...

[KD5MDK]

Originally Posted by Zilverzmurfen

I think you're allergic to sabre. It's a known problem with no cure...

Till death do us part.