Nasty habit

[Carlos37]

I have a nasty habit of sometimes using the wrist or shoulder when I make a touch(or try to) and it causes the blade to bend upside down instead of bending upwards which is the usual and normal way of bending.Do you guys know any tips or tricks to help me get rid of this habit?
Thanks

[Inquartata]

Switch to sabre?

[KD5MDK]

Don't use your wrist.

[lemon__fresh]

many repititions of the correct action

visualize(in your mind) doing the action correctly

understand what exactly your doing wrong and and try to do it right

RELAX

[Craig]

Do you guys know any tips or tricks to help me get rid of this habit?
Thanks

Get with your coach and do drills to ingrain the proper technique as well as distance for those actions.

Also - focus on doing the actions correctly and slow before moving to speed them up.

Craig

[RITFencing]

Relax is always good advice...

I would also make sure that you have a nice, loose grip on the weapon, practice moving it with only your fingers, and when you score a touch, press up with the index finger lightly. That will cause the point to set and the blade to bend properly.

[Eejit]

Yeah, I have the same problem, but I'm working on fixing it. Currently I'm working with my coach in drills to perform skills properly as well as spending a few minutes each day visualizing my entire repertoire. Also individual drills against a fixed target (on a wall or a dummy) have helped. Finally, on the strip I tend to exacerbate the habit by tightening up my shoulder during an extension. This creates torsion that actually drops my hand while my fingers automatically move the blade to keep my point on target causing the blade to naturally bend downwards. Fixing that is just a matter of going into a practice bout and forcing yourself by willpower to execute simple actions and forcing good technique on yourself.

Or at least that's what my coach tells me... I'm still pretty new to fencing, but the habit is in a definite decline with me.

[seven6ty]

Most likely, you're dropping your hand as you hit. If you make sure to hit with your hand up a bit high, and then elevate it as you hit, the blade should bend naturally. If you hit with your hand low, and drop it further, this will often cause your blade to bend the wrong way. So yeah, just work on keeping your hand up high, and raising it as you hit.

[Durando]

Do you guys know any tips or tricks to help me get rid of this habit?

No tricks really. Someone already mentioned working against a practice dummy or a wall plastron. It needs to be emphasized again. Your hand should rise with the pressure of your extension. I would do the following ad naseum until you get it:

1. Simple extension against the wall plastron. While maintaining contact approach the wall as close as you can. Your hand will rise high and to the right (if you're right handed). See how close you can get. Retreat back to extension distance while maintaining contact with the plastron.

2. Extend with an advance against the plastron.

3. Lunge to the plastron.

After you have a feel for this and can execute a change in tempo in your footwork...

4. Advance lunge to the plastron.

I still do these simple drills before bouting or taking a lesson. It is surprising what a positive effect it has on my fencing. I don't think you can do enough lunges. Boring, but effective.

[dridge]

I have a nasty habit of sometimes using the wrist or shoulder when I make a touch(or try to) and it causes the blade to bend upside down instead of bending upwards which is the usual and normal way of bending.Do you guys know any tips or tricks to help me get rid of this habit?
Thanks

As noted above, there are no "tricks."

Many fencers have a tendency to "lean forward" at the end of the lunge, rather than keeping the torso upright. This drops the shoulder. "Reaching" with the shoulder at the end of the lunge (trying to lengthen one's action) has a similar effect. These drop the arm and hand.

An unfavorable bending of the blade is only one of the untoward side effects.

I would try to keep the torso upright.

Drew

[piste off]

Relax is always good advice...

I would also make sure that you have a nice, loose grip on the weapon, practice moving it with only your fingers, and when you score a touch, press up with the index finger lightly. That will cause the point to set and the blade to bend properly.

Your knowledge extends beyond good BBQ joints...

Speaking of joints, most people underestimate the value of the fingers and THUMB in creating the right bend on the blade at the end of the action.

In addition to pressing up with the index finger, the thumb should push forward and down (think squeezing). This will help ensure the blade bends in the proper way, although the rest of your technique will have to be improved as the others suggest.

I was taught that the first place on your glove to wear through should be the tip of the thumb (Csiszar), and that may be a good indication if you are using it.

Rick

[crquack]

Finally, on the strip I tend to exacerbate the habit by tightening up my shoulder during an extension.

After fencing almost three years I have finally got a lesson from a first-class coach (national level). He took apart my basics something shocking. One of the faults is as you describe. His comments were (among others) "hit with your point, not your shoulder".

I have been playing with it at home and it seems that I have been losing at least 2 inches in reach, if not 4, through this faulty technique.

If you make sure to hit with your hand up a bit high, and then elevate it as you hit, the blade should bend naturally.

The same coach castigated me for lifting the hand while striking. I noticed that some of his very successful pupils do it, too, but I must have been doing it to extreme. The result: no protection from the guard (I am talking epee), hits in opposition much more difficult.

If I hit the way he instructed me, the blade seems to bend the right way.

[theLuz]

I have a nasty habit of sometimes using the wrist or shoulder when I make a touch(or try to) and it causes the blade to bend upside down instead of bending upwards which is the usual and normal way of bending.Do you guys know any tips or tricks to help me get rid of this habit?
Thanks

I can give you a really simple answer that is VERY difficult to do. Just relax and reach with your lung. As others have told you, you are probably being tense and off balance when you try to hit. If your torso is vertical, you reach with your legs, your shoulder is relaxed, you will not only not bend the blade down, you will be in position to parry and reposte a couter-attack.

You should also not try to hit the target, but try to go through the target and hit the back. This is a mind set, and can come with lessons, but is not intuitive.

[Allen Evans]

You should also not try to hit the target, but try to go through the target and hit the back.

Yikes!

[Inquartata]

reach with your lung.

Yes, I can imagine that that is REALLY difficult!

[ysbadadden]

Turning your wrist -- that is, pronating it, turning your hand so the knuckles are up -- will produce a touch with the blade bent sideways. There is nothing wrong with this, if you are doing it under the right circumtances! On the other hand, if you hit with your arm/hand dropping, you will produce the dreaded upside-down hit. What's wrong with this? Only that it's a sign that you hit before you reached your full extension; that is, that your distance was wrong from the start, or that you will not achieve your maximum distance in future attacks.

I like the extension to start with the elbow pushing forward -- you can check this by sitting at a table and extending so that your elbow slides forward along the table as long as it can (and only then lifts -- and lifts farther after you contact the target. And when you lunge, you shouldn't be lungeing downward, but forward and a little bit up. (The little bit is to compensate for the fact that your body drops. Don't overdo it.)

While there's nothing wrong with turning the hand over (pronating),l it's only really useful for hits to the flank, and the like. So practice against the wall or a target -- not turning the hand, pushing the elbow forward, lungeing out and a little bit up.

[theLuz]

Yes, I can imagine that that is REALLY difficult!

it seems I've had a vowel movement.............

[Durando]

You should also not try to hit the target, but try to go through the target and hit the back. This is a mind set, and can come with lessons, but is not intuitive.

I respectfully, though strongly, disagree. A touch in fencing depends on supreme control of distance. Just enough distance, no more no less. If you train yourself to hit "through" a target you also risk training yourself to be consistently too close. Which will lead to all kinds of tactical, technical, and pedagogical problems later. (This is the biggest difference I remark between mid-level European epee fencers and Americans.) Learn your distances until they are intuitive, cf. my previous post.

[contre-Sixte]

You should also not try to hit the target, but try to go through the target and hit the back...

hmm. This approach will make feints and disengages nearly impossible. You'll always be too close.

[Peach]

Safety note: If you hit with the blade bending upwards, you run the risk of sliding under the bib and into the neck. If you do this and hit through your target, you pretty much guarantee hitting the neck. I prefer to keep my arteries intact.