07-09-2007, 06:18 PM
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#1 | | Armorer
Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Long Beach, CA / Las Vegas
Posts: 3,514
| New FIE rulebook
The new FIE rulebook is out. Being an Armorer I am most interested in the changes in the Material section, but since others might want to comment on the other sections, I thought this would be best in the Fencing Section.
There are 3 major changes and one minor in the Material section. First they change M-5 to get rid of those screwless points as well as the Zip-Tip. There was a point where Epee tips were homologated. I am thinking the Schermasport screwless was out then and maybe it was homologated. The trouble is has anyone seen a list which shows what tips were homologated. That doesn’t help Foil. Then there is M.45. You can now use over-the-air transmissions ‘as long as they are approved by SEMI.’ Next comes the part everyone forgets, the Appendix. There is a new long introduction, which mostly talks about what needs to be homologated. They now add piste to the list. It also warns manufacturers not to start manufacturing FIE masks until they get their certificate. Blue Gauntlet was selling FIE Visor masks last year without a certification. The last minor is machines must have clocks and scores.
__________________
Donald Hollis Clinton, Jr. DHCJr@juno.com
To Teach is to Learn (Japanese Proverb)
Knowing the rule book by heart means nothing, if you don't understand the rules.
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|  | | And now for this message... |
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07-09-2007, 07:51 PM
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#2 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 531
| I know Scott from Swordmaster and the infamous Estoc tips has a letter from the FIE stating such I would assume anyone else would as well.
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07-09-2007, 08:07 PM
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#3 | | Moderator
Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 10,177
| Infamous Estoc tips? I haven't seen any problems with them... | 
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07-09-2007, 08:20 PM
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#4 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 531
| Infamous as in good...as in good enough for me to carry...as in good enough I have a new BF with one on it to play with....but the ability to use them in Worlds was an issue...I asked...got an answer Im happy with..and I expect Ill be just as happy with the tips..
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07-09-2007, 09:14 PM
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#5 | | Scrub
Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Miami
Posts: 2,578
| Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick Shellhouse  Infamous as in good...as in good enough for me to carry...as in good enough I have a new BF with one on it to play with....but the ability to use them in Worlds was an issue...I asked...got an answer Im happy with..and I expect Ill be just as happy with the tips..
R | Infamous never means good. | |
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07-09-2007, 10:54 PM
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#6 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Pacoima, ca USA
Posts: 5,991
| *sigh* So does the book have ANY sort of explanation as to HOW Dos Santos will determine which tips he'll homolugate...any sort of evaluation protocols....or should the manufacturers just get him laid the night before submitting their tips??
Could we PLEASE get Dan as the SEMI chair???? We'd start seeing some common sense....
or Carl Oberg....THAT would be fun to watch!! | |
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07-09-2007, 11:36 PM
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#7 | | Moderator
Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 10,177
| I do believe you've covered it... | |
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07-09-2007, 11:51 PM
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#8 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: near Boston
Posts: 3,308
| What do you mean, new rule book is out? Where? What language?
__________________
It is now after July 4th. My avatar with the Xmas hat is no longer late.
It is now officially early.
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07-10-2007, 03:20 AM
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#9 | | Armorer
Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Long Beach, CA / Las Vegas
Posts: 3,514
| It should be all 3 languages. Technical and Organization are dated June 2007 and Material is dated May 2007. The French is on the FIE web site. http://www.fie.ch/Fencing/Rules.aspx
The English on the British Web Site. http://www.britishfencing.com/Britis...asp?PageID=183
The Spanish web site has not been updated. I have never been able to get the whole rulebook on the Spanish web site.
__________________
Donald Hollis Clinton, Jr. DHCJr@juno.com
To Teach is to Learn (Japanese Proverb)
Knowing the rule book by heart means nothing, if you don't understand the rules.
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07-10-2007, 03:46 AM
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#10 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Pacoima, ca USA
Posts: 5,991
| Now all we need is the American translation...and HOPEFULLY a note that they will NOT be enforcing this stupid tip ruling at US events.
('course if they DI enforce it that'll mean a lot of rewire fees for me, but that's not the point) | |
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07-10-2007, 09:24 AM
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#11 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: near Boston
Posts: 3,308
| Quote:
Originally Posted by DHCJr | But we enforce the USFA rule book which, as we know, includes several variations from the FIE rule book.
__________________
It is now after July 4th. My avatar with the Xmas hat is no longer late.
It is now officially early.
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07-10-2007, 01:57 PM
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#12 | | Armorer
Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Long Beach, CA / Las Vegas
Posts: 3,514
| Quote:
Originally Posted by fencerbill But we enforce the USFA rule book which, as we know, includes several variations from the FIE rule book. | Yes, but if you look at the title of the thread it says New FIE rulebook and this forum is not just for USFA members. We have fencers from all around the world so this is of interest to them. Also it should be of interest to you since you have gone in the past and I expect you will go in the future to the Veteran's Worlds http://www.fie.ch/download/rules/en/...s%20Sydney.pdf and those rules will apply to you.
It should also be of interest to USFA members. Yes the USFA sometimes makes exception to FIE rules in the USFA rulebook, which I expect out in a couple of months. Will they make exception in this case, I don't know. But this is a warning to USFA members. If they want an exception in this case then they should contact the USFA and the FOC and make their opinions heard. They should not put their head in the sand.
__________________
Donald Hollis Clinton, Jr. DHCJr@juno.com
To Teach is to Learn (Japanese Proverb)
Knowing the rule book by heart means nothing, if you don't understand the rules.
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07-10-2007, 04:06 PM
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#13 | | Super Shoebie
Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: VA
Posts: 1,083
| Is there a serious chance that zip-tips will be outlawed in the US? | |
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07-10-2007, 04:08 PM
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#14 | | The Judge
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 4,324
| Quote:
Originally Posted by chefencer Is there a serious chance that zip-tips will be outlawed in the US? | it kind of sounds like it, and if its true, that sucks for the zip guys and for everyone in general.
stifling innovation FTB | |
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07-10-2007, 04:09 PM
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#15 | | Armorer
Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Long Beach, CA / Las Vegas
Posts: 3,514
| Quote:
Originally Posted by chefencer Is there a serious chance that zip-tips will be outlawed in the US? | If the USFA adopts the FIE rules without modification, yes! If noone says anything then most likely they will.
__________________
Donald Hollis Clinton, Jr. DHCJr@juno.com
To Teach is to Learn (Japanese Proverb)
Knowing the rule book by heart means nothing, if you don't understand the rules.
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07-10-2007, 05:12 PM
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#16 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: Charlotte, NC
Posts: 799
| Quote:
Originally Posted by DHCJr If the USFA adopts the FIE rules without modification, yes! If noone says anything then most likely they will. | Oh wait, no they don't. Can't quote chapter and verse but sabre cuffs are different for US events and international events. Many armourers have 'allowed' my cuff even though it does not comform to USFA rules but does to international rules. There are modificitions, here is at least one. | |
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07-10-2007, 08:20 PM
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#17 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: near Boston
Posts: 3,308
| Quote:
Originally Posted by noodle it kind of sounds like it, and if its true, that sucks for the zip guys and for everyone in general.
stifling innovation FTB | Which is just why the USFA could choose to ignore bans on zip tips and screwless tips which have become popular, so I understand from threads on f.net.
International fencers and, yes, Veterans going to Vets Worlds would have to do without them. I suspect the French and Italian screwless tips will become acceptable within 2 years, ziptips maybe never.
The Sabre cuff situation is more like the FIE adopting the more stringent, and in my opinion hardly justifiable, USFA position.
__________________
It is now after July 4th. My avatar with the Xmas hat is no longer late.
It is now officially early.
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07-10-2007, 10:28 PM
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#18 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Pacoima, ca USA
Posts: 5,991
| I've already sent an email to USFA...speaking as both an armorer and a vendor (even though the ban does not affect the tips I sell), asking that the NOT implement this ruling in the US. | |
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07-11-2007, 02:00 AM
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#19 | | Scrub
Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Miami
Posts: 2,578
| At what level does the USFA make these kinds of decisions? | |
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07-11-2007, 02:41 AM
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#20 | | Moderator
Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 10,177
| Changes to the rules are voted on by the Board of Directors, in general. | |
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