Gaza in chaos....again

[Slim]

Anyone else find this a bit ironic?

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satelli...cle%2FShowFull

[jeff]

The looting has been widely covered in press, but I didn't see that particular account. As the article notes, the house has been empty since 2001 (I think Mrs. Arafat lives in Paris in comfortable financial circumstances).

But yeah, it's ironic all right.

[introspective]

I find it very distressing. The Palestinians were given that tract of land after Arafat passed by Sharon himself and it should stay in their hands. But it will be very difficult to hold onto that position politically.

I myself have been just swamped under with feedback from Isralie quarters and specifically from a person who is very clever, and devious who spends her entire time running around with her Talmud, and screaming about her Shabot, when in fact is just a mentally ill drunk.

But personality aside, perhaps the land should remain in their hands if only to keep the war over there.

What are we defending. After 911 it was clear that we were saying that we were defending a 'way of life', but some of the ways in which people live their lives give me pause. And I am talking about America. When I look at these imbeciles running around buying garbage and watching their so-called science fiction on television I could just get sick. People here are simply watching others vomit on television for entertainment and we are sending young American men overseas to defend this crap.

[Inquartata]

But no, the Palestinians are not a naturally fractious, quarrelsome people, as I averred to Pigeonmeister.

[introspective]

No they're not. There is no such thing as an entire group of people who are "naturally fractious, quarrelsome people". It's almost as stupid as saying that all Italians are Jolly, or all Germans are Haughty, and all Englishmen are Snotty; or all Chinese are Intellegent; those kinds of sweeping assumptions should have been laid to rest by now and if not, it's high time it were.

[Inquartata]

Yeah. Poor misunderstood suicide bombers.

[Have At You]

No they're not. There is no such thing as an entire group of people who are "naturally fractious, quarrelsome people".

Well, perhaps it's just a matter of local geography -- perhaps only the members of that group who are living in that particular situation wind up acting so bizarrely.

Fortunately, we can compare the Palestinians who persist in living under those conditions with the hordes of Palestinians who fled the violence of their countrymen and the retribution of the Israelis, welcomed with open arms by the wealthy Arab countries that constantly cry out for justice for the Palestinians...

What? You mean the Arab countries don't allow the downtrodden Palestinians to flee to their lands? Wow. If I was a cynic, I might think it's more useful for them to have the Palestinian situation to focus the ire of their people away from the depredations and hardships caused by their own corrupt and useless governments.

Good thing I'm not cynical! Because obviously those Arab countries give tons of humanitarian aid, infrastructure support and political assistance to the Palestinians. Especially those countries that are just rolling in oil wealth, who would benefit greatly from peace and stability in the region....

What? You mean the Arab countries give little more than token assistance, apart from the funding of the violent factions and terrorist organizations? Really?

Wow. Good thing I'm not cynical. I might have more to say on that, if I were.

[Inquartata]

Well, Lebanon for one has accepted a large number of Palestinian refugees, and they all live in peace and harmony in Leb---oh, no, wait...

And as I recall they were no trouble at all in Jordan, back in the---er, no, wait...

[Wingate85]

Well, Lebanon for one has accepted a large number of Palestinian refugees, and they all live in peace and harmony in Leb---oh, no, wait...

And as I recall they were no trouble at all in Jordan, back in the---er, no, wait...

Well said.

[introspective]

It wasn't started there; actually my belief is that the whole nineleven thing started in Afgan. But neither here nor there; I strongly believe that once the Palestinians have a secure home base, either absorbed by another friendy family group in the middleast or elsewhere, we'll be several steps closer to peace in the middle east.

[Inquartata]

Not if the militia that the Palestinians themselves elected as their government has anything to say about it...unless that homeland is built on the grave of Israel.

In other deveopments:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070620/...l_palestinians

Palestinians trying to flee the internecine violence in Gaza by entering Israel. Imagine, going to the wicked Zionist oppressors for help instead of to your own noble, peaceful Hamas leaders!

"Defense Minister Ehud Barak instructed officials to let in "humanitarian cases," according to the announcement. That apparently meant people needing urgent medical treatment."

Ask yourself what would happen if the situation were reversed, if there was fighting in Israel and Israelis tried to flee to Gaza for medical treatment. What sort of treatment would Hamas accord them, do you think? Would it be imprisonment as hostages, hanging, defenestration or just quick bullets in the heads?

[introspective]

Different foils for different folks. We gotta fence together......

But seriously folks, please let's not get into a snit about 'the graves' of this place or 'the dusty undersoil' of that place. Look, they have walls, we have fences, nothing seems to work very well anymore. But then, how could anyone critize the US for a fence, when they all have walls.

Israel, I am fond of those people, but I have to say, and admit to myself, that those other people deserve some respect too. You know, for a long time no-one in America knew from Jews. It was after the war, and then we all got to know those people and learned so much from them. We learned about Henny Youngman, all of the stuff they rekindled in NY after WWII when they regained their strength after being nearly wiped out. Anyway, the point very well may be....

Let's bring the Palestinians here to America and get them to assimilate with us and we can learn their stuff. Or is that too insane!!!

[Teme]

Ask yourself what would happen if the situation were reversed, if there was fighting in Israel and Israelis tried to flee to Gaza for medical treatment.

They'd be repatriated to Brooklyn?

[introspective]

You're right, that is exactly the place we should resettle those people. There's a pretty big population of people from the middle-east there. Do you think it would create like tensions and gangtype of warfares? We don't want it. We want them to come here and teach us their receipes and so forth. But then, the Italians and Irish were always at it in Brooklyn. Maybe if we construct something nice for them first, so they wouldn't have to SCHLEP around looking for housing??? In 50 years we'll be making nanbread with chickpeas while they yell "schlep the nan over here".

[Have At You]

Different foils for different folks. We gotta fence together......

But seriously folks, please let's not get into a snit about 'the graves' of this place or 'the dusty undersoil' of that place.

So if someone behaves in a clearly evil way, but they themselves feel that they're doing the right thing, then who are we to judge them?

By that reasoning, we must put up with almost all the evil that is ever done. Except for certain neurotics, nobody thinks they're the bad guy -- everyone's the hero of their own story. Stalin thought he was the good guy. Hitler thought he was the good guy. Vlad the Impaler thought he was the good guy. Pol Pot thought he was the good guy. The Palestinian terrorists think they're the good guys. But just because they think they're justified, that doesn't make it so.

I'm really tired of all the ethical relativism I hear from people who ought to know better. It smacks of racist elitism, if you ask me. "How can we expect those people to live up to our standards," they seem to be saying, "they're not as good as we are, after all."

I, for one, prefer to hold every adult accountable to the same standards. One does not purposely target the innocent for horrible death and suffering, just to make a political point or consolidate one's power or change someone's behavior. Why should we hold ourselves to that standard, but not the middle eastern peoples?

[introspective]

ironic.....I don't know what could possibly be considered Ironic. I find it horrible. Those people were invited to relocate back into Gaza by Israel, and now their 'hosts' are bombing them. It's genocide all over again. I can't tell you how sorry I feel for those people. They must be kidding us with their little Red Sea stunt. They've been blowing up those kids and old ladies for so long no one can stand to see it anymore. Everytime we see what's happening to the Palestinian people, we see little kids getting carried off to a hospital.

I am concerned that Bush is not trying to bring about some kind of solution. It's like, if we aren't 'friends' with Israel, then something happens to Russia, when we want Russia to move closer to the US, then it means we practically have to sever ties with the Palestinians. It's a form of political blackmail to keep the USSR and USA from establishing good relationships without Israel, and again, Israel merely wants control of the Gaza for the coastline.

For years though what is has done is create a situation where if the Palestinians receive too much pressure, Libya and Seria will put pressure on the west. It's a pattern we've seen over and over again. Time to change our stipes. What would be the best solution?

Anyone have an idea?

[jeff]

Yes. Please be quiet.

[Wingate85]

I second that.

Yes. Please be quiet.

[introspective]

Jeff, for a person who has terminal constant talking disease, you should talk - as they say. Jeff some of your posts are literally three or four pages long and I have always courteously read each and every word. While I may disagree with some of your words, I will fight for your right to say them.

[jeff]

Your problem isn't length, it's incoherent babbling unrelated to reality, which squashes any meaningful conversation. Of course you have a right to post, but we'd be better off if you didn't. I must go look up "ignore" feature.