leon paul GT tip help needed

[Blackbird]

hi ^__^;; i kno... im a sabre fencer posting a thread on foil tips, but its on behalf of Dunar, who's compy is misbahaving at the moment
he just got a new leon paul GT tip but it won't compress. he says it goes down fine when the spring is out, but as soon as the spring goes in it wont budge. he tried two different springs, and, seeing as he normally takes care of his own equipment, it can be assumed he's not screwing up putting it together
so, any ideas as to wat may be going on and how to fix it?
^_^ thanks

[KD5MDK]

1) Fix his computer enough he can post this in the Armory.

2) Is the spring made out of rock? Does it depress when it's been inserted but not screwed in? Has he tried using a different spring?

[erooMynohtnA]

Is this epee or foil?

Either way, I've had this problem with weapons I have wired with the contact cup not pushed all the way down the barrel. This is especially a problem in foil when the old cup is underneath the new one.

Rewire it and do it right this time is my answer.

[Craig]

Originally Posted by erooMynohtnA

contact cup not pushed all the way down the barrel.

Check to see how deep the cup is set. If there isn't enough room for the spring, then that's your problem.

Anthony hit on the most likely culprit for this - forgetting to get the old plastic/nylon insulating cup out of the barrel before starting the rewire.

Craig

PS - Moving to the armory where this belongs.

[Dunar]

Hi, I found a working computer.

As stated in the origional post, it is a foil tip. The tip will go in all the way without the spring so it won't be anything getting in the way of that, with the spring it can only depress to a little less than where it would be if it was screwed in so I can't even get the screws in. I think I made sure the old cup was out before rewiring but I suppose its possible this was still in. Thanks for the replies everyone (and thanks for moving this to the armory Craig ).

[jjefferies]

Originally Posted by Dunar

Hi, I found a working computer.

As stated in the origional post, it is a foil tip. The tip will go in all the way without the spring so it won't be anything getting in the way of that, with the spring it can only depress to a little less than where it would be if it was screwed in so I can't even get the screws in. I think I made sure the old cup was out before rewiring but I suppose its possible this was still in. Thanks for the replies everyone (and thanks for moving this to the armory Craig ).

I can't speak authoritatively about foil, but if you rewired the blade there are some wire/contact combinations that have a secondary plastic ring at the base of the contact. This sometimes gets left behind when you re-wire the blade. I've observed this primarily in epee's. Only solution is to take the whole thing apart and check to see if there is ANYTHING under the plastic contact mount. Usually I took them out by hand using a drill bit slowly twisting it with the fingers down to bite into the plastic and then withdrawing.

You can check to see if this is the problem by measuring how deep your contact is and then comparing to another working blade. Just use an electric drill bit capable of just fitting into the barrel.

Luck
J.

[HDG]

Originally Posted by jjefferies

I can't speak authoritatively about foil, but if you rewired the blade there are some wire/contact combinations that have a secondary plastic ring at the base of the contact. This sometimes gets left behind when you re-wire the blade. I've observed this primarily in epee's.

I don't think anyone uses a system like this for foil tips.

[LeonPaulUSA]

Just out of curiosity, is this point mounted on a BF blade??

Bill

[Dunar]

Originally Posted by jjefferies

I can't speak authoritatively about foil, but if you rewired the blade there are some wire/contact combinations that have a secondary plastic ring at the base of the contact.

No plastic ring on the contact.

Originally Posted by LeonPaulUSA

Just out of curiosity, is this point mounted on a BF blade??

Bill

No, the point is on a Vniti foil blade. I can't afford a BF

[pokey]

I've mounted the GT point on my Vniti foil and my BF Blue foil (yeah, wishy-washy I know). They both worked out fine, although now with Bill's question I'm curious what the potential issue is with the BF blades.

Are you using a point setter, or otherwise sure that the cup is seated deep enough in the barrel?

[Purple Fencer]

Here's a thought...is the threaded tip of the blade overly long? If the inside of the LP barrel is anything lie a Sport 7, the base hole may be wide enough for a long tip to project through, pushing the cup higher.

it may FEEL like it's set properly because it no longer moves down, but it could be seating high enough for the tip to move freely with no spring....but with the spring...no room to compress...

Just a thought....happens with the StMs sometimes.

[Joe biebel]

As "Purple" said, the tip may be screwed on too far, past where it is supposed to stop, puhing the plastic cup toward the the tip causing your lack of clearance.

Also, as others have stated, the plastic cup may not be seated properly or it is on top of an old part.

You can check the depth with a screwdriver, if you have another point (working properly) to compare to. Take out the tip and spring, insert the screwdriver to the the contact and measure or make a mark wher the driver exits the barrel and compare the depth to a good point. If the cup/contact is ahead of where it belongs, first try to seat it properly. You may get lucky. If you can not force it to the correct depth, you will have to start over.

There is one other thing I can think of to check before you go and rewire the point. Look inside with a flashlight and examine the cup to see that there is no deformation or debris blocking the spring from seating in the cup.

[Purple Fencer]

Originally Posted by Joe biebel

As "Purple" said, the tip may be screwed on too far, past where it is supposed to stop, puhing the plastic cup toward the the tip causing your lack of clearance.

Thanks, Joe....I was just guessing there. I;ve never seen an LP barrel, so I don;t know if it WOULD allow the tip to project too far...on the Germsn you can;t do that because of the design.

[Dunar]

I didn't see any debris on the contact and I tried using my point setter from LP to see if the cup or contact could go down any further, which didn't work (and broke the point setter which was brand new ) I don't know if the threaded tip could be screwed on too far into the tip to cause this problem (any insight into this Bill?). It seems I will just have to rewire it and make sure everything works properly before I put the tip back on the blade.

[erooMynohtnA]

I bet anything that it's the nylon cup, and the bottom came out when you rewired it. When it happend to me it looked like the barrel was clear, but there was a nylon ring sitting in the base of the barrel. It was very hard to see, let alone get out.

If this wasn't a rewire job, I don't know what the problem could be.

[Joe biebel]

Originally Posted by Purple Fencer

Thanks, Joe....I was just guessing there. I;ve never seen an LP barrel, so I don;t know if it WOULD allow the tip to project too far...on the Germsn you can;t do that because of the design.

I don't know that the design is any different really from the German as far as stopping the blade threads from progressing past where they should stop. Most of the times I've seen this happen, it is poor geometry on the blade at the tip. Too much taper right at the end can allow the for screwing the point on too deeply. At any rate, it does appear after the most recent posts that a "redo" is in order. It would be good if Dunar would report what he finds as the culprit to improve our knowledge base.

It should be noted that even a part of a cup, most commonly the cylindrical portion does nor always come out. I say good chance of cup remaider and good cahnce of over screwing (never thought those two words would be said together by me) the barrel.

[Purple Fencer]

Originally Posted by Joe biebel

good chance of over screwing ...

Sounds like a personal problem....there's medication for that, y'know... :P