Fencing.Net - Your Guide to Fencing & Fencing Equipment

purpleorc · 02-04-2007, 02:07 AM

Hi guys,
I am trying to decide between these 2 blades for my first FIE Foil. So I turn to you guys for help. I'd like to know what the main differences between these blades are.
From what I have gathered in the Forum the Vniti blade is on the stiff and sorta heavy side, but I haven't found much info on the BF Gold.

So far I've been fencing with regular StM's at my club, if that helps out on describing my preference so far. I have also tried a Paul France Blade, but it was a bit whippy for my taste (loved how light it was though).

I know its silly but i kinda like the gold color or the blue color :-P My favorite blade was an STM blue hehehe.

I think I posted this in the wrong forum. I meant for it to be posted on the Armory forum. If I screwed it up, sorry

Thanks in Advance

erooMynohtnA · 02-04-2007, 02:28 AM

Why do you want the BF gold? Since you say you don't have much information on it, it sounds like you just like the color. You seem to have looked at FIE blades and you're leaning Vniti, you just want a reason to pick a gold blade.

If you're basing your decision on color, just go with the Vniti. Color wears off quickly.

That being said, if you want a lighter blade, Vniti is probably not the blade for you. You can get stiff or flexible Vnitis, but they all have an appreciable heft. They also have a reputation for extreme durability.

I've never used a BF gold, but if what "everyone" says about BF stiffness ratings is true, the gold falls between the stiffer whites and whippier blues. It will probably be lighter than a Vniti, but the amount of flex could be greater or smaller.

UnorthodoxEpeeist · 02-04-2007, 12:57 PM

I love vniti blades, but that's just my opinion.

purpleorc · 02-04-2007, 02:21 PM

Hi Eroo,
First Thanks for your reply. I do like the gold color, but the main reason I want to compare the blades is that I'm between the durability of th Vniti (which seems to be its main plus) or a BF blade which also seem to be very favored among fencers on these forums.
However I just seem to find just bits and pieces about BF blades. Everyone likes them but I still don't know the reason for it

Thanks for your input also Unorthodox.

keropie · 02-04-2007, 04:42 PM

I currently have two BFs (both white), six Vnitis (both of two older generations of Vnitis), one Lammet, and a Mr. Chen FIE. I like them all for different reasons, but I tell everyone who asks that the Vniti is the best buy out of all of those. It's a bit heavier, but it still feels fine, and it's a bit cheaper, and it lasts forever. I've broken two Vnitis so far, and two BFs. Of course, I've had 12 Vnitis (lost a couple) and four BFs, so one seems to break more than the other.

erooMynohtnA · 02-04-2007, 06:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by keropie

I currently have two BFs (both white), six Vnitis (both of two older generations of Vnitis), one Lammet, and a Mr. Chen FIE. I like them all for different reasons, but I tell everyone who asks that the Vniti is the best buy out of all of those. It's a bit heavier, but it still feels fine, and it's a bit cheaper, and it lasts forever. I've broken two Vnitis so far, and two BFs. Of course, I've had 12 Vnitis (lost a couple) and four BFs, so one seems to break more than the other.

What's the Mr. Chen like?

In response to purpleorc, you're probably best off getting a Vniti. You'll learn to like it.

mrbiggs · 02-04-2007, 06:45 PM

Vnitis are not stiff by any means.

UnorthodoxEpeeist · 02-04-2007, 08:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrbiggs

Vnitis are not stiff by any means.

I sort of agree with that. Many people think vnitis are stiff, but they're not that stiff. I actually use my vnitis to flick people.

If you really want to go weapon shopping, buy a couple of extra-flexible blades and some extra-stiff blades, in case you want to go offensive or defensive during yours bouts.

But again, that's how I think and how I shop for my weapons. It's your judgment!

erooMynohtnA · 02-04-2007, 09:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UnorthodoxEpeeist

I sort of agree with that. Many people think vnitis are stiff, but they're not that stiff. I actually use my vnitis to flick people.

If you really want to go weapon shopping, buy a couple of extra-flexible blades and some extra-stiff blades, in case you want to go offensive or defensive during yours bouts.

But again, that's how I think and how I shop for my weapons. It's your judgment!

Are you talking epee or foil?

There are stiff Vnitis. The new Vniti "Max" foil blade is stiff blade.

I think changing weapons midbout to alter your defence or offence leads to poor fencing.

keropie · 02-04-2007, 10:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by erooMynohtnA

What's the Mr. Chen like?

In response to purpleorc, you're probably best off getting a Vniti. You'll learn to like it.

The Mr. Chen feels pretty good. It's fairly light and not too whippy/stiff. Feels more or less like a BF, which is the goal I suppose. I can't really comment on it's longevity, but the overall workmanship isn't quite as good as the BF. Well, it's really not even all that close, but it's still a good blade. If I ever really start competing again, the three blades I'll likely be choosing from are the Absolute FIE, the Mr. Chen FIE, and the Vniti. I can't see justifying the cost of the BF vs. the other three.

erooMynohtnA · 02-04-2007, 10:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by keropie

The Mr. Chen feels pretty good. It's fairly light and not too whippy/stiff. Feels more or less like a BF, which is the goal I suppose. I can't really comment on it's longevity, but the overall workmanship isn't quite as good as the BF. Well, it's really not even all that close, but it's still a good blade. If I ever really start competing again, the three blades I'll likely be choosing from are the Absolute FIE, the Mr. Chen FIE, and the Vniti. I can't see justifying the cost of the BF vs. the other three.

I don't recommend the Absolute. My friend has had two of them for about three months of light fencing (4-5 hours a week, maybe), and one of them has already taken a severe kink.

erooMynohtnA · 02-04-2007, 11:00 PM

I forgot to say this in the initial post: Vniti is a forge, so it doesn't really matter whether you get the LP Vniti or the Fencing.net Vniti, the Fencing Post Vniti, or the Blade Fencing Vniti. It all comes from the same place. The vendors may enforce stricter quality control, but it's all the same manufacturer.

I got a Vniti max from fdn, and I like it. I would recommend it to you, but I haven't tried a BF gold. Honestly, I haven't played with that many BFs, but the few I've tried I like less than my Vniti.

rudd · 02-05-2007, 10:22 AM

I've used Vniti's almost exclusively over the last two years.

Pros.
Price.
Durability.
Consistency.
Stiffness*

Cons
Looks.
Weight.
Feel*
Few if any top level fencers use them.

*may be a pro or con depending on your taste

They are a little heavier that the average BF. In fact I fenced for about 2 weeks with a backup BF while my other weapons were "sick". I really noticed the weight when I changed back. The are also usually on the stiff side, but after a few weeks of use soften out. The feel of individuals blades seems to vary less than other maraging, but I could just be lucky or insensitive.

I buy them from Paul because they are supplied with GT tips. I changed over from German points after the usual issues with dented barrels and grubscrews. Although I notice there are the new German barrels with counter sunk screws.

***Craig*** · 02-05-2007, 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rudd

I buy them from Paul because they are supplied with GT tips. I changed over from German points after the usual issues with dented barrels and grubscrews. Although I notice there are the new German barrels with counter sunk screws.

Fencing.Net offers Leon Paul points as an option on all wired foil blades. (In fact, the LP standard points are our default points and you can upgrade to the FWF german point or the LP GT.)

Cheers,
Craig

penguin_2000 · 02-05-2007, 11:56 AM

The newer Vniti's are pretty light and not as durable as the older ones... so don't bank on the durability, necessarily.

Where, exactly, are you finding BF Gold blades? I've heard of All-star gold, but they are made by S+M.

erooMynohtnA · 02-05-2007, 12:14 PM

http://www.leonpaul.com/acatalog/Sho...ectric_25.html

AdamH · 02-05-2007, 02:28 PM

I think I know where you are coming from regarding your like for the StM blue. Mine have been stiff, reasonably light and can take some real punishment while still straightning out nicely.

The nearest FIE blade I've found that matches the characteristics of the StM blue is a 'stiff' BF blue. It does 'work in' a curve better than the StM but still manages to remain stiff for those of us that like our point under simple control.

The StM has a slight downside in that if used for counterattacking/remising, even though the inevitable kinks can be made to disappear before your very eyes, it will break eventually (yes, really). The BF has more of a life in it, but I'm still torn between paying for more StM blues vs. paying more for enduring BF blues.

Certainly I would recommend you have a play with a blade before you pay your cashmoney.

edit: regarding the BF blue, unlike the StM where if/when it kinks this may be fixed immediately; if a BF takes a kink early in its life, it will keep it forever. My first one was glued and screwed and went straight into someone for a stophit and took a kink 1/3 from the forte. Since then, have been taking the precaution of buying bare blades and working a blade-long curve into them, then wiring. This is not necessary with the StM blue but has added greatly to the BF.

edit2: for the sake of being concise, please make sure and read this thread: BF FIE foils especially the Paul's reply about blade colouring and what this means!

purpleorc · 02-05-2007, 05:29 PM

Thanks a lot for all the replies guys. They really help a lot. I think In the end I am leaning towards the Vniti blade as a personal preference. They both sound like great blades for different reasons.
In th end, at least to me, point control is all that matters. I don't do good with whippy blades like the LP france, so I think a stiffer blade really helps out. Plus I am a big fencer so the extra weight shouldn't prove too much of a problem (I hope)

I have a confusion about the Vniti blade's color. In FdN it seems the blade is gold but on the LP site it appears as a white blade. Any ideas as to why? I'd assume they come in both white and gold, but i could be mistaken.

edit: Thanks for the link Adam. Its good to have reassurance from vendors that blades don't differ by their color. It is important to me to make an informed decision about what blade I am getting and why I am getting them.

erooMynohtnA · 02-05-2007, 05:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by purpleorc

Thanks a lot for all the replies guys. They really help a lot. I think In the end I am leaning towards the Vniti blade as a personal preference. They both sound like great blades for different reasons.
In th end, at least to me, point control is all that matters. I don't do good with whippy blades like the LP france, so I think a stiffer blade really helps out. Plus I am a big fencer so the extra weight shouldn't prove too much of a problem (I hope)

I have a confusion about the Vniti blade's color. In FdN it seems the blade is gold but on the LP site it appears as a white blade. Any ideas as to why? I'd assume they come in both white and gold, but i could be mistaken.

edit: Thanks for the link Adam. Its good to have reassurance from vendors that blades don't differ by their color. It is important to me to make an informed decision about what blade I am getting and why I am getting them.

I believe the LP site shows a parkerized blade that is a black/dark grey.

I've seen Vnitis with the gold/brown and the black/dark grey. I don't know, but I'd guess that Vniti just changed their finish and one color is more recent than the other.