Aluminum/titanium guards

[erooMynohtnA]

I have a few questions regarding Vniti foil and epee guards (and the knockoffs):

1. Are they really an alloy of aluminum and titanium? I've heard them called titanium guards, and I've heard that described as mistaken. Is it aluminum, titanium, or an alloy? If an alloy, what's the ratio or other alloying compounds?

2. Are the blade/f.net imitation guards as good as the Vniti guards or are they at least comparable?

3. Vniti guards are pretty awesome. Why don't they do saber guards (or blades for that matter)?

[Alex_Paul]

1 There is a SMALL ammount of titanium in the alloy. But it is really small and they are incredibly tough regardless of the titanium content.

2 No Idea I am afraid. I have to say that I have not seen a one piece pressed guard as good as the Viniti before.

3 It is to do with the way they are pressed out in one piece. Sabre guards are usually made with several operations and this is not possible with Viniti's manufacturing tecnique. They do make blades http://www.leonpaulusa.com/fencing/a...ectric_22.html they aren't much to look at but they are very durable.

[erooMynohtnA]

Originally Posted by Alex_Paul

1 There is a SMALL ammount of titanium in the alloy. But it is really small and they are incredibly tough regardless of the titanium content.

2 No Idea I am afraid. I have to say that I have not seen a one piece pressed guard as good as the Viniti before.

3 It is to do with the way they are pressed out in one piece. Sabre guards are usually made with several operations and this is not possible with Viniti's manufacturing tecnique. They do make blades http://www.leonpaulusa.com/fencing/a...ectric_22.html they aren't much to look at but they are very durable.

Thanks so much. That pretty much cleared everything up. I know Vniti makes epee and foil blades, but I was wondering why they don't make saber blades given the durability of their foil and epee blades. I should have clarified.

[Alex_Paul]

They have an odd production method that is not very flexible. The main part of the blade is rolled out and then welded on to the tang section about 3-4 inches from the shoulder where the guard sits.

[magic_moose]

2. Are the blade/f.net imitation guards as good as the Vniti guards or are they at least comparable?

I've been playing with the new f.net lightweight guard for a couple of weeks now. I don’t have a Viniti guard to compare it to, but so far it is every bit as tough as my German-made Allstar lightweight foil guard (which looks like it’s going to last forever).

It is very light. The hole is not too large, so it provides an excellent fit (with a touch of filing) on a Viniti blade. It does not dent on really hard hits. Its overall strength seems excellent, no sign of deformation. It only seems to scrape slightly, no gouges or real scratches at all.

It is a great guard, I like it a lot. I’ll know about resistance to edge “chewing” in another few months.

[WhipLash]

i have a leonpaul lightweight foil guard (aluminium). lasted me about 1 tourney... came out of it dinged, scratched, and with a nice foil-tip-size dent at the side. On the other hand, my 1-piece allstar lightweight guard (aluminium-titanium) survived with juz a few scratches.
conclusion: leonpaul guards are the lightest i know (they have the weight at Leon Paul Sword Fencing Equipment. Premier Fencing Equipment delivered direct worldwide.) but appear to be less durable than allstar / vniti guards.

[Craig]

Originally Posted by erooMynohtnA

2. Are the blade/f.net imitation guards as good as the Vniti guards or are they at least comparable?

The one-piece guard that we have out now has been receiving good initial reviews. It's only been out on the market for less than a month, so I'm eagerly awaiting feedback from my testers.

Overall - I'm impressed with it. The weight is great (in at 37 grams) and it looks like it will take a good beating.

Time will tell how they compare in the broad range of guards, but we're shooting to have it be as good as the vniti for durability.

Craig

[shlepzig]

I have only one complaint about the Vniti.

Due to my own abuse, and poor housekeeping, I experienced the "Humidity event".

Long story made short (even though it is breathtakingly clever) hot sweaty gear, was left in a hot car, on a hot humid day in NJ, in a hard shell golf bag for an extended period of time.

Hard shell bags seal surprisingly well.

I found a slew of popped wires, fuzzy aluminum parts, and corroded tips.

After making necessary repairs (and vowing to drill a series of large holes in my bag) the vniti guards have been plagued by frequent lights in the bell tests.

I have gone over these many times with a scotchbrite, and other abrasives, which has given the guards an attractive somewhat burnished look. Even when looking very polished, I can get a repeatable light in one spot or another of the "Humidity event" guards. A quick brush with the glove or arm dispells the light indicating it is just light corrosion.

Nonetheless very unusual, the persistence of the corrosion might be a factor of the particular alloying of the Vniti, as my one remaining aluminum guards did not have such a problem after scotchbriting (which has been since discarded for a new Vniti, which does not have the issue.).

I very much like the Vniti guards, but have this single report of an issue after extraordinary corrosion.

Shlep.

[DHCJr]

Do these 'humidity' guards have a strengthener? If so, have you tested them with an Ohmmeter for the resistance between the strengthener and the rest of the guard. The residual resistance may be inside.

[shlepzig]

Originally Posted by DHCJr

Do these 'humidity' guards have a strengthener? If so, have you tested them with an Ohmmeter for the resistance between the strengthener and the rest of the guard. The residual resistance may be inside.

There is no strengthener, these are the Vniti one piece guards. They do have a somewhat raised section in the middle of the formed piece, but it still a contiguous piece of metal. I have not done any ohm testing of the system (far too sensible).

To complete the repairs necessary to get all the weapons working again, they were all completely disassembled, blades were acetoned and the guards abraded insdie and out to remove all fuzzies. Then everything re-wired and re-assembled.

With that line of thought, I could check the sockets for issues, since I only reassembled the sockets and did not check for corrosion on the socket side of the socket-guard connection. Though the (apprently) chromed surface of the LP sockets seems to be pretty corrosion proof. I did have to re-comboobulate another socket because of corrosion on the inside of the C line socket connectors.

On second thought, since the wiping of the guard fixes the problem, I would still be inclined to say it is some particularly tenacious corrosion sitting on the surface. Perhaps our materials engineer would know something about the aprticulars of this alloy, and if that is a possibility.

On third thought, with all "intermittent" issues it is probably the confluence of several things happening at once (the alignement of the planets and all). That the overall resistance between the guard (and it's fleck of oxidation" and some corrosion of the socket (either the base or within the connector) and perhaps even corrosion in the wire, or even on the tip of my opponents epee, that would cause it to suddenly be repeatable, then dissappear again for a few weeks.

Shlep.