Fencingclub physical features

[Joe biebel]

I am working with some "developers" in the Milwaukee area whose kids take fencing lessons from me to find a really appropriate yet inexpensive place to lease for a fencing club. What advice would you have on the physical layout. I have a list of physical features that I have as a good starting point, but I'd like to know what forum members consider important to them and also to prospective "customers" like parents and children.

Also, How important do you feel location, parking, amenities are, etc?

[noodle]

"good" features from my standpoint generally tend to translate into "expensive", or "additional cost".

[restlesscheese]

Here's what I can think of off the top of my head:

-Is in a 'good' part of town (i.e. not in the middle of the red light district)
-has ample parking and ideally, somewhere for parents to drop off their kids without fearing for them getting run over. I suck at parking, so I always appreciate parking lots with large roads between the spaces.
-the place itself should have a bathroom. bathroom is good.
-has a watering hole/fountain for those that forget to bring water
-has a place for line drills that is big enough to keep people from stabbing each other in the back and prevent from being too cramped to bout safely
-has a secure place to store equipment rather than having to drag it back and forth (not a consumer issue, but definitely makes life easier)

[Asprin]

If your likely do do electric fencing, a good amount and location of power sockets.
A area for parents to sit while waiting for their kids.
A place for the kids to put their bags out of the way.

[daveappr]

An area to sererate the kids (students) from their parents

[Mergs]

Joe,

Would love to discuss this with you, I've got some information that I put together when I was thinking about doing the same thing. PM me if your interested.

[griffindm]

My club is in the process of such a move. We were located in a multi-purpose room of a community center for several years. We have outgrown the site, and are moving to a warehouse area not far away. As has already been mentioned, it is important to have to locale in a perceived "safe" part of town. Parking is only important as a detractor, i.e. no one will notice it unless it's missing. A locker room to store gear is nice, and also a revenue generator. With a kids program an important part of the mix, having an area for parents to watch without interferring with the action is important as well. Constructing a good fencing floor over existing hard surfaces can also be critical.

If you live in an area of relative affluence, providing more 'perks', as in Wifi for parents, showers, etc, is important, often more important than just price. People will generally pay more for the convenience.

Just my thoughts.

[edew]

Originally Posted by restlesscheese

Here's what I can think of off the top of my head:

-Is in a 'good' part of town (i.e. not in the middle of the red light district)
-has ample parking and ideally, somewhere for parents to drop off their kids without fearing for them getting run over. I suck at parking, so I always appreciate parking lots with large roads between the spaces.
-the place itself should have a bathroom. bathroom is good.
-has a watering hole/fountain for those that forget to bring water
-has a place for line drills that is big enough to keep people from stabbing each other in the back and prevent from being too cramped to bout safely
-has a secure place to store equipment rather than having to drag it back and forth (not a consumer issue, but definitely makes life easier)

If this is a legit project, the city won't allow putting a fencing club that has kids as customers in a red light district or without bathrooms (restrooms, that is). There's a requirement of enough restrooms for so many people and/or employees. Each area has its own ratio written into its zoning law. There's no need for a water fountain, and if you install a fridge with water bottles, you can sell bottles of water or gatorade.

Certainly you would need a reasonable amount of unobstructed space. For a space with genuine length of fencing strip, I would recommend 40' x 60' playing area as a minimum. Additional space for administrative and storage space would be needed. 40 x 60 is quite a good size and can accommodate 4 strips quite genuinely.

Don't have a secure space for storing other people's equipment. You shouldn't burden yourself with securing other people's stuff. Unless you have people who frequently walk to the club, most people will carry the fencing bag all the way from the car to the club. All of 30 steps or so. Also, stinky jackets and socks tend to bring out the gymness of the storage area. Better to require that people bring their things back and wash them.

[mlr2fence]

An added bonus for the parents is if the location is in an area where they can easily run errands--grocery store, mall, etc--while the kids are at practice.
Is it walking distance or on a bus route, either public or school where kids would have transportation after school and then parents would only have to arrange to pick them up? In other words, the easier/nicer it is for the parents the happier they will be, and since they pay the bills....

[clonardo]

If you can find an old bowling alley, the lanes can be pretty easily converted into strips. Lockers and changing rooms are also fairly necessary. Also, think of an area to be used for selling snacks at tournaments and such. Plan for an adequate seating area if you're planning on hosting anything big down the road.

[edew]

Are we talking about an ideal fencing salle or a realistic one with real constraints (costs, available dimensions, zoning laws, etc)?

[Allen Evans]

No matter what you build, or buy, or rent, have a plan for keeping it clean. I can't tell you the number of clubs I walk into that would be great spaces except for the fact that they've become the Sargasso Sea of broken weapons, cast off, dirty jackets, and dust bunnies of ferocious size.

Allen

[Phaeton]

Another important aspect of a fencing club is the flooring. Get bad floring such as the wretched linolium tiles that many rec gyms have or concrete and you're asking for health problems for your atheltes and a hard time sticking. The floor needs to be kept clean so people can have traction, nothing like slipping and falling while lunging.


The roof is also a concern in terms of the fact it needs to be high enough to fence in, even if you are extending straight up you should have a few inches of open space if not a foot or two.

Lighting can be a pain to redo, but it is also important, I've been to more than one venue where I can't see the sabre due to dark painted walls and dim lights.

[Joe biebel]

Originally Posted by Allen Evans

No matter what you build, or buy, or rent, have a plan for keeping it clean. I can't tell you the number of clubs I walk into that would be great spaces except for the fact that they've become the Sargasso Sea of broken weapons, cast off, dirty jackets, and dust bunnies of ferocious size.

Allen

Well then you'll love the club I build. Everything must be perfect, or better, and clean. I have a "Jones" about being clean and organized, a sickness perhaps. I am just not one of "those people" that works well in clutter or dirt.

We also need lots of light, room, and will decorate the place with all things fencing. One of the machines I have in my office (for pattern making) is an "E" size plotter that I print posters on. I have a program that allows me to take a photo and make a poster of any size.

W'ere looking primarily for a facility with a 12' or higher ceiling and a minimum of 20' X 20' beam placement (assuming we don't get a "clear span" space. Designing the space (virtually) in Autocad has given me a good idea of what dimensions will work the best for ideal strip placement.

I am hoping to have pods, in a large space that I can can grow into. The idea is to take connected consecutive spaces as time passes and membership grows. I want to start with at least 6 strips in two pods of approximately 30' X 60', plus office, bath, armory, changing and waiting areas.

[Phaeton]

Sounds expensive...

Make sure the paint is also not a warm color and is something that people are comfortable with. No one wants to be in a red room all day...

[pacer]

The club I fence at is located in a suburban businesss park. There is little retail in the immediate area,but things like mortgage offices, surveyor's office, a dance/drama studio. It;s the basic two or 3 story height limit, but mostly single story buildings. Close to the highway ( and exits) and basically in a middle to upper middle class area.
Parents are a short drive away from shopping, restaurants and also have a sitting area and small kitchen at the club. Members can rent a locker for the year (most siblings share one). The parking lot is well lit.
The neighborhood is safe and the club is kept clean. ( I agree that is something some clubs just over look.)
There is an area that is walled off by a half wall and half door. It was designed as the equipment store, but the first time there was a tournament at the club we pushed the racks back to the walls and the kids used it to stash their bags, and it left the sitting and open area clear of obstacles.

[Miglin]

Most clubs I see remind me of large warehouses; I was recently at a tournament at the Rising Stars Fencing Academy in Wayne, NJ, and I thought it was really neat how they had the club right in the middle of what is essentially the Willowbrook mall. It was cool to see people that were just sort of walking around the mall shopping stop what they were doing to watch the fencing for a little bit. I think it's great when a club finds a way to get fencing some more public exposure in this manner.

[Asprin]

My club uses a sports centre, which was built for the edinburgh commonwealth games (ages ago) and we actually use the cafe for our evening meetings but any tournamnets are normally held in the foyer bit. With the area cordoned off for us and people asking what we're doing. One person came up to me and asked did it hurt while others came up and asked what we were doing.

[qatet]

One thing to think about... If you're planning on running multiple classes at the same times, think about how you'll go about dividing up the space. The club I coach in has a rather square floor, which is great if you're running one large class, but makes it tough if you have two classes going, or open bouting and a class. I've spent some time in longer, skinnier clubs, which work much better for two concurrent classes.

[edew]

Originally Posted by Joe biebel

[...]
I am hoping to have pods, in a large space that I can can grow into. The idea is to take connected consecutive spaces as time passes and membership grows. I want to start with at least 6 strips in two pods of approximately 30' X 60', plus office, bath, armory, changing and waiting areas.

30x60 and 6 strips....kinda hard to do, isn't this? Or maybe you just don't have room for referees.