FIE Defines Fencing Master

[Mr Epee]

DHCjr dug this up in another thread, and I found it interesting.

In my experience, people get pretty emotional over the title of Fencing Master, but this statement cuts straight to the basic principle.

Originally Posted by FIE Statutes, Page 8

By fencing master is meant a person whose principal activity is the teaching of fencing in return for payment.

Interestingly, from Wikipedia

Originally Posted by Wikipedia

Maestro - a skilled, usually non-academic, instructor, as in Dance Master, Music Master, Fencing Master, Drawing Master, etc

Is there an organization that certifies people as Dance Master, Music Master, or Drawing Master? I really don't know.

[erooMynohtnA]

While it's not the question, one does have to become certified by a state board to become a master electrician.

[cmedalis]

Originally Posted by Mr Epee

Is there an organization that certifies people as Dance Master, Music Master, or Drawing Master? I really don't know.

Because I feel like goofing off at work:

DANCE MASTERS OF AMERICA
has been certifying and setting the standards in dance education since 1884. Since its inception, the goals of the organization have been to improve the standards of dance benefits offered to its members and their students.

DMA provides syllabi that are being utilized by universities, colleges, and dance institutions throughout the world. A continual update of the syllabi makes this tool a living instrument of learning.

And you can sure get a Masters' Degree in music or art (drawing).
Not sure if that qualifies you to teach, though...

[NNR]

My understanding has been that a "Fencing Master" is coach who has trained a fencer who has won a world championship on some level.

[Craig]

Originally Posted by NNR

My understanding has been that a "Fencing Master" is coach who has trained a fencer who has won a world championship on some level.

Nope. There are quite a number fencing masters who have a degree that have not won a world championship.

[chefencer]

Any body in a white jacket can call themselves a chef, but it doesn't mean they even know how to cook rice... The American Culinary Federation has a certification system graded from CC (certified culinarian) to CMC (certified master chef) and the standards are fairly rigorous, but ya know, it ain't like doctors or lawyers - you don't have to be a certified nothin' to make a livin'. As much as everyone in the industry would like to get away from the guys in Mel's Diner wearing t-shirts with their smokes rolled in the sleeve, those guys can call themselves Master Whatever they want as long as it doesn't infringe on copyright. The ACF is constantly touting the benefits of certification and within certain levels of the industry, it is helpful, but to the general public... Hahahahaha!

[Mr Epee]

Originally Posted by erooMynohtnA

While it's not the question, one does have to become certified by a state board to become a master electrician.

But it's a good point...

There are a number of craft organizations that still use the title Master in the same way that it was used by Adam Smith in the Wealth of Nations.

Traditionally, a Master was simply an independent business owner, an independent professional, or a independent skilled craftsman. Occasionally a Master would take on an Apprentice(s) who would work a period of 6-7 years*, before achieving their education. After sufficient training, the apprentice would go and set up his own firm, and eventually become a Master himself.

*Note: Roughly the same amount of time to complete a "Master's Degree" from modern universities.

[grotto]

most "maestro's" I know of have a certificate from a "school of fencing" and have been "accredited" by a review by the board of that particular school. Sure there are coaches even excellent coaches that are not accredited. but technically they are not maestros until peer review at some institution. Now I'm sure many have become self proclaimed maestros, or even popularily accepted maestros that don't have accreditation other than success.

[fencerbill]

There is an old saying that a Consultant is a man 50 miles from home with a briefcase.

The analogy might be that a fencing master is a person with a black plastron, black mask and an accent.

[El Chucko]

Originally Posted by NNR

My understanding has been that a "Fencing Master" is coach who has trained a fencer who has won a world championship on some level.

Originally Posted by Craig

Nope. There are quite a number fencing masters who have a degree that have not won a world championship.

I think that maybe he meant a coach that trained a particular athlete, and that athlete won a world championship.

I know that the USFCA requires that a Master coach a student to a certain level of success, but it is not as high as World Championship. As I recall, they want to see a student place either in the top of NCAA Champs or in the top of Summer Nationals.

[erooMynohtnA]

Originally Posted by El Chucko

I think that maybe he meant a coach that trained a particular athlete, and that athlete won a world championship.

I know that the USFCA requires that a Master coach a student to a certain level of success, but it is not as high as World Championship. As I recall, they want to see a student place either in the top of NCAA Champs or in the top of Summer Nationals.

"There are four basic requirements for Fencing Master Certification: 1) membership in the USFCA: 2) holding of the AAI/USFCA Prévôt level of certification: 3) demonstration of adequate knowledge and skills in the sport of fencing: 4) completion of an academic project showing knowledge and research in one specific area of fencing or a related topic"

[RITFencing]

Originally Posted by erooMynohtnA

"There are four basic requirements for Fencing Master Certification: 1) membership in the USFCA: 2) holding of the AAI/USFCA Prévôt level of certification: 3) demonstration of adequate knowledge and skills in the sport of fencing: 4) completion of an academic project showing knowledge and research in one specific area of fencing or a related topic"

Oddly, it mentions nothing of actual teaching skills... interesting.

[erooMynohtnA]

Originally Posted by RITFencing

Oddly, it mentions nothing of actual teaching skills... interesting.

Directly below the aforementioned excerpt it actually says

"Fencing Masters are expected to be able to give a challenging individual lesson to a fencer at a high national level, as well as be able to instruct novices in the fundamental skills. The Master should be able to give smooth and effective lessons that involve actions of advanced tactics, changes of distance, choice reaction, varied initiative and proper technique."

Although I still don't see where it says Coach Z's fencer Y has to place X at W tournament, though.

http://www.usfca.org/usfca/misc/HowT...cingMaster.doc

[RITFencing]

Originally Posted by erooMynohtnA

Directly below the aforementioned excerpt it actually says

"Fencing Masters are expected to be able to give a challenging individual lesson to a fencer at a high national level, as well as be able to instruct novices in the fundamental skills. The Master should be able to give smooth and effective lessons that involve actions of advanced tactics, changes of distance, choice reaction, varied initiative and proper technique.

Ok, that makes me much happier.

[Goldgar]

Originally Posted by El Chucko

I know that the USFCA requires that a Master coach a student to a certain level of success, but it is not as high as World Championship. As I recall, they want to see a student place either in the top of NCAA Champs or in the top of Summer Nationals.

You're mistaken about that. As someone else posted, a Master is expected to be able to give a national-level lesson, but there's no requirement of having a student actually place highly in national competition.

Dirk Goldgar
Secretary, USFCA