Pitfalls of mixed fencing: should girls and boys fence each other?

[southernsword]

deleted

[erooMynohtnA]

Originally Posted by southernsword

Would like to hear discussion about whether or not high level open fencing events should be open to boys and girls.

I recently witnessed one athlete who isn't particularly gifted who lost a bout and came away bragging that they had lost but inflicted injury on the athlete who had beaten them. This seemed terribly bad spirited and was further of concern since it was a mixed event. Is there no guidelines for mixed events or such unsportsmanlike behavior? It is the first time I have encountered someone in fencing who took more glory in injuring another athlete than in fencing well. There seems to be something perverted about that to me.
Is this common practice in the USA and other nations? I have always thought fencing was more civilized than the rioting we see in soccer events like the world cup currently going on.

Feedback?

I realize that most women are brutal fencers, and the men should be kept safe from them. However, if a man wants to fence in a mixed gender event, he should be allowed to do it at his own risk. He just has to wear a cup and say his prayers.

Say no to sexual descrimination.

[c3l2vantes]

Originally Posted by erooMynohtnA

I realize that most women are brutal fencers, and the men should be kept safe from them. However, if a man wants to fence in a mixed gender event, he should be allowed to do it at his own risk. He just has to wear a cup and say his prayers.

Say no to sexual descrimination.

i dont think anyone could of said it better

[keropie]

In case the point misses the OP, I don't see how the event that occurred has anything whatsoever to do with the fact that it was a mixed event. Nothing about separating genders would prevent its reoccurrence.

And why is it surprising that out of all the fencers in the state/country/world, some of them would be jerks? And the big difference between soccer and fencing in terms of rioting? Soccer has fans to riot: we don't.

[KD5MDK]

There are coaches and parents to make up for that.

[RITFencing]

Anthony, you are the man. I tried to rep you but it told me I have to wait.

You're right, too; viciousness is hardly gender specific, and in fact the only fencer I ever met who actually tries to hurt their opponents and scare them physically is a woman.

As far as mixed fencing? I say bring it on. But have a mixed, a men's, and a women's event instead of a mixed and a womens. Men deserve just as many chances to fence as women.

[Captain Hook]

I'm not sure what gender has to do with it, both sexes can be equally as mean and rough especially at competative levels.

in my personal experience it's more often the over competative females who deliver the corkingly hard shots lol

if someone's unsportmanlike it's an issue of personality

hmmm fencing hooligans... now there's a scary thought

[RITFencing]

And as a second point, the rules are good enough to ensure safety and good sportsmanship in mixed events so long as they are properly enforced and followed. To change it because of the gender of the participants is sexist and useless.

In the words of Justin Meehan: "It's an open competition."

[Redblade]

Only as long as they both take responsibility for protection before they start "fencing" together.

[jeff]

I've seen and refed lots of mixed boy/girl competitions, and have fenced in mixed adult competition without ever seeing anything that would make me want segregation.

If one fencer injured another (as opposed to baseless bragging to try to save face after losing), it should be handled by the relevant rules, regardless of gender. I assume there were some adults in the room who had the opportunity to take the jerky kid aside and give him a lecture about sportsmanship. Where were they, and why didn't they give the kid some guidance?

[I_luv_saber]

Originally Posted by RITFencing

As far as mixed fencing? I say bring it on. But have a mixed, a men's, and a women's event instead of a mixed and a womens. Men deserve just as many chances to fence as women.

Absolutely. I mean, really it doesn't matter to me directly, I'll fence anyone who wants to fence me... but having a mixed and women's even is pretty sexist. Why even have men's events???

[sabreur]

Jeff nails it.

Trying to hurt people is stupid, brutal, ignorant, etc.

It has no place in fencing, and ANY behavior that is designed to injure or hurt an opponent should be immediately rewarded with a black card.

And err on the side of protecting the innocent.

God, I hate this discussion.

MR

[D+F+P=Hadouken!]

I'm tired of being beaten up by girls.

[Cannibal Bob]

Whether girls and boys fence each other has nothing to do with the situation you stated. It has nothing to do with the sex of the fencers.

Also, a judgment cannot be made without knowing all of the facts. For example, I was fencing at a tournament recently when a touch to my shins drew blood and of course it hurt. After I won the bout, my opponent laughed and declared victory for drawing first blood. To a spectator that didn't know any better this could look like poor sportsmanship, but not to us since we are best friends and i took it in the manner it was given.

There is a big difference between joking after an accident and deliberately injuring a person and then laughing about it. The situation you describe fails to identify which was the case.

[Black Jeebus]

Originally Posted by southernsword

I have always thought fencing was more civilized than the rioting we see in soccer events like the world cup currently going on.

I'm curious as to what mixed gender competitions have to do with soccer riots? Are there leagues of feminist fencing hooligans at your tournaments, charging the piste anytime a woman gets a bad call?

Please note, I only said women cause feminist fencing hooligans is fun to say!

[fencingfrog]

Originally Posted by D+F+P=Hadouken!

I'm tired of being beaten up by girls.

you yellow bellied slimy cowardly spineless jellyfish!!! (you're not the only one...there are several guys at my club who are scared of me )

there should be mixed, mens and womens events for 2 main reasons:
1. 2 opportunities to fence!
2. if you don't want to fence the opposite gender, its your call, if you are scared ( ) then that's one less opponent for us brave, courages women!

i was actually part of a conversation yesterday about how guys dont necesarily fence better, but the action is just different. (we were at the pomme de terre, and could watch mens and womens events simultaneously, and the difference was pretty obvious.) during my high school team season, i was one of 2 girls on the team. therefore, i fenced mostly guys during practice. when i went to a competition, bam! all of the girls were fencing in a totally different style! it was a little wierd, but whatever. a mixed event is definitly the best option.

oh yeah, and at my club our events are mixed alot for lack of girls. but sometimes we just decide to do mixed to get more fencing in its more fun!

[D+F+P=Hadouken!]

There are just alot of girls in fencing who seem to get quite a kick out of stabbing male fencers twigs and berries.

Quit.

If you're gonna hit us there, you better well be willing to kiss it and make it better.

[ChrisBrasel]

Originally Posted by D+F+P=Hadouken!

There are just alot of girls in fencing who seem to get quite a kick out of stabbing male fencers twigs and berries.

Quit.

If you're gonna hit us there, you better well be willing to kiss it and make it better.

PWAHAHAHAHA

I move to have this instated as a Man Fencing Law.

[fencingfrog]

Originally Posted by D+F+P=Hadouken!

There are just alot of girls in fencing who seem to get quite a kick out of stabbing male fencers twigs and berries.

Quit.

If you're gonna hit us there, you better well be willing to kiss it and make it better.

we wear chest protectors. why don't you just wear a cup? it is target area, and obviously you are part of the majority of the population who have cruddy low parries. (ok, i can't do the 7 or 8 either )

and don't tell me guys don't hit each other there! i've seen it! so where's the bigger risk? someone who is a guy and hits you there, or someone who is a girl and hits you there? is there a difference?

hey, at least you can get revenge on a guy.

[dreamer90024]

I have to agree with what quite a few people are saying here. Unsportsmanlike conduct and mixed events are two seperate issues. If a fencer has this attitude, it is likely that it won't matter whether or not they're fencing in a mixed event or a non mixed one.
There are guidlines for unsportsmanlike behavior, but it is up tp the ref to enforce them. It is the quality of the referring, not the mixed or unmixed nature of the event that will determine that.

To answer your question, there are always people who are bad sports and who are, as you put it, uncivilized. That doesn't make the sport more or less civilized than other sports. In any situation you will have someone who has an attitude like this, no matter what sport they are playing, just like you will have people will high levels of sportsmanship.

This is a serious issue, but by talking about it in the context of a mixed event, you are clouding it. That isn't the issue, the issue is the lack of sportsmanship this fencer had.