New Timings, after two years

[u r the spoon]

Originally Posted by Sabresque

Haha sorry quick post w/o much explaining that obviously shows my bias, but this is how I see it: Before the timings changed, epee had and even more distinct style than foil. Now with the timings in foil, everything has slowed down, and there are a lot less actions that happen a lot less frequently. It just seems to have lost flair, becoming uncharacteristic, and bouts oftentimes don't even go to 15. I started fencing when the flick was involved and I found foil to be much more of a ballet then.

...or at least less of a remise-fest, while things have improved significantly as far as that goes in the past 2 years. and i don't find foil boring, but i do agree about the bouts being slower. This isn't to say that the fencing/footwork is slower or that there is less motion necessarily, but certainly there are less touches scored and bouts take longer. Since the timing change, there have been a higher percentage of one minute tie breaks in the DEs (case in point, all three of the quarter final matches in foil at the Vegas WC went to time).

[Feraud]

Originally Posted by OROD

You dont care, or it's the greatest thing ever? Which is it dude?

.

Yeah I contradicted myself there didn't I...
I guess I mean that I "don't care" about the timing change in the respect that foil is still foil and 2 years after the fact all the controversy seems unimportant. It's not like every day at practice anyone is complaining about it, in fact the only place I hear it discussed is on this webpage.

[jBirch]

Huh.

I never bought the "unique character of foil" argument. With flicks, foil looks less like foil and more like sabre. And, personally, I think that foil should look like epee but with less target area. Something about the "pokey, pokey" nature of fencing a thrusting weapon instead of the "slashy, slashy" nature of wannabe muskateer fencing.

I also don't think that the remise is the Anti-Christ (back in the day, what were the untrained rubes likely to do? Remise!). I like the fact that parries are not as lazy as they used to be and that opposition has a place in foil once again. What irritates me is the volume of those opposed on the grounds that it makes them suck. If they'd learned to fence in the first place, the timings wouldn't be an issue.

In case you missed it, I like the new timings (though the straight hit problem is still irritating and subversive when it happens).

James.

[Katman]

Originally Posted by jBirch

Huh.

I never bought the "unique character of foil" argument. With flicks, foil looks less like foil and more like sabre. And, personally, I think that foil should look like epee but with less target area. Something about the "pokey, pokey" nature of fencing a thrusting weapon instead of the "slashy, slashy" nature of wannabe muskateer fencing.

I also don't think that the remise is the Anti-Christ (back in the day, what were the untrained rubes likely to do? Remise!). I like the fact that parries are not as lazy as they used to be and that opposition has a place in foil once again. What irritates me is the volume of those opposed on the grounds that it makes them suck. If they'd learned to fence in the first place, the timings wouldn't be an issue.

In case you missed it, I like the new timings (though the straight hit problem is still irritating and subversive when it happens).

James.

I think that it's right of way and the longer lockout timing that made foil look more like saber and less like epee. We didn't care if we were remised upon because right of way protected us and we had time to still hit within its protection. Now we have the box deciding that we don't get to be as carefree as we used to.

[Sabresque]

Originally Posted by jBirch

Huh.
I also don't think that the remise is the Anti-Christ (back in the day, what were the untrained rubes likely to do? Remise!). I like the fact that parries are not as lazy as they used to be and that opposition has a place in foil once again. What irritates me is the volume of those opposed on the grounds that it makes them suck. If they'd learned to fence in the first place, the timings wouldn't be an issue.

I have a good friend who trained for years in foil with the old timings etc, with many notable good national/international results. He still does well, but struggles all the time with the new timings. So "learning to fence" was never his problem. In both weapons the remise/counterattack problem is BIG and i have a lot of problems with it. I know that a couple national coaches were trying to get things changed to turn the blocking time to a LITTLE faster but not all the way back to the original timings.