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Warik · 06-19-2006, 11:06 PM

I don't understand. I got a new Uhlmann sabre blade roughly 2 months ago. I fence 2x a week for roughly 1.5 hrs each time and have been to 3 small tournaments with it.

I had to actually stop using it in my most recent tournament because it would bend oddly after every touch (um... maybe counterattack is the correct term

) and it looks like it has rust all over it. Meanwhile a friend of mine has an Absolute blade that he's had for roughly 7 months with almost no rust on it and it doesn't bend like a wet noodle everytime he hits something with it). There's no way I've fenced more with my blade than he has with his.

What gives? I store it in a separate compartment from my sweaty uniform, so it shouldn't be all rusty so quickly... and it's a relatively new Uhlmann blade so it shouldn't bend so much. I have to straighten it after every touch.

Now it has somewhat of a forward bend to it... if I hold it in such a way that the blade should be parallel to the floor, it starts curving toward the ground about 8-10" from the guard.

Should I just chuck it and get a new blade or is this normal behavior?

fencerbill · 06-19-2006, 11:16 PM

No, it is not normal. You have just run into bad luck. You might return it where you bought it for exchange, if you are lucky.

Blades made by the same manufacturer vary. You just got a bad one.

It happens.

KD5MDK · 06-19-2006, 11:28 PM

Does it have a date of manufacture on it? Many blades sit for months or possibly years in a vendor's stock before being sold. That could explain the rust. Can't say a thing about the bend, other than that if the bend is forward, it is illegal.

Warik · 06-19-2006, 11:35 PM

Thanks... but I don't think I will be able to return it because of how long its been, among other factors. I did not find a date of manufacture on it, but I know it wasn't rusty when I first got it.

The bend is forward so apparently it is illegal. If it can't be fixed I'm going to have to get rid of it. I think I will go with something cheaper this time until I'm good enough to feel the difference.

erooMynohtnA · 06-19-2006, 11:56 PM

Just bend it back to a legal bend and sand it a little. If nothing else, it can be a backup. And if it does break, it sound like you won't be too unhappy anyway.

Do you leave it in your bag after fencing? Even if it's in a seperate compartment in your bag, you should take it out when you get home. Whatever fabric is in there is probably slightly permeable, so over time it will rust. Air is the best thing for weapons and uniforms.

Warik · 06-20-2006, 12:18 AM

Yes I do leave them in the bag... I will start removing them when I get home. Should I take them out of the PVC scabbard too?

erooMynohtnA · 06-20-2006, 12:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Warik

Yes I do leave them in the bag... I will start removing them when I get home. Should I take them out of the PVC scabbard too?

That, I'm not sure about. It couldn't hurt. I don't think it would make a big difference.

grotto · 06-20-2006, 09:33 AM

when you say it is bent forward, is it bent along the long axis of the blade that runs to the knuckle bow, and not along the flat? alot of newer sabrists I see are cutting with the flat of the blade, where some bend is allowed. just curious.

rory · 06-20-2006, 10:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Warik

Yes I do leave them in the bag... I will start removing them when I get home. Should I take them out of the PVC scabbard too?

Yes. The PVC will hold any trapped condensation close to the blade.

Buy maragings. They last longer and they don't rust much at all. (And yes, I know this is sabre)

fencerbill · 06-20-2006, 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KD5MDK

Does it have a date of manufacture on it? Many blades sit for months or possibly years in a vendor's stock before being sold. That could explain the rust. Can't say a thing about the bend, other than that if the bend is forward, it is illegal.

Comment: It is illegal to use. You have to take that bend out. It can be done but it is difficult. I have only been able to do it with a vise.

My frequently stated preference for taking bends out is a vise and a pipe wrench. Clamp it in the vise and use the pipe wrench about 3-4 inches away. Then move the blade six inches further and do a little more.

As you get closer to the tip it becomes harder to secure in the vise the way you want to.

You may have to wait until you can get someone with experience to do it for you but there is no problem using it for practice or local competitions.

My practice is to just open my fencing bag when I get home and make sure there is air circulation. Which is best for your mask and glove also. I do hang up my jacket and knickers to air. I don't bother to take the blades out of the PVC tubes.

I have never found it necessary to buy maraging Sabre blades. In fact I have never used one. Using maraging Sabre blades only drastically reduces your choices of blades.

DHCJr · 06-20-2006, 03:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Warik

Thanks... but I don't think I will be able to return it because of how long its been, among other factors. I did not find a date of manufacture on it, but I know it wasn't rusty when I first got it.

The bend is forward so apparently it is illegal. If it can't be fixed I'm going to have to get rid of it. I think I will go with something cheaper this time until I'm good enough to feel the difference.

Did you find any date on it at all?

The reason I am asking this KD5MDK could be right. This may not be an S2000 blade.

prototoast · 06-20-2006, 03:09 PM

Eh, the rust is probably your fault, as is the bending. All it takes is one good (or bad) hit to put a nice kink the in blade. Some fencers are just gentler with their blades than others (fewer point attacks, slower hand, etc.). Honestly, during the season, I tend to go through 5-6 blades, which works out to about a blade a month. I'd be fencing more than twice as much as you, but 2 months for a sabre blade to be totally messed up doesn't seem that bad.

fencerbill · 06-20-2006, 06:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DHCJr

Did you find any date on it at all?

The reason I am asking this KD5MDK could be right. This may not be an S2000 blade.

If it is not the stiffness of an S2000 blade and you bought it less than six years ago, you have been cheated.

If it is just a case of the S2000 marking being illegible then you have not been cheated.

But whether it is S2000 or not is relevant to how easily it flexes, for example, during a point thrust. It is not relevant as to how it takes a permanent bend or whether it is bent forward, which is the problem you have described with your blade..

I can tell whether a blade should be S2000 by pushing it against the floor. I expect DHCjr can also as well as the vendors like PF or Craig or Gary Spruill.

It is also unusual for it to bend forward. My blades have had a tendency to bend backwards after too many beats and parries.

(I can hear the comment now: when did Fencerbill ever parry?)

KD5MDK · 06-20-2006, 07:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prototoast

Eh, the rust is probably your fault, as is the bending. All it takes is one good (or bad) hit to put a nice kink the in blade. Some fencers are just gentler with their blades than others (fewer point attacks, slower hand, etc.). Honestly, during the season, I tend to go through 5-6 blades, which works out to about a blade a month. I'd be fencing more than twice as much as you, but 2 months for a sabre blade to be totally messed up doesn't seem that bad.

I bought 2 blades in Feb 2005. I've replaced one, and the other is nearly there. I do a fair amount (10-15%?) of point attacks. In any event, I can't think of sabre moves which would cause it to bend forward.

fencinman89 · 06-20-2006, 09:07 PM

Im no sabreur by any means but arnt the only Maraging sabre blades out there the LP ones? There may be others, but Ive nvr seen nor heard of them but Im just a foil and epeeist...
-Tre'

prototoast · 06-20-2006, 09:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KD5MDK

I bought 2 blades in Feb 2005. I've replaced one, and the other is nearly there. I do a fair amount (10-15%?) of point attacks. In any event, I can't think of sabre moves which would cause it to bend forward.

All it takes is one freak hit. I've had a blade bend backwards (but still in the bad plane for bending) because the point caught my opponents wrist oddly. I had one take a monster kink forward about 3 inches up from the guard. I have no idea how, but I was fencing a very heavy-handed opponent and on one hit he messed up my blade like that and smashed my guard. I couldn't reproduce either if I tried, but sometimes odd things happen when you're fencing.

KD5MDK · 06-21-2006, 12:35 AM

Out of curosity, do you use Fleche, Absolute or BG blades? StMs are the primary blade of choice down here, as far as I can tell, perhaps they are less susceptible to these odd bends, since I haven't seen them.

Warik · 06-21-2006, 02:29 AM

It is an S2000 blade. Apologies... I'm an armoury newb and didn't realize that's what that was.

I did manage to get the bend out.... I laid the blade on the floor and moved my foot slowly along the length to undo the bend. It's nice and straight now... until the next time I hit somebody with it I guess.

I'll just use it for practice for now and replace it when it breaks... flimsy piece of junk probably will very soon anyway.

One of my coaches showed me his Uhlmann blades today. Definitely thicker and sturdier than mine (also S2000). I think I ended up with a blade from a bad batch or something.

oh well...