Is the blade the same color the whole way through?

[brutus]

I don't know what blades you are talking about specifically, but the colouring of blades is usually down to the tempering process: differrent forms of tempering produce different colours, the colouring of the metal shows you what is heppening during the tempering process and you can regulate the heating and cooling depending on which colour is visable, it is (I ussume) possible to regulate the tempering so that you get the qualities you want as well as the colours, (it's and oxide which forms on the surface of the metal during the tempering).

However the colour can also be regulated by adding different metals and colouring into the smelting pot when the alloy is being mixed.

[JayhawkPawn]

There are ways, like Brutus said to color the steel during forging, hammer forging produces sort of a rainbow-y sheen, but I don't think it's the awesomely Liberache-flavor that my StM Rainbow Epee blades are, but it's close. If I get off my butt, I'll find a picture of a hammer-forged pistol frame, I have one around here, somewheres.

[SpyderLily]

Firstly, I'm thankful for all the info posted. Secondly, I know VERY little about making steel. However, to be honest, I'm still confused. I've read bits about tempering and sprays and dipping the blade to prevent rust. I've also heard outside f-net that the color comes from gases surrounding the steel while it's being tempered. That said, where does the color come from? Does it depend on the blade? How easily will it come off? I'm not terribly attached to the coloring of my blade, and I don't really suppose this matters too much in the grand scheme of things. I'm just curious.

[SpyderLily]

Also, sorry I was rather grumpy the other day. I still don't care for the "stupid question" labelling, but I do recognize that it was most probably not meant with ill-will.

[erooMynohtnA]

Originally Posted by SpyderLily

Firstly, I'm thankful for all the info posted. Secondly, I know VERY little about making steel. However, to be honest, I'm still confused. I've read bits about tempering and sprays and dipping the blade to prevent rust. I've also heard outside f-net that the color comes from gases surrounding the steel while it's being tempered. That said, where does the color come from? Does it depend on the blade? How easily will it come off? I'm not terribly attached to the coloring of my blade, and I don't really suppose this matters too much in the grand scheme of things. I'm just curious.

Basically, what Brutus said is what it comes down to. The colors are of steel compounds, sometimes oxides, sometimes something more exotic. They're usually a thin, chemically passive layer on top, chemically bonded to the steel, so it will be a comparatively durable finish. They can come from a gas or liquid medium. The chemically passive layer will usually resist oxidation, so it's more rust resistant than a bare blade.

Lots of companies claim the reason of the color is that they had to temper it that way, and it just happens to have a pleasing effect. That's not true. It's purely cosmetic.

Colors do depend on the steel. Maraging blades, for instance, are harder to color with some processes due to high nickel content (they're also more rust resistant for the same reason). However, basically any blade can take any color.

If you sand your blade, the color will come off fairly quickly, depending on the grit and pressure you use. In normal wear, it will come off wherever your blade is hit alot, but it should last awhile.

Although I have never heard of blade coloring sprays being sold, I would be interested to see the links to places to buy them. In the mean time, there are two relatively easy ways I know of to put a coating on a blade. You can blue it, which is almost as easy as coloring the blade with a marker and probably cleaner, and there's parkerizing which isn't that hard, but it requires boiling water, a vessel to hold the blade, and a heat source. Both bluing and parkerizing usually leave a black finish.

[twisterfencing]

Originally Posted by SpyderLily

Firstly, I'm thankful for all the info posted. Secondly, I know VERY little about making steel. However, to be honest, I'm still confused. I've read bits about tempering and sprays and dipping the blade to prevent rust. I've also heard outside f-net that the color comes from gases surrounding the steel while it's being tempered. That said, where does the color come from? Does it depend on the blade? How easily will it come off? I'm not terribly attached to the coloring of my blade, and I don't really suppose this matters too much in the grand scheme of things. I'm just curious.

Spyderlily:
Will go a little deeper in detail for you on the coloring.

Diffrent vendors (blade makers) do the coloring for diffrent reasons.

Example: The BF blades have diffrent colors that really mean something. When they are making the blades (stamping) they set up the computer diffrently for diffrent blades. When they make a certain type of blade, they (dip) it to color it. Example: a white (silver) blade means it is set up for stiffer/longer lasting all around type blade. Yet the blue's are set up for point control. See the diffrence?

Now, go to STM's blades. Theres are mainly set up for rust control. They may be rainbo, or gold or whatever, yet really there is no meaning behind them that I know of.

All colored blades are dipped. No gases are involved. They have this 50 gal drum that once the blade comes out of the stamping machine, they throw it into to cool. Its a dye based material. It does help with rust, yet understand all metel will rust no matter what you put on it. Its the law of metel.

Hope this helps.

Gary Spruill

[fatfencer]

Originally Posted by SpyderLily

I was simply under the impression that this was a place where people of all levels could ask questions and get answers to them without be demeaned for the question they asked. You say my question was ignorant, but the purpose of asking a question is to replace ignorance with knowledge. If I'd known the answer, I wouldn't have asked the question.

Well said I think. The truth is simple. Fencers are no different than anyone else...they like to micturate(sp?) at others' expense.

Sad really, 'specially when they don't deserve it.

Fatfencer

[JayhawkPawn]

Originally Posted by twisterfencing

Spyderlily:
Now, go to STM's blades. Theres are mainly set up for rust control. They may be rainbo, or gold or whatever, yet really there is no meaning behind them that I know of.
Gary Spruill

Actually, StM's blades coloring responds to the overall flexibility of the blade. Gold = Most flexible. Rainbow = Middle of the road. Blue = Rebar! Just my cent and a half.

[KD5MDK]

I've never seen anyone say that before. Interesting.

[Zilverzmurfen]

Originally Posted by JayhawkPawn

Actually, StM's blades coloring responds to the overall flexibility of the blade. Gold = Most flexible. Rainbow = Middle of the road. Blue = Rebar! Just my cent and a half.

I find this interesting too.

This is not my experience with the StM blades. I find them all to be fairly similar in flexibility/stiffness, regardless of colouring (or not).

[rac]

Originally Posted by Zilverzmurfen

I find this interesting too.

This is not my experience with the StM blades. I find them all to be fairly similar in flexibility/stiffness, regardless of colouring (or not).

I have to agree with Zilverzmufen, I cannot detect a significant difference in STM blades with regard to colour.

[Mr Epee]

Can we get an official source on the "meaning" of colour on blades?

The people that I generally trust claim that it's totally meaningless/random...

[KD5MDK]

The only authoratative source would be the manufacturer for each blade, I'd think.

[Mr Epee]

Originally Posted by KD5MDK

The only authoratative source would be the manufacturer for each blade, I'd think.

one would think... one would also think that if allstar blues were selected to perform in a certain way that the manufacture would advertise this factoid in some way... just a thought.

I think this is an old wives tale.

[keropie]

I certainly never really noticed any difference in my BF whites or blues. Harder to tell now that I destroyed my last blue last week at club

[SpyderLily]

Originally Posted by keropie

I certainly never really noticed any difference in my BF whites or blues. Harder to tell now that I destroyed my last blue last week at club

I've heard that the white is supposed to be stiffer than the blue. Although a clubmate has one of each and the blue happens to be stiffer.

I've done all my bits of shopping so far at Absolute (except chest protector because there's don't fit real women, but that's irrelevant here). This is what they said about the two. However, I hope the grammar isn't any indication of the accuracy of the information...

"BF made, excellent in balance and point control, more stiffer than Chevalier and Vnity FIE Epee blades. BF Blue has extra coating on the blade than BF White, which provide additional protection against rust."-BF Blue

"BF made, excellent in balance and point control, more stiffer than Chevalier and Vnity FIE Epee blades."- BF White

Perhaps there is no flexibility difference. I looked elsewhere for information, but couldn't find anything. Anyone else know?

[Epee Scherma]

Originally Posted by Mr Epee

one would think... one would also think that if allstar blues were selected to perform in a certain way that the manufacture would advertise this factoid in some way... just a thought.

I think this is an old wives tale.

That's it. I'm getting peeved about this old wives tale. I demand to know the truth straight from the makers themselves! Well it just so happens I have this international calling card, and a friend who is very fluent in French. Sooo, in a couple days when I get my answer I will make sure to post it on this board.
http://www.blaise-freres.fr/