Ratings awarded at National team events?

[Frank Pratt]

What are the rules for awarding ratings at team events? According to the 2000 Operations Manual (revision 2000.09; the most current version I could find):

Originally Posted by 2000 Ops. Manual; Ch. IV, Sec. 5

(2) A fencer is classified as Class “B”:
. . . . .(f) by fencing in the final round of four as a member of a team that wins a US National Team Championship . . .

(3) A fencer is classified as Class “C”:
. . . . (h) by fencing in the final round of four as a member of a team that places second or third in a US National Team Championship. . .

Is this rule still in place for the all of the team events at the Summer Nationals? I ask because the separate Div1 and Senior team events came about after this edition of the Operations Manual was published.

[fencerbill]

Originally Posted by Frank Pratt

What are the rules for awarding ratings at team events? According to the 2000 Operations Manual (revision 2000.09; the most current version I could find):



Is this rule still in place for the all of the team events at the Summer Nationals? I ask because the separate Div1 and Senior team events came about after this edition of the Operations Manual was published.

I was awarded a "C" classification when I was on the team that won what would now be called the Senior Team Sabre in 1999. In that year the Div 1 national championships, accompanied by Div 1 Team events, were held before the Summer Championships because the World Championships were held in July or August.

That year it was called the Open Team Championship.

One of the most gratifying aspects of it was applause from the referees after the medal ceremony.

[Frank Pratt]

Originally Posted by fencerbill

I was awarded a "C" classification when I was on the team that won what would now be called the Senior Team Sabre in 1999. In that year the Div 1 national championships, accompanied by Div 1 Team events, were held before the Summer Championships because the World Championships were held in July or August.

That year it was called the Open Team Championship.

One of the most gratifying aspects of it was applause from the referees after the medal ceremony.

The way the (evidently outdated) Ops Manual reads, you get can get a "B" or "C" for fencing on a team that places first, second, or third a Div1, Open, or U-19 National Team Championship competion. From what you're saying, the rule I quoted above must only apply to to Div1 (and possibly the U19) Team Championships. Looks like the manual needs to be updated.

If you and your teamates got a "C" for winning the event, did the participants in the 2nd and 3rd place teams get "Ds"?

[fencerbill]

Originally Posted by Frank Pratt

The way the (evidently outdated) Ops Manual reads, you get can get a "B" or "C" for fencing on a team that places first, second, or third a Div1, Open, or U-19 National Team Championship competion. From what you're saying, the rule I quoted above must only apply to to Div1 (and possibly the U19) Team Championships. Looks like the manual needs to be updated.

If you and your teamates got a "C" for winning the event, did the participants in the 2nd and 3rd place teams get "Ds"?

I don't know. I think 1999 was the first year that there had been multiple all-age team events and they had not anticipated that there would be any in the future. Also I believe the other fencers on my team and on the second and third place teams already had these ratings.

Since the situation was unprecedented, I sent an E-mail to the national office about getting a "C". There was no argument or even further discussion and it came through with a new membership card. Perhaps I should have asked for a "B".

The average age for our team was interesting. Phil Miller was a college senior, Evan Efstathiou had graduated the year before and I was 63. So the average age was about 36.

[oiuyt]

I know a fencer who earned her B by being a member of the 1st place (senior) team a couple of years after fencerbill. Note that fencerbill's experience happened prior to the revision that you're quoting from. Presumably that revision is from which the change from C to B dates.

That said, yes, the Ops Manual is horrendously out of date and needs massive amounts of revision work.

-B

[fencerbill]

Originally Posted by oiuyt

I know a fencer who earned her B by being a member of the 1st place (senior) team a couple of years after fencerbill. Note that fencerbill's experience happened prior to the revision that you're quoting from. Presumably that revision is from which the change from C to B dates.

That said, yes, the Ops Manual is horrendously out of date and needs massive amounts of revision work.

-B

I guess I should have fought for the "B". Actually I was quite happy to get the "C" since I had been an "E".

[oiuyt]

Originally Posted by fencerbill

I guess I should have fought for the "B". Actually I was quite happy to get the "C" since I had been an "E".

Yeah, but the B would have knocked you out of D2 events for the next 4 years. For what? Slightly better local seeding?

-B

[fencerbill]

Originally Posted by oiuyt

Yeah, but the B would have knocked you out of D2 events for the next 4 years. For what? Slightly better local seeding?

-B

It would have moved up Vets 60 Sabre NACs and Championships from a "C" to a "B" event. Bill Goering was the only "B" from 1999 to 2002. We still have trouble making it a "B" event. Even in Reno last march it was only a "C" event. We couldn't get 2 "B"s and 2 "C"s into the final eight. If I was still a "C" instead of a "D" it would have made it.

Besides, think what it would have done for my ego? Which I suppose was bad enough already.