For everyone planning to attend a tourney in North Carolina

[jdoiv]

If the events were not sanctioned just because the organizers were too lazy to obtain proof of membership, then why would a division officer have to physically be there just to make sure that fencers are showing their cards at check-in?!

I think it's called punishment? The division officers are suppossed to sanction the events and set the schedule. By sanctioning the events, the event bc's are suppossed to follow the rules. They didn't. So the Parent hast to come in and tell them to do it right. If their local bc's can't check membership cards at check in, then you require the division officers to be there to make sure it's done right. It is a flame thrower effect, but the fall out from this isn't going to be small for some people. I think what people are forgetting is that by being a sanctioned event, they have liability coverage. By not checking for the membership cards, they are forfeiting their coverage and putting the USFA in a tight spot if something happens. It's not really about ratings, it's about liability. The division officers are responsible for this and they obviously messed up.
My .02...

[bigdawg2121]

Look, the allegations were most probably more serious than people simply not checking cards. It would seem that the USFA's decision to take action that has never been taken in the history of the organization is probably a good indicator of that...

[KD5MDK]

I should like to point out that it is not always necessary to show your membership card at a tournament. For example, most of the tournaments I work at have people who check all the preregistered fencers on FRED and verify their ratings, age and membership status before the event, so that all they have to do is show up, having prepaid. Only non-preregistered fencers would need to show their card. I suppose a truly paranoid tournament organizer might demand picture ID to verify the person checking in is the USFA fencer they claim to be.

[oiuyt]

You fenced without showing a USFA card, how is that not an issue?

Because it's routine and I don't know of a similar remedy being used anywhere else in the USFA in the past. Again, I'm used to not being carded, whether or not the organizers are carding everyone else (and now that I've mentioned it multiple times I suppose I can expect to have to present proof a number of times next season....).

And I know of some past incidents where tournaments that included non-current USFA members regained that status by going back and getting people to join. I remember an incident several years ago where the classification of one of my students (she won an event, earning a C) was temporarily held up for this reason. The division in question did NOT lose a season's worth of tournaments. Granted even that occasion I think wasn't handled efficiently (all of the classifications for all events at the tournament were held up until the one problem person who fenced a single event submitted a renewal form).

Now if the list of unsanctioned tournaments ALL included non-members then it seems the issue was considerably more wide-spread then I've ever seen before, which could clearly affect the magnitude of the response.

-B

[Frank Pratt]

Look, the allegations were most probably more serious than people simply not checking cards. It would seem that the USFA's decision to take action that has never been taken in the history of the organization is probably a good indicator of that...

Yeah, I get this feeling too. But what else happened?! A few non-USFA competitors here and there is the only problem that has been mentioned in this thread.

[bigdawg2121]

AFAIK the USFA and the division haven't really released the other issues officially so I'm not really sure that I have the authority to publicize what they have chosen not to as of yet.

[Phrogger]

I don't know details, but I was told by folks who have been fencing longer in NC that there are some clubs that are "too laid back," wink wink. I'm not really sure what that means but I am certain nobody wants to air their dirty laundry in this forum. I'm sure it's more than just not checking cards. It is a disservice to everyone who fences in NC that this has happened though, and the guilty club(s) need to be straightened out without punishing everyone else. Why not just de-sanction that club's tournament's for a year? Or even desanction the whole club to set an example? The alternative is to wait for the whole division to be desanctioned.

I was going to start a new thread on why our state games don't have fencing in them, but we've got some serious problems to resolve before we worry about that.

[Padawan]

Actually, next year nc state games will have fencing in it.

[Phrogger]

Actually, next year nc state games will have fencing in it.

Rock on.

Anyway, the division chair just sent a detailed email out to the mailing list explaining the whole thing. Mostly because of non-USFA members participating in tournaments. Not just one club at fault. Hopefully next year will be better.

In the meantime, I guess I'll have to look for some summer tourneys in S.C....

[Padawan]

I am sure there will be at least a couple.

[Spike327]

Anyway, the division chair just sent a detailed email out to the mailing list explaining the whole thing.

The email is up on the ncfencing website also, see here: http://www.ncfencing.org/clarification052406.shtml

[Frank Pratt]

<snip>. . .it was brought to the attention of a Division officer that a North Carolina fencer appeared in the results for an event that fencer had not attended, in a weapon they did not own, with a rating they did not have, representing a club to which they did not belong. . .<snip>

Well, this thickens the plot a bit. . . .

[Mr Epee]

What a way to honor the memory of Christian Vidosa...

:bigtimeeyeroll:

Good job guys.

[Padawan]

For those seeing the list. Be sure to handle your own renewals directly. I renewed my membership at the August tournament at the Atlanta Fencers Club. Results are on askfred. Never got to the USFA. The USFA was kind enough to keep sending me updated cards with new rating thorough out the season though. When we got word that some people were not members I called, Dana was kind enough to tell me that they had not received the renewal but would be glad to process for it for me. So, what have we learned here? If you join at an away tournament, follow up with the usfa regulary. If you run a tournament and the person says that they are a member but don't have the card, make them fill it out anyway.

p.s. Mr. Epee, John Makela thought is was the best way to honor a man that some of us were fortuneate enough to call a friend.

[Padawan]

wow, just when I thought things couldn't get weirder down south.

SEXUAL HARRASSMENT POLICY: The USFA and the NC Division do not condone sexual harassment of any sort. If you feel that you need to seek resources regarding sexual harassment in our sport, or report an incidence of misconduct, please call this number at the USFA National Office: 719-866-4860. Attached is the USFA Policy Document on Sexual harassment for your review

This was updated on our nc site today!

[epeemike81]

Looking at a list of the fencers who were incorrectly allowed to fence, I think it's pretty clear which two clubs owe the rest of the division an apology:

Knights of Sienna (22 Fencers)
Jordan Abbatiello
Allison Benfield
Emily Benfield
Alan Blakeborough
Natalia Chodelski
Koyt Everhart III
JohnMark Flemings
Sophia Flemings
Katie Kath
Phil Kath
Cadria Kunafina
Barbara Lolli
Cassi Macko
Dave Mckee
Moriah Shamblin
Garrett Smith
Philip Taylor
Abby Tesser
Jim Tesser
Zack Wagner
Russell Williams
Will Yoder

Charlotte Fencing Academy (6 Fencers)
Nick Hallman
Nathan Henderson
Matt Hoffman
Alastair Pitts
Daniel Ryan
Richard Sampson

Blowing Rock Fencing Club (1 fencer)
Corey Mena

Touche FC (1 fencer)
Natalie Cramer

Unattached (1 fencer)
Udo Ziegler

-m

[fencerbunny]

Well, this thickens the plot a bit. . . .

As a member of the bout committee that helps to run these tournaments I can safely say that this is an issue that happened between using fencing time and the fred download. I have hard copies of every tournament that our club runs (pool sheets, de trees, results...) and on none of that paperwork does it show that the fencer that showed up on the ASKFRED website fenced that day, in that weapon, with that rating. The proper person was listed and did fence with us that day. This has actually happened on two other occasions (with the same two fencer's names) and we have worked with Peet to see what the problem is.

[cobaltblade]

Funny that you'd ask this, given that your club allowed non-usfa members to fence at 3 events and 6 of the fencers who were incorrectly allowed to fence were FROM your club...

-m

Actually they weren't his club, it was my club.

Dunno about the others, but ours wasn't intentional in any way, shape, or form. Nor did they have a large bearing on ratings. Forms were lost, corrections have been made, an apology was made to the division officers. Moving on...

[epeemike81]

Actually they weren't his club, it was my club.

Dunno about the others, but ours wasn't intentional in any way, shape, or form. Nor did they have a large bearing on ratings. Forms were lost, corrections have been made, an apology was made to the division officers. Moving on...

Yes indeed....

Dave: My apologies. I'm going to delete the offending post.

-m

[Padawan]

Well, epeemike is correct. If we had people who did not have their cards to show at the tournament, we are responsible. We apologize. If someone would like a personal apology from me or anyone from our staff you can PM me. For us, in the future we will be making copies of everyones USFA card for our records. If someone has a reciept that they paid at another competition that will be copied. If they have neither then we will just have to have them fill out another form. Even if it is OIUYT (Brad).

We corrected all the ones that the USFA had sent to us, moving on also....