10-02-2008, 07:02 PM
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#41 | | Member
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 93
| counter bunt cuts to the wrist then run like hell  | 
|  | | And now for this message... |
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10-02-2008, 07:35 PM
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#42 | | Curmudgeon-in-Chief
Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Somewhere in your nightmares!
Posts: 23,752
| You hit the wrist with a cake?! 
PS See signature.
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10-03-2008, 11:21 AM
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#43 | | Vieux Sabreur
Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Florida
Posts: 298
| Quote:
Originally Posted by BrodeurNJD30  | I'd be tempted to call that covering target. lol | |
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10-03-2008, 01:19 PM
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#44 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Boston, MA
Posts: 5,045
| Quote:
Originally Posted by Sean Butler I'd be tempted to call that covering target. lol | I've had people do that to me in epee... I just hit them on the bottom of the foot and ran away... | |
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10-06-2008, 01:05 AM
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#45 | | Member
Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: New York
Posts: 50
| Covering
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sean Butler I'd be tempted to call that covering target. lol |
It's been called on me twice, once by Jay Choy and once by Charles Astudillo. everyone else has been to amazed to call anything. Charles called the cover for the leg over the body, sometimes I can keep the leg down and still land it, Jay called it for the arm under the leg. | |
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10-06-2008, 01:07 AM
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#46 | | Member
Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: New York
Posts: 50
| Epee
Quote:
Originally Posted by telkanuru I've had people do that to me in epee... I just hit them on the bottom of the foot and ran away... | Its easier to do in epee (for me), usually off of an eight fleche or a two, I have landed it on A and B rated epee fencers numerous times. Its easier cause of no covering, and that i can now cross the feet. | |
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10-06-2008, 02:42 AM
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#47 | | Moderator
Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 10,235
| Quote:
Originally Posted by telkanuru I've had people do that to me in epee... I just hit them on the bottom of the foot and ran away... | I know of a town where there are two rival clubs. One club has a tendency trained by their coach to kick their foot up rather like that in a lunge. The other club's fencers made marks on their gloves (like notches on a pistol, I suppose) every time their scored a touch on the sole of the shoe. Quote:
Originally Posted by BrodeurNJD30 It's been called on me twice, once by Jay Choy and once by Charles Astudillo. everyone else has been to amazed to call anything. Charles called the cover for the leg over the body, sometimes I can keep the leg down and still land it, Jay called it for the arm under the leg. | I'd totally call it, if I had the presence of mind. It's not at all what a referee is expecting, but there isvery clearly covering target there. | |
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10-06-2008, 03:27 PM
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#48 | | Vieux Sabreur
Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Florida
Posts: 298
| What I don't get is what advantage the "field-goal-kick-advance" has; other than covering target anyway.
It's funny though, I can't really think of anything "flashy" that I do in sabre fencing. Most of my flashier moves are in foil. If I had to choose one in sabre that I like to score with the best, it might be:
Jump into a prep by my opponent, feint a 5-parry drawing him to finish with a flank cut, 2-parry and a back-cut to the cheek. I just love the speed of a back-handed cheek-cut from seconde, it's like a wrist flick. | |
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10-06-2008, 05:46 PM
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#49 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: near Boston
Posts: 3,334
| To digress to Epee (or would that be thread drift?), I swear I watched someone do a high kick on an advance lunge, dip the point to hit themselves on the foot, and finish to the wrist.
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10-06-2008, 05:52 PM
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#50 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Boston, MA
Posts: 5,045
| How something applies to epee is always relevant and therefor neither thread drift nor a digression.
Also, it's a fairly common cheat tactic. | |
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10-06-2008, 05:57 PM
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#51 | | Vieux Sabreur
Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Florida
Posts: 298
| Well, whether or not the epee comments are thread drift, I still wonder what use that kick has in sabre. | |
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10-08-2008, 02:13 PM
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#52 | | Curmudgeon-in-Chief
Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Somewhere in your nightmares!
Posts: 23,752
| Well, if your opponent is cutting from the low line it might still cover target. Or block or deflect the attack long enough for yours to score. Kind of a long shot hope, though.
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10-08-2008, 02:45 PM
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#53 | | Vieux Sabreur
Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Florida
Posts: 298
| Right; so it's illegal. | |
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10-08-2008, 03:05 PM
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#54 | | Curmudgeon-in-Chief
Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Somewhere in your nightmares!
Posts: 23,752
| Only if your referee agrees...and if he sees it. Given the number of crossovers that escape notice, the odds are probably in your favor.
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Last edited by Inquartata; 10-10-2008 at 04:00 PM.
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10-09-2008, 09:37 AM
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#55 | | Vieux Sabreur
Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Florida
Posts: 298
| LMAO! Crossovers, I think, aren't nearly as apparent as a guy doing a fieldgoal kick as he bounds down the piste. | |
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10-09-2008, 10:13 AM
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#56 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: I have no home
Posts: 2,007
| Quote:
Originally Posted by Inquartata Only is your referee agrees...and if he sees it. Given the number of crossovers that escape notice, the odds are probably in your favor. | Crossovers also require the entire back foot to cross in front of the entire rear foot....not really as common as you probably think. Not that they don't get missed as well
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10-09-2008, 11:07 AM
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#57 | | Immortal
Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: Heidelberg, GE
Posts: 5,488
| Quote:
Originally Posted by BrodeurNJD30 | I'm generally a peaceable and non-violent type, but if I had an opponent who tried something like that, I think my response would probably be either a skyhook, executed with as much snap as I could muster, to the shin, or a hard flicked stop-cut to the calf.
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Why sabre? Because you don't take heads with the point.
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10-09-2008, 01:11 PM
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#58 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: near Boston
Posts: 3,334
| Quote:
Originally Posted by bigdawg2121 Crossovers also require the entire back foot to cross in front of the entire rear foot....not really as common as you probably think. Not that they don't get missed as well | The announcement on the USFA web site about rule changes will cause me to change how I treat potential crossovers.
Although I think BD2121 meant entire back foot in front of entire front foot.
There have been discussions here on f.net about whether it was entire rear foot passing entire front foot vs feature on back foot passing corresponding feature on front foot. That is, for example, ankle passing ankle. Another in a long list of words in the rules that different people can interpret in different ways.
The new wording should result in all referees using the same criteria. It is a violation when the rear foot completely passes the front foot.
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10-09-2008, 02:14 PM
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#59 | | Fencing Expert
Join Date: Apr 2000 Location: Pennsauken, NJ
Posts: 9,089
| Quote:
Originally Posted by fencerbill The new wording should result in all referees using the same criteria. It is a violation when the rear foot completely passes the front foot. | Note that this rules change alters the wording, making it more clear, but doesn't change what actually (ought to) happen in the real world. The change makes the language unambiguously in line with current practice, rather than changes current practice.
It would be interesting to know what process resulted in that ambiguity being fixed, if for no other reason than to help provide guideposts to a potential method to fix any or all of the many others. Probably an argument at some international event where someone had it driven home that their interpretation was not correct and moved to avoid similar problems for others or where someone who had the correct interpretation was encountering difficulty convincing others of his/her correctness and decided to make it easier in the future.
-B
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10-09-2008, 02:34 PM
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#60 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: New York City
Posts: 696
| Speaking of rule changes:
I'm curious about the rationale behind all the "beginning of the extending of the arm precedes the launching of the lunge" language added to the definition of an attack in sabre.
It seems unnecessary and potentially problematic. | |
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