Coaching section?

[Craig]

I've received a few requests for a separate section of the forums for coaches to discuss some issues related to coaching and managing clubs.

For those that are coaches on the forum: would this be useful?

I would plan on using the forums "groups" function to limit access to the coaching forum to those who join the coaching "group" (totally self-selected). That would allow those who don't have an interest in coaching to not see anything and for those that are active to have a separate discussion area that is more focused.

Craig

[fencerontheline]

I would definitely appreciate a section like this.

[Fencergrl]

I too would find it useful as I am working towards becoming a coach.

[Mr Epee]

If I were taking coaching/management advice, I would want to know exactly who was giving it and based on what qualifications/experience.

It might be a good idea, but it would take a great deal of thought and probably heavy moderation.

I don't see this working, if you just open the area and say "Hey, feel like a coach? This is your area".

[Padawan]

This would be good

[Craig]

Originally Posted by Mr Epee

If I were taking coaching/management advice, I would want to know exactly who was giving it and based on what qualifications/experience.

It might be a good idea, but it would take a great deal of thought and probably heavy moderation.

I don't see this working, if you just open the area and say "Hey, feel like a coach? This is your area".

Take a look under your "User CP" for "Group Memberships". There would be a coaching membership created and I would want to set someone up as the group leader to then allow/deny access to the group. Once you have joined / been accepted to the group you would see the coaching forum, otherwise you wouldn't see that it existed.

I would expect that terms for joining would be some verification of level of coaching and that the discussions there would be held to a higher standard than the general discussion forum. (I would need a couple of coaches to act as moderators within the section.)

Craig

[Fencergrl]

Is it possible to allow those of us who are in the process of getting their coaching certification? I can see this being really useful for me (and others in a similar situation). I don't mind if I'm unable to post, I just want to be able to learn what I can.

[Ordway]

I think it would be useful, but I don't necessarily see it as having to be a separate group like you're discussing - just a different forum, like the armory section.

Otherwise, how are you going to filter out non-coaches in a fair way? What about people who want to be coaches, but aren't yet? What about people like me? I'm not certified in any way, shape, or manner, but I coach a college club and have coached at several other college clubs (and have a lot of teaching experience). What about fencers who are trying to help out in "self-coached" small clubs? They may not be "real" coaches but arguably are the ones who would most benefit from participating in this kind of discussion.

So I'd say, make a new forum but base it on TOPIC, not credentials. Fewer cans of worms there.

[Mr Epee]

Originally Posted by Craig

I would want to set someone up as the group leader to then allow/deny access to the group.

I would expect that terms for joining would be some verification of level of coaching and that the discussions there would be held to a higher standard than the general discussion forum.

Craig

This is probably ok... as worded initially, I thought you were going to set it up as a "ya'll come"

Here's another problem... I imagine that you would lose a good deal of most valuable discussion from the remainder of the board. Believe it, or not, the majority of posts on this board are totally useless. If the most valuable contributors are talking in a backroom of the board then you have killed the usefulness of the board for the average user.

Yes, it would be nice to have a forum for a higher level of discussion on coaching and sport management, but I think it would drastically change the landscape of F.Net. Maybe that's fine with everyone, but be careful what you ask for...

["Fence like a Cat"]

Craig,
Yes, it would be a helpful and useful addition to F-Net.

Marty Tetloff
Moniteur d'Armes
USFCA

[Allen Evans]

Originally Posted by Mr Epee

If I were taking coaching/management advice, I would want to know exactly who was giving it and based on what qualifications/experience.

It might be a good idea, but it would take a great deal of thought and probably heavy moderation.

I don't see this working, if you just open the area and say "Hey, feel like a coach? This is your area".

and:

Originally Posted by Mr Epee

Here's another problem... I imagine that you would lose a good deal of most valuable discussion from the remainder of the board. Believe it, or not, the majority of posts on this board are totally useless. If the most valuable contributors are talking in a backroom of the board then you have killed the usefulness of the board for the average user.

I agree with Mr. Epee on this. I think the goal, Craig, is to find a way for members to find coaching advice and discussions. Currently that's not easy to do. Perhaps the idea of having a seperate section (like the "Armory", as Holly suggested) is a good one.

[Ordway]

Hm. I think there should have been an option for "it depends" in the poll, after all...

I think Mr. Epee is right in pointing out that siphoning away the coaching threads to a virtual backroom would be a really bad idea.

But I think that separating them out into a different forum with no other restrictions would have the beneficial effect of reducing the thread turnover slightly in the main discussion forum, where threads vanish off the front page quite quickly, even when they're still alive and kicking.

[Tomas N]

I don't like the idea as proposed too much. I'm the "coach" at the college's fencing club in the sense that I lead the drills, give some individual lessons, am the club's advisor. I'm a c-rated fencer and I've been fencing for over 20 years, so I do a decent job. But I don't go around calling myself a "fencing coach" because that's not my job, I'm not certified, and I think of someone who is much more qualified than me (who teaches about 1.5 hours away) as my "coach." Yet I find much of the discussion about coaching on the board to be quite useful. Would I be excluded from the coaching section? If so, I think that would be a disservice to the sport. F-net is about sharing information about fencing, not keeping it hidden away.

Tomas

[Craig]

Thanks for the comments. Okay, retract the "members only" part. My concern there was if some coaches wanted to discuss "business plan" type questions that maybe they don't want their students to read (see any discussion of fencing equipment pricing in the armory section to get an idea of what a coach may have to deal with on this side.)

Craig

[larkmaj]

Sounds like you're putting coaching and club management into the same category. It should however, be recognized that they are indeed different things and sometimes run by different people. In my club the management and the coaches are very different. Our coach is not directly involved in the management of the club, while we do listen to his suggestions.

I would have a concern to that effect for the "members only" but since you took that down I guess there is no more concern...

[Mr Epee]

Sport Management and Coaching are absolutely different positions.

Take a look at Andy Reid and Mike Holmgren, if you need clarification

[ReverseLunge]

open a coaching section and all you will get are guys like biggs tell ppl that they can only hit if they are within distance or grasshopper telling us that in order to hit you must be able to advance just a slight bit faster than your opponent or Wally giving us a 3 page lecture about how we need to hit and not be hit.

We must open a Mr. Epee section and have it password secured so only the worthy may enter and ask real questions. And he should have the right to reject the harmful questions of the retarded.

[D+F+P=Hadouken!]

Only if I get to post in it.

Just kidding.

I think a coaches section has major potential to suck, mostly because we won't have stupid people to fuel the discussion.

[Mr Epee]

Originally Posted by ReverseLunge

We must open a Mr. Epee section and have it password secured so only the worthy may enter and ask real questions. And he should have the right to reject the harmful questions of the retarded.

Thanks RL!

I've long thought this should be the case, but I've been too embarassed to ask.

I will also be needing extensive gubernatorial powers.

I will also require a case of Bass Ale to my home - weekly.

Cheers

[Gav]

I envisage 2 forums:

We've got a coaching section on the UK forum. It works ok and it's mostly coaches who post in it. It's normal to see discussion of particular camps, articles from here, the labyrinthine politics of the BAF (note: not the BFA!) and so on. I think an actual forum for coaches with approved membership could be set up (like NY fencing and HPfencing). We would need to set up groups and agree rules of conduct and membership up front.
I would think a forum like this would be useful as a 'private area' for coaches to hang and swap ideas without the interference of "the usual suspects". Could be useful for your coaches college to pass information to their membership.
In summary:
1 public section for coaching advice and public questions.
1 private section for the serious coaching discussion Craig mentions that may, or may not, be of interest to the wider membership.

I can't see any reason why a coach might not post an article in both sections and see the difference in the discussions.