Left-Handed Fencer Injuries

[Inquartata]

Of course, what foilists REALLY need is to wear a cone like that around their necks, to keep them from biting themselves.

[Dr. Bob]

I too get the crap beat out of my hand. I do everything I can to keep my old parts going. It seemed to me that a larger guard might help and so I went to 11.5cm foil guard. Still not enough. Having access to industrial sewing machines and computer patterning systems I made several covers for my hand that go over the glove. I have been able to use them at any and all tournaments, so far. The heavy vinyl, velcro applied pad has a thin firm foam pad sewn inside. It weighs very little and is easy to apply and remove. See photos.

[Sorry to all for having disappeared after starting this thread.] Joe, that's a great idea! Does it affect your ability to achieve the sorts of angulation that you would get in, say, a parry prime? In any case, it seems like a simple and elegant solution. I had been thinking in terms of plastic strips (like the material that chest protectors are made of) attached to either the outside of the glove (running along the back of the hand over each metacarpal) or to a thin glove worn inside the fencing glove. Your idea seems simpler to make and use. I suspect that there are a number of folks that would buy one if it were available (I know I would!).

[PalmFrond]

Joe's hand protector looks like a great idea! Do let us know when/if it becomes commercially available.

Personally, I use 'foot comfort padding' on my fingers. It's a soft, thin piece of padding which is sticky on one side. I started using it originally to protect my index finger from rubbing against the handle of my foil, then started padding the finger joints and knuckles of my hand to prevent the worst effects of pokes/slashes to the fingers. No control of the weapon is lost. In Ireland, it's available in Boots (a branch of pharmacists) - don't know where you can get it in the US.

[sjpfencer220]

if you want to go with something that is definately legal, a lot of gloves that they make now have padding for the back of the hand and fingers and also you can get a cushiony pad for the inside of your belgar to keep your hand from pounding into your guard if you and your opponent's guards both meet (in a fleshe for example). they sell both of these at most vendors and for more suggestions you should ask one of the trainers at a national tournament. ps i am a lefty too and these two things really do work.

[Dr. Bob]

if you want to go with something that is definately legal, a lot of gloves that they make now have padding for the back of the hand and fingers and also you can get a cushiony pad for the inside of your belgar to keep your hand from pounding into your guard if you and your opponent's guards both meet (in a fleshe for example). they sell both of these at most vendors and for more suggestions you should ask one of the trainers at a national tournament. ps i am a lefty too and these two things really do work.

Sarah,

Thanks for the reply. My glove isfairly well padded on the back. Unfortunately that wasn't enough to keep my hand from being broken by the collision with my opponent's bell guard. The closing speed of two fencers attacking simultaneously is pretty high - I think something reasonably rigid would be required to provide any significant protection in that instance.

[JasminaJ]

Hey Joe! Sign me up to buy one of your guards! Great idea.
Sorry about the awful corps-a'-corps fracture,Dr. Bob!
I'm a lefty saber woman- and I have"saber thumb" on both hands, wear splints
when not working or fencing. I have hypermobile joints, an instability of the CMC (carpal metacarpal) joints, with minor arthroses. An othropedist prescribed the splints, after the dislocation was reduced. Some saber guys like to hit small women, mistakenly thinking we will flinch-or worse. Wrong!
But I don't hit people like that. Nor do I make groin hits, although I have been tempted. I have made sarcastic remarks regarding unnecessary roughness vs. good point control , and I try to do this within earshot of the director-but only if I have been roughed up by this person in the past.
Sometimes I fantasize about meeting these persons in the parking lot-and beating them to a pulp! But, I am the soul of discretion and good manners while representing my club, of course!

[keropie]

Well, I fence a fair number of lefties (I'm a righty), and I rarely have these collisions. The key I've found is the same key to hitting people in saber: stay away from the guard! It is difficult when actions are truly simultaneous, or when they counterattack in such a way to cause the guards to come together. Hopefully in either case your official is carding for corps-a-corps (either both of you for simul, or just the offender for causing it). When people seem to be the type of fencer who counters with that closing line, I tend to hit somewhere else (flank, across the body), displace their hand somehow (a feint to the inside and below the guard to drop their guard so I can hit them above it), hit them before they're ready to counterattack, etc. I don't actually remember the last time I had a strong guard to guard collision.

HTH

[Joe biebel]

[Sorry to all for having disappeared after starting this thread.] Joe, that's a great idea! Does it affect your ability to achieve the sorts of angulation that you would get in, say, a parry prime? In any case, it seems like a simple and elegant solution. I had been thinking in terms of plastic strips (like the material that chest protectors are made of) attached to either the outside of the glove (running along the back of the hand over each metacarpal) or to a thin glove worn inside the fencing glove. Your idea seems simpler to make and use. I suspect that there are a number of folks that would buy one if it were available (I know I would!).

I also thought about the hard plastic strips sewn into a cloth cover. But my "materials on hand" worked so well I did not bother. The cover I have made is excellent protection against whips, flicks, and parries to the fingers, or where the opponents guard would hit the fingers. I designed the pattern so that it covers the fingers only, and I have noticed no degrading of performance. I'm sure the 2 glove system would work. I've tried it myself and thought it caused to much "cush" with my finger contact to the handle. In other words, my weapon "squirmed" to much for my taste.

The cover, covers only the fingers and is an eccentric cone to give more protection on the bottom side of the hand that is more exposed. I don't think it would work well with a French style grip as the fingers would be doing a lot more manipulation. With a pistol grip, the fingers stay put for the most part, but in the first iteration, I noticed infighting was negatively effected because there is need to do some manipulation at "close quarters". The protector shown in the photos, is a recent design and incorporates 2 pieces connected by a wide piece of elastic. It "gives" when you need it to.

The cloth in a heavy (18oz.) nylon reinforced vinyl cloth that I also use to make point control targets. This stuff is tough. Some of the units I have seen at fencing clubs when I go to there for tournaments, that have been hit tens of thousands of times are still intact. While this guard will protect your fingers nicely from whacks, it will not protect your fingers wrist etc. from guard to guard contact. This occured to me numerous time this last weekend with opponents whose game it is to attack with opposition and ram their guard into your guard. Despite the fact that this can cause dislocated fingers and broken wrists (both have happened to me) referees never call this anything. I keep my handles fairly long so that my fingers can not get trapped against the pad. This allows the weapon to leave the hand without wrenching and twisting fingers. The leverage is worse with a longer handle, fingers not touching the guard pad, but I use short blades to compensate. The other thing I do for the inevitable guard to guard smash is to tape my wrist.