Weapons Gauge

[Purple Fencer]

The question is what margin of error is acceptable? 2mm may be too much, but what if it is .1mm off? Is that unacceptable?

I can think of 3 places a margin of error is defined in the rules. (Test weight, thin shim, and bend in blade. Blade in so much as it is to be "straight, +-1cm, or 4cm for sabre)

Yeah....but the rules aren't perfect in that regard. What's the specified length of the insulating tape on a foil blade? 15cm....period, stop...there's no max or min length...just 15cm.

In reality it's anhy length UP TO 15cm from the base of teh barrel...but the rules do not reflect that...probably the same for the gabarit.

[KD5MDK]

Well, I just wanted to note that margin of error is officially defined in a few cases, so the FIE has at some time heard of the idea.

I know a division which is writing a bylaw (or directive or something) as to the proper sizing of strips including margin of error, so that clubs with 12m strips at best can't complain that no one follows the rules when a tournament is given to a club with 13.95m strips.

[DHCJr]

Well, I just wanted to note that margin of error is officially defined in a few cases, so the FIE has at some time heard of the idea.

I know a division which is writing a bylaw (or directive or something) as to the proper sizing of strips including margin of error, so that clubs with 12m strips at best can't complain that no one follows the rules when a tournament is given to a club with 13.95m strips.

I think we agree, we are just saying it differently. They do have tolerances for many things, even items you did not mention, like the wire of the mesh of the mask. They just don't have tolerances for other items. For example, they have less than 5 ohms for lame', but no tolerances for the equipment that does the testing.

The FIE rules are poorly written and I am the first to admit it. See how much complaining I have done on the new M.25.3. They should have a 'Generic' tolerance for everything that is not covered by specific tolerances, but they don't. I wish they did.

[KD5MDK]

Would a generic tolerance work? I mean, something like 1% is probably acceptable in almost all circumstances, but may be too precise for others, etc.

Fixing the rulebook would take so much work I'm not sure it's practical.

[DHCJr]

Having one tolerance for all would be ludicrous, but it is better than nothing. Your statement about the length of a strip is a good example.

About fixing the rule book, you are probably right. About 20 years ago I was in a town that still had on the books that you had to call the sherriff 30 minutes prior to driving a automobile into town. This had an interstate running through the town. They hadn't fixed that.

Take for example Foil timing. In the M section you can find a rule that states the off-target timing can be infinitely small. As we all know, that was not true even with the old timing. But I still wish they would try.

[KD5MDK]

I'm also worried about what new idiocies would be introduced with a rewrite.

[DHCJr]

Here is something I just noticed that I find interesting. They do have one tolerance for the Gabarit and that is for the eccentricity of the Epee Guard. The trouble is what does "Tolerance = 10/12 mm" mean?

[KD5MDK]

Excellent question.

Edit: Until I hear differently (which if my interpretation is ever used will be very quickly), it sounds like they mean + or - ten twelveths of a milimeter, or .8333333333 mm.

[Mergs]

Would a generic tolerance work? I mean, something like 1% is probably acceptable in almost all circumstances, but may be too precise for others, etc.

Fixing the rulebook would take so much work I'm not sure it's practical.

In manufacturing tolerances, unless absolutely necessary to fit and function, are generic based on the dimension, e.g. .X +/- .05 or .XX +/- .01 or .XXX +/-.001

[DHCJr]

Excellent question.

Edit: Until I hear differently (which if my interpretation is ever used will be very quickly), it sounds like they mean + or - ten twelveths of a milimeter, or .8333333333 mm.

This is a good thought, but why such an odd amount?

[KD5MDK]

Well, I was taking literally something which I believe was not meant to be. 10/12 is .8333(infinite 3s), so that's how I developed my interpretation. I believe they probably meant something else, but how and what they mean by 10/12 mm I don't know.

[yeoldearmourer]

HEre a interested tibbit. The 1964 Olympics in Japan the Gabarit was made out of cast iron it weighted several pound and accord tom Joe Brynes it didnt change due to weather or humdity but it required several big person to move it. The japanese read the rule book didnt realized they could have used wood.