USFA membership fees...How much?

[seak]

The topic came up in the BoD meeting thread.

How much should the USFA charge for membership fees?

What do you get for your membership?

Should there be a college discount?

What about a lower fee for fencers who only fence in division level tournaments?

Rolling membership or a percentage based system such that if you join in March your membership doesn't expire till next March or you only pay a percentage of the $50. dues based on what percentage of the year you are a member.

Discuss

[seak]

In answer to question 2. Insurance, and national office staff so they can process rating changes answer questions etc (from previous thread), as well as the magazine

[Mr Epee]

Here is the USA Tae Kwon Do membership, and benefits information.

It's surprising how much people appreciate the little things, like patches.

You will notice that Athlete Membership is only $35.00 / year, and life time membership is only $500.00 / year (note: half of USFA rate).

I can't find it now, but a couple months back I had a hard copy of USA-TKD's marketing plan, and IIRC there was also some sort of tierd incentive program for clubs recruiting x number of members.

Another example of an NGB utilizing a novice membership category.

USA Diving
Junior Athlete Membership $75.00
Limited Athlete Membership $15.00
Masters Athlete Membership $75.00
Novice Athlete Membership $25.00
Senior Athlete Membership $75.00

Non-Athlete Memberships
Coach Membership $150.00
Family Membership $75.00
Individual Membership $50.00
Official Membership $75.00

USA Gymnastics

USA Gymnastics has a $15.00 low-level competitor membership. That membership category doesn't include the magazine subscription which can be purchased seperately for $19.95. They also have a Team USA Gymnastics club that is essentially just a booster club for the National Team - price: $25 - including the magazine subscription, and a boat load of goofy little perks like nylon bags, window stickers, bumper stickers, discount cards, etc...

-------------------------

Oiuyu is worried about hemorraging members out of the undifferentiated membership category into more appropriate categories? In my opinion it would better serve the long term goal of the USFA to properly match the correct product with appropriate consumer.

[keith]

Wait. USdiving has an online waiver for membership....

.....shouldn't someone tell them this will void their insurance and leave the liable to massive lawsuits every week for all eternity?

[Mr Epee]

Originally Posted by keith

Wait. USdiving has an online waiver for membership....

.....shouldn't someone tell them this will void their insurance and leave the liable to massive lawsuits every week for all eternity?

They also have required coaching certification to ensure the safety and correct training of their participants. They're a pretty kick *** organization.

[JEC]

As the party responsible for paying for more than 10% of the supporting life members (there are 19 members and I pay for me and my son), I think that spreading the payment of a life membership through 10 years does not seem particularly a blockbuster idea, and spreading it over 5 years might be easier for all parties involved. Obviously, this does not appear to be a crucial issue as we are only 19 members who took USFA on this idea.

One thing that USFA could do is to better promote the idea. As a father of a 14 year old who has fenced for 7 years, he felt that this was a great gift to him. Buying him a Life membership over 9 years (10 payments each spaced over a year).

PROs:

• Less paperwork - less number of applications
• Less chance of missing for a year (which means forfeating the cumulative credit to Life) - this might actually be an important positive aspect because animosity of that member when discovering that a lapse in membership while recovering from an injury.
• As fees change every 4 years or so, more predictable how much it will cost.

CONs:

• More cost per year (probably twice as current amount).
• Less revenue as the extra revenue from forfeating members (see above) would not be collected.
• Less number of applications for supporting life (as it is more expensive).

[seak]

oiuyt also mentioned the fact that if you go to a lot of tournaments a year the 50 dollars becomes incidental, especially given the high cost of division tournaments in some areas like capitol division.

However if you are only going to one tournament a month and none over July and August even if you are paying 20 dollars a tournament 50 dollars is still a large percentage of your cost, even if its not the majority

[KShan5[PrFC]]

50 dollars is fine, I see no problem with this price

[Frank Pratt]

One thing to realize is that the more members an organization has, the lower the dues can be. Diving, TKD, Gymnastics, etc. are all very popular sports on this side of the pond. Most Americans, however, associate fencing with animal containment, not swords.

As far as rolling membership and paying for a partial first year, these are great ideas, but it would be a huge organizational headache at the national office, and no one would ever remember when their membership needs to be renewed. The national office could send out renewal notices, of course, but more than a few notices would not get to the member sue to moving, clerical error, computer glitches, human error, and lost mail. Furthermore, it would only save future members a few bucks, and the it would be a one-time savings.

I can’t argue against giving college fencers a break. Gotta have some $$ left over for Ramen!

There used to be a cheaper "fence for fun" membership, which allowed the fencer to compete at "local" divisional tournaments only. They are only restricted from national tournaments, world cups, and qualifiers to these events. Only other major restriction was that they could not earn a rating. Anyone know why they ditched this, or did they just rename it "non-competitive" membership?

The USFA's lifetime membership was only $500 about a decade ago. Wish I had taken advantage of it at the time. I'm sure I've paid far more than that in dues already.

[Mr Epee]

For some people 50usd is absolutely appropriate - for other's it's not.

I would go so far as to say that it's a bargain for coaches, and athletes competing at the NAC level.

It is drastically over priced as an accompanying product for an intro class.

Think how many people are cycled through starter classes each year. If I were the USFA, I would want some data on these folks who are visiting the sport. These classes often run for 6-12 weeks and cost between $50 - $150. Tacking on a $15 - $25 USFA membership is easy - $50 is hard.

The USFA doesn't service all it's members equally...

[Mr Epee]

Originally Posted by Frank Pratt

One thing to realize is that the more members an organization has, the lower the dues can be. Diving, TKD, Gymnastics, etc. are all very popular sports on this side of the pond. Most Americans, however, associate fencing with animal containment, not swords.

Membership fees shouldn't be viewed as a primary revenue source.

Take a look at US Syncro Swimming - notice anything at the bottom of the page???????????

Yep, alt revenue sources.

[KD5MDK]

What should?

[keith]

Originally Posted by Frank Pratt

One thing to realize is that the more members an organization has, the lower the dues can be. Diving, TKD, Gymnastics, etc. are all very popular sports on this side of the pond.

Not wanting to disagree - but there are more fencing clubs (6+) near me than diving clubs (2).

Georgia has 3 diving clubs.

The size of the organization isn't much of a factor here I don't think.



Having graded rates makes alot of sense. There is a difference between what a competitive member will pay for membership ($50 dollars becomes loose change) and what we should be charging to attract people into the sport. Or what could be charged for 'sponsoring memberships' for that matter.

Then there is the question of whether the huddled masses of regional fencers would be better served by more of the membership monies (for non-NAC fencers) flowing straight to the divisions in which they do their fencing. Now this can all go via the USFA; they keep the full dues for national members but send back the funds for regional members.

[Schiavona]

In an earlier thread the idea of a "competition licence" was suggested. I think this would handle a lot of concerns. Say $30 to join the USFA allowing the fencer to fence, and EARN A RATING, at tournaments below NACs, JOs and Summer Nationals. Add $20 for a National Competition Licence. Right now I can sell a $30 membership to people in my division easier than $50. To the majority of the membership their $50 drops into a hole and all they see is a magazine 4 times a year.

I do know that the 'Fence For Fun' memberships caused a lot of headaches in my division with people thinking it gave them full competitive acess.

[bezoar]

In an earlier thread the idea of a "competition licence" was suggested. I think this would handle a lot of concerns. Say $30 to join the USFA allowing the fencer to fence, and EARN A RATING, at tournaments below NACs, JOs and Summer Nationals. Add $20 for a National Competition Licence.

I think this is a great idea. It lowers the cost both both for the introductory and casual fencer. Sorta takes D+F+P's idea a little further.

As a new fencer that joined in January, I took the option of a 3 year membership in order to diminish my overall membership cost, and to lessen the sting of paying a full year dues for half a year's participation. The gamble is that I'm counting on not becoming ill/injured/frustrated and leave the sport early.

Schiavona's proposition lessens the gamble.

[tbryan]

Originally Posted by bezoar

I think this is a great idea. It lowers the cost both both for the introductory and casual fencer. Sorta takes D+F+P's idea a little further.

As a new fencer that joined in January, I took the option of a 3 year membership in order to diminish my overall membership cost, and to lessen the sting of paying a full year dues for half a year's participation. The gamble is that I'm counting on not becoming ill/injured/frustrated and leave the sport early.

Schiavona's proposition lessens the gamble.

I always take the 3 year option specifically because I may leave the sport before the membership is up. For example, I might move before my membership expires.

Getting that magazine and other division/section information mailed to my house for an additional year or two reminds me, "Hey...I miss fencing. Now that I'm settled, let me try to find a fencing club in my area."

[oiuyt]

Originally Posted by Schiavona

In an earlier thread the idea of a "competition licence" was suggested. I think this would handle a lot of concerns. Say $30 to join the USFA allowing the fencer to fence, and EARN A RATING, at tournaments below NACs, JOs and Summer Nationals. Add $20 for a National Competition Licence. Right now I can sell a $30 membership to people in my division easier than $50. To the majority of the membership their $50 drops into a hole and all they see is a magazine 4 times a year.

I do know that the 'Fence For Fun' memberships caused a lot of headaches in my division with people thinking it gave them full competitive acess.

Okay, now let's modify the cost structure to be $40 for the local license and $20 for the national license to be (relatively, back of envelope) revenue-neutral.*

You now have a $40 FFF membership (with classifications) and a $60 full membership. With all the problems that FFF had until it was killed. Is that really a worthwhile trade-off? Why now when it wasn't a year-and-a-half ago?

-B
*alternative: $30 local, $40+ add-on for national

[seak]

Originally Posted by oiuyt

Okay, now let's modify the cost structure to be $40 for the local license and $20 for the national license to be (relatively, back of envelope) revenue-neutral.*

You now have a $40 FFF membership (with classifications) and a $60 full membership. With all the problems that FFF had until it was killed. Is that really a worthwhile trade-off? Why now when it wasn't a year-and-a-half ago?

-B
*alternative: $30 local, $40+ add-on for national

Except that IMHO more people will sign up with a cheaper membership, so to break even it's only a 5:3 ration (5 people at 30 = 3 people at 50) and some people will still sign up with the regular membership

Also as I understand it part of the problem with FFF memberships was that you couldn't earn a rating. With this proposal you could earn a rating at a division tournament you just can't go to a NAC.

[KD5MDK]

Originally Posted by Mr Epee

Take a look at US Syncro Swimming - notice anything at the bottom of the page???????????

Yep, alt revenue sources.

I'm afraid their website is down.