Best Countries & Best Cities

[Fencergrl]

I posted the following in another thread, but thought it might be better if it had it's own thread.

Actually... the good old U.S. of A is the 13th best country. Ireland is the best in 2005... Best Countries

I was surprised to find my home town to be tied in first place as one of the best cities. Best Cities

[SJB]

Calgary came 16th.

Pretty good considering we beat out some bigger, but apparently not better, cities.

And hey, Edmonton didn't even make the list.

[Fencergrl]

LOL... Yes I do believe that was the purpose of the survey. To prove to the Oiler's fans that the Flames are better....

[Gav]

Scotland - and Edinburgh.

There are days when I am walking down the street, jaded with familiarity, and I see the sun (either rising or setting) shines across Waverley bridge illuminating the medieval skyline and my breath is taken away. Similarly on a dark night, when there is a fine drizzle in the air, if you look from Princes Street the castle looks stunning in the diffuse light that surrounds it.

The views often make me glad that I live here.

The only downside is the shopping - but that's what we have Glasgow for.

[Furry]

For the record, I'd like to point out that it's a list of cities that are good for expatriates to live in. It's not so much about the quality of life in the city, but how easy it is to live in if you're not from said country.

So Calgary, as the business centre of Alberta, should naturally rank higher than Edmonton, if Edmonton even ranks (which it doesn't).

Not that I'm saying Calgary is a bad city, it isn't. It's just no City of Champions.








My dad's from Edmonton, things like this are bred into you.

[Zilverzmurfen]

Heh, Sweden's ranked 5th.

My city wasn't on the list, but Stockholm is on 16th place. Heja Sverige!

[Fencergrl]

Heh, Sweden's ranked 5th.

My city wasn't on the list, but Stockholm is on 16th place. Heja Sverige!

So I take it Ess will be moving to Sweden rather than vice-versa???

[Fencergrl]

So Calgary, as the business centre of Alberta, should naturally rank higher than Edmonton, if Edmonton even ranks (which it doesn't).

I've been to one end of Alberta to the other... Edmonton is a much prettier city than Calgary. However, Calgary has better weather and closer to the Trans-Canada. So my vote goes to Red Deer!
You're welcome James!

[Robert Smith]

I was surprised to find my home town to be tied in first place as one of the best cities. Best Cities

I guess Victoria just ain't big enough. But, as they say, size isn't everything, and, personally, I think Victoria wins hands down in just about every other category. Way less rain, for one thing. Vancouver always strikes me as a beautiful setting ruined by an ugly city. Pick up Toronto and drop it in place of Victoria, then you'd really have something. Nice size, well laid out, and with the ideal climate and environs to match.

[Fencergrl]

I guess Victoria just ain't big enough.... Vancouver always strikes me as a beautiful setting ruined by an ugly city.

Victoria is a beautiful city, it doesn't have the mountains surrounding it like Vancouver, but still I prefer Victoria in many ways. Its smaller size is part of the appeal.

However... is it as liveable?? Some people prefer a city of substantial size. Ability to find work is part of what makes a city liveable; Victoria lacks the range of business and employment opportunities. There’s a reason it is said it is a city for “the newly wed and the nearly dead”.

You're also held at ransom to whatever price or schedule the ferries want to charge if you want to get off the island. For me, that’s a huge factor as to why my husband and I are not considering going there for our retirement.

As for Toronto.... ugggh that gets my vote for the ugliest city in Canada.

[AndrewH]

Having lived in BC (few years in Penticton, few years in Port Moody), as well as having spent lots of time with family on Vancouver Island and in Toronto, I can definetly vouch for what Robert Smith is saying. Vancouver is a beautiful area, but the city itself is so-so. At least it doesn't close at 8pm like most of Toronto seems to do...

As for Victoria, it's a great place to visit but I find it a bit too touristy to actually live there. And yes, there is very little in the way of an employment market, at least employment enough to afford living there. You'd be best off going as a retiree and living off your pension check and a part time job.

That being said my plan at this point is to move to Vancouver after college to pursue a law degree and settle in there, or someplace else in Canada (Toronto is my second choice). All these city quality of life polls can't be wrong...

[Black Jeebus]

I was going to ask how Atlanta could beat any other city, but I forgot that someone told me this past weekend that as far as learning to fence in the Southeast Section Atlanta is where you have to be. On that note I guess I understand how it can be so high rated.

[oiuyt]

I don't know about that list.... My sister is currently an expat living in Copenhagen and, from what I can gather, she might not rank it in the top 8 (Copenhagen's ranking in the list) cities the she, personally, has lived in. On the other hand she's likely to agree with the strong rankings of the Australian cities.

Nice to see my (real) hometown ranked at the #2 US city (#28 overall, and behind only Honolulu in the US). Philadelphia isn't listed.

-B

[telkanuru]

Boston's in 28th... I dunno, I like it rather more than that.

[fencergal33]

I don't know about that list.... My sister is currently an expat living in Copenhagen and, from what I can gather, she might not rank it in the top 8 (Copenhagen's ranking in the list) cities the she, personally, has lived in. On the other hand she's likely to agree with the strong rankings of the Australian cities.

Nice to see my (real) hometown ranked at the #2 US city (#28 overall, and behind only Honolulu in the US). Philadelphia isn't listed.

-B

You mean filthydelphia? I wonder why?

(Don't worry Philly people, I grew up there.)

[SJB]

Just to add to the Canadian cities debate:

I like Vancouver. Some of my family lives there (my great uncle built the Second Narrows) and actual Vancouver is nice whereas I can do without suburbs like Burnaby, ick. But that is Vancouver for you. Real Vancouver is about this big <..> whereas Vancouver and suburbs is <..............> (with a few arrows in every other direction too.

Victoria is beautiful but the ancient population combined with the British sensibilites make it praticularly unnatractive to live in if you're under 60. I vist Victoria as I have some friends doing their Masters at UVic and enjoy it muchly. Really though, no sewage system?!

Most of BC is enjoyable. Minus the hippies in the interior and the rednecks in the far north, like Fort St.John where my girlfriend is from. Gotta love places where your penis size is directly related to the size of your truck.

As for the Calgary-Edmonton debate ... each has it's benefits. Edmonton has all of the cultural institutions but Calgary has the money, restaurants, shopping and night life. Of course I'm biased.

The east coast is also lovely. Halifax is a particular favourite. Minus the utter lack of a viable economy and thus gainful employment (which is why they ALL move to Alberta) in the region.

Ontario can be nice. I have family in Waterloo and visit every couple of years.

But as Westerners, we can all agree that we would live anywhere in the country but Toronto correct?

[Robert Smith]

Victoria is a beautiful city, it doesn't have the mountains surrounding it like Vancouver, but still I prefer Victoria in many ways. Its smaller size is part of the appeal.

It does, they're just not so accessible. On a clear day, I can see Mt. Baker from my office window, and the Olympics are visible from all over the city.

However... is it as liveable?? Some people prefer a city of substantial size. Ability to find work is part of what makes a city liveable; Victoria lacks the range of business and employment opportunities. There’s a reason it is said it is a city for “the newly wed and the nearly dead”.

It's not as bad as once it was. Oak Bay is no longer the bastion of the blue rinse; but, yes, employment is limited. There's the government, there's the university, there's tourism, there's .. bugger all else. No big employers, leastwise.

You're also held at ransom to whatever price or schedule the ferries want to charge if you want to get off the island. For me, that’s a huge factor as to why my husband and I are not considering going there for our retirement.

But that's the problem with all of Canada; everything's so far apart. I moved here from the UK over 20 years ago, and one of the things I truly miss is the proximity of great masses of people. Lived in London for several years befoer that, and Toronto (what, 2.5 million? 5 million since it ate Mississauga, and probably Brampton, Oakville, Newmarket, and maybe even Barrie by now) seemed so small after that. But at least there you have the rest of the Golden Horseshoe within spitting distance, and Ottawa's only 350 km / 220 miles away - assuming anyone would ever go willingly to Ottawa, except to see the Leafs knock the Sens out of the playoffs yet again.

Take fencing as a good reason to travel. There are maybe five clubs in Vancouver, not all of whom seem to be on speaking terms with each other; there are two clubs here in Victoria, though the other is still in a snit over our defection two years ago and isn't on speaking terms (fencing, huh? no team players). Where else can you go? Seattle, Bellingham? Almost 200km from Vancouver, an entire day trip from Victoria. Calgary? Almost 700km. Nationals, last seen in Saskatoon, 1,200 km away. And always in Montreal, 3,700 km away. Canadian distances are just plain obscene. Give me distances like the North of England, say, where Leeds and Manchester - both over 2 million - are only 35 miles apart. But there's no place like home, and I guess there never was.

As for Toronto.... ugggh that gets my vote for the ugliest city in Canada.

Never could understand why that's such a common reaction. It's reasonably large, pretty clean, well endowed with green space, good transit system, lots of employment. Tourism, but not enough to be irksome. No mountains, but the lake has its charms. Yer standard north american grid, but Vancouver would be too if it wasn't built on lumps and around puddles, and at least Toronto has street names, not numbers. The climate is awful, otherwise I think we'd still be there. Four weeks of pleasant each year just isn't enough.

[PalmFrond]

Ireland gets first place, but Dublin comes joint 52nd...I'd say that that's about right (snigger - I'm a culchie/bogger/country boy living in this festering armpit of a city and it's nice to see it being put in its place). That said, I'm surprised to see that rural Ireland is such a good place to live in - poor infrastructure, rural depopulation and horrid dormitory towns mar it somewhat for me.

[PeterGustafsson]

Hi!

Excerpts from the country ranking:

11. Singapore
13. USA
14. Canada
15. New Zealand
17. Japan
20. Austria
25. France
26. Germany
29. Britain

Singapore before those countries???

I read the .pdf file explaining the methodology behind the ranking. In short, they asked people in various countries how satisfied they were with their life. Then, the country average of that value was correlated against a selection of measurable variables which could be assumed to be predictive of personal happiness. It was found that 9 of those had a meaningful correlation. Then, the measured values of those 9 variables were weighted together so that one achieved a good overall match for the polled countries. Then, the thusly obtained variable weight coefficients were used to obtain a quality of life index value for many unpolled countries. Multivariate regression analysis, essentially.

The list shows a flaw with the method (there are others, look at the pdf and apply your statistics knowledge) - even if people seem to like to live in a country, it may not be a good place anyway.

Singapore seems to be a case in point. Good place for meek sheep who accept to be ruled, and the despots who rule them.

I would personally reweight the coefficients so that political freedom was more important. For other people, other variables may be of another importance than they are assigned in this index. I would assume that there are many people for which the money factor should be almighty. For the factor "gender equality" (defined as ratio between female and male average wages, laws are not considered) I would guess that the factor weight would be very small for most males, while females would value it considerably higher.

Also, the countries are evaluated on their country averages of the values, the intra-country spread was not taken into account for any variable.

A+ for effort, but the methodological problems are huge.

It would be good if the listing would come with an applet, where the individual reader could input the relative weighting coefficients of the variables according to his choice.


Have a nice time!

Peter Gustafsson

[Gav]

Personally, I think that 'opinion' should be ignored. It could be included in an interesting addendum to main study, but in the main it is an unreliable indicator.