Vniti Bells

[fencinman89]

Ladies and gentleman, it is official:
Vniti bell guards are NOT made of Titanium, they are made of heavy duty aluminum. I don't say this in a bad way towards Vniti the bells are superior. Although they are advertised by some as Titanium, theyre I believe type 11 or 12 aluminum.
-Tre'

[Zilverzmurfen]

Actually they're advertised as titanium/aluminium alloy guards.
If it is 'official', could you provide us with a source?

I have several of these guards for my weapons (I'm phazing out my old stainless steel and aluminium guards for these, I like them a lot) bought from allstar GER. I don't know who manufactured them but they're not stamped Vniti. In fact, they're not stamped at all.

[fencinman89]

A test I performed myself, under proper supervision of course. I took one of my bells and brought it to a grinder. Aluminum does not spark AT ALL, when grinded(ground) it did not spark. Titanium when grinded sparks bright easily visible white sparks which is why it is often used in fireworks. If it had contained any titanium, why was there not a single spark? Try it yourself.
-Tre'
P.S.- Where safety goggles.

[Amadeus]

P.S.- Where safety goggles.

i think that's your problem. you're the one who's working with metals like that, you should certainly know where your goggles are before you do the experiment.

[PeterGustafsson]

Hi!

Actually they're advertised as titanium/aluminium alloy guards.
If it is 'official', could you provide us with a source?

I have several of these guards for my weapons (I'm phazing out my old stainless steel and aluminium guards for these, I like them a lot) bought from allstar GER. I don't know who manufactured them but they're not stamped Vniti. In fact, they're not stamped at all.

Is there any alloy percentage listed? Aluminum has a density of 2.7, while Titanium has a density of 4.9. If you do a density measurement by using the water-displacement method and measure weight carefully, you should be able to get a reasonably good estimate of the Al/Ti percentages.

If you have an old alloy bell, you can do some destructive testing. Al and Ti have different electrical conductivities. If you cut out a strip of the metal and measure the electrical resistance, you can get a rough estimate of the metal percentages.

Al melts at 327 centigrade IIRC, while Ti melts at a considerably higher temperature. Al can be molten in a bunsen burner, and any Ti will be present as a solid residue if you pour away the molten Al. That is if the Ti percentage is so high that not all Ti is present as solid solution in Al-Ti phase. I do not know the eutectic temperature and composition of that alloy system, but it could be looked up.

Al and Ti also differ greatly in chemical resistance. If you put a test sample in dilute battery acid, any Ti should be present as a solid residue. Such a test requires safety precations. Wear goggles and protective gloves!


Have a nice time!

Peter Gustafsson

[Zilverzmurfen]

Is there any alloy percentage listed?

Not that I could see on the allstar GER website.
I was interested in knowing who manufactured these guards and dropped them an e-mail asking them -- I never received a reply.

Aluminum has a density of 2.7 bla bla bla etc...

Awww, that's too bad. I only recently got rid of my bunsen burner and battery acid, what a shame...

(That said: I have no intention of performing these tests as my chemical skills are . Also my guards are still too new for wanting to dispose of one for scientific research! )

[DangerMouse]

BTW, the Vniti USA website (www.vnitiusa.com) has the guards listed with the following description:

"These Guards are forged from a single piece of hardened aluminum alloy."

[fencinman89]

BTW, the Vniti USA website (www.vnitiusa.com) has the guards listed with the following description:

"These Guards are forged from a single piece of hardened aluminum alloy."

Can aluminum be hardened? I thought the carbon level was too low.
-Tre'

[KD5MDK]

Pretty much any useful metal can be alloyed into specialized forms, can't it?

[fencinman89]

I suppose, but how much alloy would have to be added for it to be able to become hardenable?
-Tre'

[Artisan]

Can aluminum be hardened? I thought the carbon level was too low.
-Tre'

Tre-
That the Vniti guards are not titanium is not news, however there is a vendor that sells them that calls them titanium, but doesn't actually claim they are made from the namesake metal. I have a platimum Visa card... its made of plastic.

There is no type 11 or 12 aluminum. There are however many grades of aluminum with a wide range of properties. The stongest are the aircraft grades which are numbered 20xx and 70xx. Aluminum cannot be hardened, and its alloys do not include carbon, it but it can be tempered, which increases its yield strength. 7075 has a yield strength of 40 Ksi, when tempered to T6 specification it almost doubles to 75 Ksi. Pure aluminum is only about 13 ksi.

Regardless of the metalurgy, the Vniti guards are by far the most superior epee guards made. The 4 that I use 2x week for the past year show only scratches, and one has a very minor dent. Any other brand of guard would look like an old trash can lid by now.

[fencinman89]

Thanx for setting me straight on that. I appreciate it.
-Tre'