Stiff non-FIE epee blades?

[Moniteur]

I've been primarily using BF FIE epee blades, but being in law school has put a serious crimp in my budget recently. Can anyone suggest an epee blade that won't break the bank, but has a similar stiffness as the stiffer of the BF blades?

I've handled some Vniti FIE and non FIE, Dinamo non-FIE and didn't much care for them - they were far too soft for my taste. The one StM non-FIE that I have handled was better, but not quite stiff enough.

Anyone have any experience with the Uhlmann FS (Scaroni) blades? My last Scaroni experiences were the pre-S2000 sabre blades, and various old-stock dry foil blades that I still have lying around. I am particularly interested in these - assuming the epee blades don't come only in wet noodle and al dente noodle varieties like the old sabre blades did.

What about the new Prieur stuff?

I haven't handled any of the non-FIE BF blades either..

Suggestions?

Thanks,
Chris

[Purple Fencer]

Every BG epee blade I've ever worked on has always felt like a piece of rebar...

[pti_fenceur(fr)]

the leon paul's blade seems great to.
personnaly I use BF FIE blades...it's expensive but these are for me the bests blades of the moment

[Barry Paul]

Most maraging epee blades sold seem to be stiffer than the maximimu regulation, which many epeeiest prefer, Slight problem is that on all our F.I.E. Leon Paul epee blades we engrave the flexibility, so being an ethical firm we only make our stiff epee blades to the maximum stifness.(45).

[ReverseLunge]

FIE is cheaper. An Fie blade can cost twice as much or a bit more but they last 5-10 times longer than the non FIE blades.

[ReverseLunge]

Most maraging epee blades sold seem to be stiffer than the maximimu regulation, which many epeeiest prefer, Slight problem is that on all our F.I.E. Leon Paul epee blades we engrave the flexibility, so being an ethical firm we only make our stiff epee blades to the maximum stifness.(45).

You are a sensible guy so why would you even make non FIE blades? Do you agree that non FIE blades break much more often than FIE blades. Do you believe that FIE blades are safer?

The only reason to market non FIE blades is to make money of the cheap people. If only they can get passed the immediate savings then they will see that it is actually much cheaper to buy good FIE stuff.

[I live to FENCE]

Currently, I'm using BF FIE Cartels... Before I got any FIE blades, I used the Uhlmann 'Ultra' blade... Or at least that was what my coach told me... Anyways, those are good blades with balance similar to the BF Cartels i'm currently using and are quite stiff. The downside is that after a few months of heavy usage (in my experience between 5-6 mths, 5-6 days a week), they start to turn very, very soft, to the extent that i had to straighten my blade between every point. They broke after about 8 months of use. IMO, these are one of the finest non-FIE blade i have used in my short fencing career(3 years).


A small note of interest : I just turned 15 today... Haha

[Cyranox11]

I would guess that Barry makes non-FIE blades because people want to buy non-FIE blades. If there is a market for a product people will serve that market. So long as the product is safe (ie for its intended purpose) cool.

Non FIE blades are (imho) safe...

As far as stiff epee blades go I was very surprised in Leipzig when one of our teams members' epee blade was failed for being too stiff! I would like to know whether the weapons check people checked every single blade or only did random checks.

Seems odd that only one should have failed as all her blades were from the same manufacturer.

[JEC]

Blades are still made by hand. Too stiff might be from human error for only a single blade out of the batch. That might be an alternative explanation to random check.

[Barry Paul]

You are a sensible guy so why would you even make non FIE blades? Do you agree that non FIE blades break much more often than FIE blades. Do you believe that FIE blades are safer?

The only reason to market non FIE blades is to make money of the cheap people. If only they can get passed the immediate savings then they will see that it is actually much cheaper to buy good FIE stuff.

Before having a slight go you might want to check your facts Leon Paul only sell non F.I.E. maraging blades made in our lightweight form, because of there design and lower stress, although not as long lasting as the F.I.E. they have proved in use , over the last 10 years, to have a life at least three times longer than normal epee blades. Although more expensive we believe this is what is best for the fencer, although we could, as you point out make more money selling the shorter life standard epee blades.

[epeeisky]

The Triplette house brand is made by BF, and is extremly stiff and heavier than my other blades. It hasnt broken after a year and holds up very well.

[Barry Paul]

If you mean the blade is so stiff it is non.F.I.E. regulation you should not be fencing with it. If you know it is not regulation, you are cheating if you continue to use it in a competition. It is dangerous and at the very least painful when fencers have the miss-fortune to fence you.

[Moniteur]

If you mean the blade is so stiff it is non.F.I.E. regulation you should not be fencing with it. If you know it is not regulation, you are cheating if you continue to use it in a competition. It is dangerous and at the very least painful when fencers have the miss-fortune to fence you.

I appreciate your input - however, I must point out that nobody here has said anything about knowingly and willfully buying epee blades that are illegally stiff, or illegally whippy for that matter. Extremely stiff for some, may be soft for others, and soft for some, may be very stiff for others.

The original question was 'a blade similar to the stiffer of the BF FIE blades, but that won't break the bank.'

I won't claim to know whether or not the BF FIE blades are illegally stiff or not. I have always assumed (yes, I know the danger in that) that blades legitimately marked FIE would have to pass all the general requirements for blades, including flex, and thus be legal. Perhaps that isn't the case.

I do thank you all for your recommendations thus far.

I am still interested in whether anyone has any experience with the Prieur or Scaroni blades (also if anyone has used the new S2000 Scaroni sabre blades as well)

Thanks,
chris

[neevel]

Lammet (LM)- they're what I've got on all my epees (FIE, though). At least as stiff as BF, though a bit heavier. Even the FIE ones are not nearly so dear as BF FIEs, so you may be able to swing that.

My experience with StMs is that they feel nice when new, but turn into noodles after a few hard hits.

BF non-FIEs are also on the stiff side, but aren't always the best for durability.

The new Prieur blades are distinctly softer than BFs, and I've seen more than a few (FIE ones) break rather early (imo).

As for some FIE epee blades being illegally stiff, yes, that does happens. I once found that 2 of a US team member's epees (BFs whites) were too stiff when I was checking them before submitting to control. Fortunately he had a couple of spares along that did pass flexibility. Control at a World Championships will check every weapon on the gabarit.

-Dave

[houdini1982]

The Triplette Blades are (In my experence at least) are stiff, though I prefer a light flexable blade. They are excelent blades and last a very good amount of time. They are made by BF so they are the same as anyother BF blade reguardless of the company that has Marcell Blaise has his employs put on them. From what I have read and from my conversations with both Walter the founder and The Simpsons the new owners TCA is Authorized BF dealer for the US. This lets them buy directly from the factory, insted from Uhlmann, Cartel, or the others.

[Moniteur]

Lammet (LM)- they're what I've got on all my epees (FIE, though). At least as stiff as BF, though a bit heavier. Even the FIE ones are not nearly so dear as BF FIEs, so you may be able to swing that.

My experience with StMs is that they feel nice when new, but turn into noodles after a few hard hits.

BF non-FIEs are also on the stiff side, but aren't always the best for durability.

The new Prieur blades are distinctly softer than BFs, and I've seen more than a few (FIE ones) break rather early (imo).

As for some FIE epee blades being illegally stiff, yes, that does happens. I once found that 2 of a US team member's epees (BFs whites) were too stiff when I was checking them before submitting to control. Fortunately he had a couple of spares along that did pass flexibility. Control at a World Championships will check every weapon on the gabarit.

-Dave

Dave,

Thanks for the info. I know PBT sells the LM sabre blades, but I don't have any idea who sells the LM epees.. What brand names/retailers are these sold under/by?

I'd prefer to stick with BF FIE blades - but frankly law school has limited my real fencing to about 1 or *maybe* 2 nights a week, and no tournament time at all, so durability probably isn't as big an issue. the big big problem with the BF FIE blades is scraping together the cash for them. Until I'm out of school and back in the real world though, I suppose cheap will be the word of the day.

thanks,
Chris

[Mr Epee]

I've been primarily driving Lotus sports cars, but being in law school has put a serious crimp in my budget recently. Can anyone suggest Sports Car that won't break the bank, but has a similar power and control as my old Lotus?

I've handled some Hondas, Toyotas and didn't much care for them - they were far too soft for my taste. The one Volkswagen that I tested was better, but not quite stiff enough.

Anyone have any experience with the Dolorian cars? My last Dolorian experiences were in 1984, and various an old junkers that I still have lying around.

Go to a competition and try a few.

Only you know what you will like, and it sounds like you are extremely picky.

[Moniteur]

Go to a competition and try a few.

Only you know what you will like, and it sounds like you are extremely picky.

Hmm... you're probably right.

Perhaps I'll branch out a bit, buy a couple of cheapies, and see if I can find something I can live with/like until I have some sort of cashflow again.. Too bad there isn't a NAC in KC this year, that'd be right up the road from me. Anyway, thanks for the reality check.

[fencinman89]

I bought an Allstar FS blade in miami, I love it But its whippier than my broken in Vniti's.
-Tre'

[epeeisky]

If you mean the blade is so stiff it is non.F.I.E. regulation you should not be fencing with it. If you know it is not regulation, you are cheating if you continue to use it in a competition. It is dangerous and at the very least painful when fencers have the miss-fortune to fence you.

First off these Triplette house brand epees that I was refering to are non-FIE, so they will not conform to set FIE standards. When I buy a blade I assume that it is safe to fence with, this may not eb a good assumption, but I assume it anyway. A large part of the pain that comes with a touch is how hard the fencer attacks. I have been hit with leon paul FIE epee blades that are very flexible and light and it still hurts simply because the fencer tried to impale me. You should be worried whether or not the fencer knows what they are doing, not whether their epee blade is slightly stiffer than normal.