Lessons from Katrina

[Epee_Pox]

In the interest of turning the Katrina discussions away from finger-pointing and pontification, towards something more positive and creative, let me ask:


What do you think are the lessons from Katrina that should now be learned by the American people, the federal government, and the state & local governments?

Don't just assign blame. If something was done wrong, explain what should be done to minimize the risk that fallible people don't make the same kind of mistake again in the future.

[Slim]

In the interest of turning the Katrina discussions away from finger-pointing and pontification, towards something more positive and creative, let me ask:


What do you think are the lessons from Katrina that should now be learned by the American people, the federal government, and the state & local governments?

Don't just assign blame. If something was done wrong, explain what should be done to minimize the risk that fallible people don't make the same kind of mistake again in the future.

1. Living below sea-level is not a wise thing unless you have gills.
2. The federal government should get out of the business of providing Flood Insurance.

[Fencergrl]

I think we should all be prepared in respect to natural disasters. As in this case, help can be a long way/time away.

If you have warning, you need to prepare. Fill your bathtub(s) and containers with water. Fill containers and put them in your freezer. This will not only help keep things cold, but provide water later on.

If you have a generator, get it out and fill with gas. Use this to keep your fridge running (and freezer if possible). Stock up on canned goods and camp fuel, propane and gas. Get out all your camping gear, most of it will be come in handy.

Shut off your natural gas, pull your main breaker and shut off your water. You want to remove yourself from the main infrastructure.

I would gather up the neighbours and ensure that they do the same. Pool your resources.... there is strength in numbers.

Any other suggestions???

[oso97]

When a major storm approaches a large city for which there is the potential for catastrophic damage and a breakdown in the basic socital "glue" that holds everything together, resources should be alerted ahead of time and pre-positioned to be able to go into the affected area as soon as possible afterwards.

Focus on the basics - Water, medical care, food and shelter, in that order, and you will have a lot fewer problems to deal with.

Katrina has shown us that when a major disaster strikes a city, and completely overwhelms its own resources, that taking 2-3 days to "assess the damage" another 2-3 to "coordinate the response" and another 2-3 still to get boots on the ground ends up with deploying more resources than would have been required in the first place, had they deployment been undertaken in a more expedited manner.

[duel mom]

More practice drills should be run and most importantly not just run but then evaluated to show holes and breakdowns that then can be fixed and the fix tried at the next practice drill.

I see an both an inherent problem and an advantage with first responders being from/of the community in trouble. In my view family comes first before job responsibilities, so before first responders can save anybody, they need to first save their families. However, rescuers from the community know best how to get around and where to look for trapped people.

Write a plan to evacuate and/or check on responders families early so the responders can focus on their jobs or bring in responders whose families are not in jeopardy.

[Have At You]

1) The Department of Homeland Security was an unecessary creation, which just made things worse. To fix the problems of two enormous bureaucracies (FBI & CIA), they created... yet another enormous bureaucracy. It's just too big and unwieldy to respond rapidly to an emergency, as Katrina demonstrated.

2) Don't put bureaucrats in charge of emergency response. They aren't used to action. Put people in charge who are used to taking charge and acting now now now.

3) Federal powers are limited by law (the President couldn't take charge of the National Guard without the Governor's okay, which she refused to give in time) (the Military cannot conduct police activities on US soil, so the Army was ready and waiting to act but could not until a waiver was secured). Therefore, the law needs to be changed to permit federal authorities to act when disaster strikes.

4) State and local governments must be accountable. They are the first responders -- police, firemen, city agencies, mayors, etc. A third of New Orleans' police force deserted! The Mayor abandoned the city's fleet of buses to the flood, instead of using them for evacuation. The Mayor failed to give police protection and supplies to the thousands who came to the Superdome and Convention Center. Instead of lifting a finger to do something, anything, the Mayor screamed to the cameras about how the feds weren't doing his job for him.

These failures are symptoms of a failure of accountability. Nobody took responsibility, because nobody ever took responsibility for anything before. It was always someone else's problem.

State and local authorities thus need to be made accountable as a matter of course, so that they are used to taking responsibility and acting responsibly when the need arises.

[counterattack]

As someone who lived in south Florida when Andrew (a cat 5) hit in 1992, I think the news could have done everyone a good turn by showing footage of the aftermath of Andrew BEFORE Katrina hit, rather than showing the traditional "here we are on the scene, my! Isn't it windy?" shots. If people had seen what a Cat 5 hurricane can do (they didn't know at the time it would weaken a little before landing) they wouldn't have entertained any of those ridiculous "we'll just stay here and weather it" thoughts. I have pictures of Homestead after Andrew where entire blocks are just gone. No trees. No houses. Just rubble and refrigerators, which were the only things too dense to blow away. Showing that, which looked more like the aftermath of a tornado, might have gotten the soon-to-be victims more in the right mindset to understand what was coming their way.

[Slim]

1) The Department of Homeland Security was an unecessary creation, which just made things worse. To fix the problems of two enormous bureaucracies (FBI & CIA), they created... yet another enormous bureaucracy. It's just too big and unwieldy to respond rapidly to an emergency, as Katrina demonstrated.

2) Don't put bureaucrats in charge of emergency response. They aren't used to action. Put people in charge who are used to taking charge and acting now now now.

3) Federal powers are limited by law (the President couldn't take charge of the National Guard without the Governor's okay, which she refused to give in time) (the Military cannot conduct police activities on US soil, so the Army was ready and waiting to act but could not until a waiver was secured). Therefore, the law needs to be changed to permit federal authorities to act when disaster strikes.

4) State and local governments must be accountable. They are the first responders -- police, firemen, city agencies, mayors, etc. A third of New Orleans' police force deserted! The Mayor abandoned the city's fleet of buses to the flood, instead of using them for evacuation. The Mayor failed to give police protection and supplies to the thousands who came to the Superdome and Convention Center. Instead of lifting a finger to do something, anything, the Mayor screamed to the cameras about how the feds weren't doing his job for him.

These failures are symptoms of a failure of accountability. Nobody took responsibility, because nobody ever took responsibility for anything before. It was always someone else's problem.

State and local authorities thus need to be made accountable as a matter of course, so that they are used to taking responsibility and acting responsibly when the need arises.

Right on. Excellent analysis and recommendations.

[YankeeRebel]

Why do I get the feeling that one of these posts could have been cut-and-pasted from the Republican National Committee's website?

[Fencergrl]

Committees and government never move fast enough. Ultimately, you are responsible for your own well-being. If you think others should be responsible for your own survival, you're in for a rude surprise.

[esskreemr]

Create a Depart of Peace. Place all the relevant fed agencies under it.

Appoint individuals with EXPERIENCE in the areas they are to head.

Dissolve FEMA. Fire everybody in it change it to just a planning agency. People have lost confidence in it.

Create the Federal Assistance Reaction Team. Ok, just kidding, maybe the Federal Emergency Reaction Agency.

Identify potential areas for disasters, types of disasters, successful disaster reaction.

Obtain permission for FERA teams to enter areas of disaster from states and counties ahead of time. A standing agreement, much like ratifying the Constitution, this would allow the Federal Team to enter disaster areas without having to go through a bunch of red tape. They could be trained to quickly assess the situation and coordinate with the local officials.

[Have At You]

Why do I get the feeling that one of these posts could have been cut-and-pasted from the Republican National Committee's website?

??? Whose post was remotely partisan?

[Epee_Pox]

Excellent ideas from all (except that one snide comment).

Wish there were more people like you guys at the upper echelons.

[mrbiggs]

3) Federal powers are limited by law (the President couldn't take charge of the National Guard without the Governor's okay, which she refused to give in time) (the Military cannot conduct police activities on US soil, so the Army was ready and waiting to act but could not until a waiver was secured). Therefore, the law needs to be changed to permit federal authorities to act when disaster strikes.

In context, this point makes perfect sense. But giving the federal government that much power makes me nervous. Disaster and emergency situations would, I assume, be decided by the President. I wouldn't want to give him the power over state militaries, and allow the military to conduct police activities in the U.S. whenever he wants. (I'm not worried about this President, I'm just looking to the future.)

[Slim]

In context, this point makes perfect sense. But giving the federal government that much power makes me nervous. Disaster and emergency situations would, I assume, be decided by the President. I wouldn't want to give him the power over state militaries, and allow the military to conduct police activities in the U.S. whenever he wants. (I'm not worried about this President, I'm just looking to the future.)

Cant do it, at least without major changes to the constitiuion. In extreme cases, the President could, in theory, issue an executive order to declare a state of emergency, and turn the militia against the state.

I too, am not worried about this president. ;->

[mrbiggs]

Cant do it, at least without major changes to the constitiuion. In extreme cases, the President could, in theory, issue an executive order to declare a state of emergency, and turn the militia against the state.

I too, am not worried about this president. ;->

You mean that the changes Have At You proposed are already constitutional?

[Slim]

Why do I get the feeling that one of these posts could have been cut-and-pasted from the Republican National Committee's website?

Thanks for the useful contribution to this thread.

[ThatReallyHurt]

This may seem a bit simplistic, forgive me. I think it would be a good idea to put a good old fashioned CB radio and a small solar panel in the upper mechanical rooms of high-rise buildings, police stations, firehalls, government buildings, etc. They'd get decent coverage, run off solar power, pretty much anyone can figure out how to work them, and they're cheap (solar panel and radio would run about $90CDN.

Communication seems to have been one of the big problems during the disaster. Incompatible comm systems, batteries don't last forever... sometimes old technology can lend a hand.

[YankeeRebel]

"Thanks for the useful contribution to this thread."

You're welcome.

Here's the thing: the original post asked for ideas that turned the discussion away from "finger pointing" and "blame" seeking positive ideas for the future. Instead, one of the posts was lengthy summation of conservative talking points.

If my post makes at least one person realize that they are being fed conservative spin instead of real solutions, then it is indeed a useful contribution to this thread.

[Larrison]

I'm curious about several things --

a) How many folks on Fencing.net have given some thought (more than a passing idle thought) about possible, not-totally-improbable disaters that might befall them at work or home. (And by this I'm assuming something that happens to multiple people, such as hurricane, tsunami, earthquake, etc.)

b) If appropriate, have you discussed a plan for what do do with family/ co-workers/ roommates?

c) How many people have put together an emergency kit/ supplies etc for such? And have it at home? at work? in their car?

d) How many people have gone back to that emergency kit/ supplies and looked at it to update it based upon either further thought or lessons learned from Katrina?