Another Dumb Question from me

[scrapinpeg]

I'm reading a flurry of stories in the English press today about student tests called "A Levels." Each of the stories decries the relaxing of standards, but none explains what these tests are for. Are these the equivalent of the SAT in the US?

[keith]

no totally different.

In england you do O levels and A levels (different in scotland).

So 6 years of high school 12-18

years 1/2 general curriculum
years 2/4 pick 8 subjects to study at O level, exams at end of year 4
years 5/6 pic 2-4 subjects that you did well at O level to study at A level. Exams at end of year 6 - and determine university/college entry.

Of the 8ish subjects you study at O level; normally everyone does maths + english but you could choose to do 2-3 languages or all three sciences plus things like geography etc etc. So since A levels are based of O levels it is quite possible to have a very specialised 5/6 year - just languages and no sciences for example.

[Go? Fencing?]

It's kinda like in Harry Potter... you know, British blokes and all that, OWLS and NEWTS.

[scrapinpeg]

So your college prospects are determined by a test you take in 12th grade, and the subjects tested are based on how you did in a test you took in 10th grade?

Sounds pretty harsh, like doors are slammed shut on children in 10th grade. Is that the case, or is there always opportunity to improve one's lot?

[the doc]

keith is roughly right, but a little bit out with some things.

there are 7 years from 11-18. 1-3 are general curriculum, 4-5 are years you learn for your gcses (what keith reffered to as o levels, they were replaced in 1987). for gsces you choose between 8-11 subjects, all classic things like maths english languages, sciences etc. the majority are compulsory, but with an element of flexibility often defined by timetable issues.

so you sit those exams at 16. at this point you can leave school if you want and try and get a job, but as a level of education gsces alone won't get you very far.

after gcses come a-levels which generally are done at 6th form colleges, rather than the school you did the other 5 years at. they tend to treat you a bit more as adults and you don't have to wear uniform.

you choose 3 or 4 a-levels, which can be from the same subjects as your gcses or other subjects that they might only teach at a-level and above like business studies, economics etc.

these subjects do tend to be a bit more one theme than gcses like sciences and maths, languages, humanities. for instance i studied maths,physics and chemistry.

these days they tend to study five subjects in the first year, take exams in the summer called as-level, then drop one or two and take the rest onto the final a-level the next year.

once again you can stop education at this point and try and get a job with your a-levels as your best qualification. you stand a better chance than if you have gcses alone.

at this point you can also choose to go to university and study for a degree. this takes three or four years depending on whether you do a bachelor's or master's degree.

now the controversy that rages at this time of year is based on one issue. the pass rates at a-level have gone up every year for the last 23 years consecutively. so some people argue that the kids have just worked harder and everyone else argues that the standards have slipped or been deliberately lowered by the government.

this last argument is partly based on the government's desire to get 50% of the 18 year olds into uni level education.

so, these days everyone has got a-levels and soon most people will have degrees and business complains cos it can't work out who is really good and who isn't anymore.

so that's british education and the controversy in an oversize nutshell.

[mrbiggs]

Originally Posted by scrapinpeg

Sounds pretty harsh, like doors are slammed shut on children in 10th grade. Is that the case, or is there always opportunity to improve one's lot?

I had an interesting conversation with my French teacher once, because she said that the French schools run along the same lines as these. (Specialization during high school, as opposed to after, as in American schools.) Basically, she said that there are advantages to each. For example, if you know what you're going to do in life early, a general ciriculum as in an American high school will slow you down with information you don't need, and a more specialized system will allow you to learn more about your area of expertise earlier.

[Go? Fencing?]

Originally Posted by mrbiggs

I had an interesting conversation with my French teacher once, because she said that the French schools run along the same lines as these. (Specialization during high school, as opposed to after, as in American schools.) Basically, she said that there are advantages to each. For example, if you know what you're going to do in life early, a general ciriculum as in an American high school will slow you down with information you don't need, and a more specialized system will allow you to learn more about your area of expertise earlier.

On the other hand, if you don't know, you could be pressed into intensive study in something that turns out you don't like so much.

[mrbiggs]

Originally Posted by Go? Fencing?

On the other hand, if you don't know, you could be pressed into intensive study in something that turns out you don't like so much.

Yep. So there are advantages to each.

[DHCJr]

I started my schooling in a British School. There is a big difference than the American schools of that time. There were no grades. You had ages 4 - 12 in a 2-room school and you worked based on your skills, not your age. You started when you turned 5 or if you had an older sibling you entered in September of the school year you would turn 5. I was told, but I was only there 2 years, that at 12 they would be tested and that could determine going on or going to trade school or going. It was competitive early on.

[J.Harris]

"these days they tend to study five subjects in the first year, take exams in the summer called as-level, then drop one or two and take the rest onto the final a-level the next year."

Woah I knew one person who did five subjects in their first year. I did four in my first year and pretty much everyone I knew did three.

[Gav]

And don't forget that the Scottish System is different and that the Welsh are opting out of the English one.

In Scotland you start school at about 5; some go to pre schools, nursery and the like, between 3 and primary [I went to a pre-school in africa]. You get 7 years of primary followed by 6 years of secondary (high) school. Your first two years at high school are a broad education: Maths, English. History, Geography, Sciences, 'Religous Eduation' (which is all about Ethics not indoctrination), 'Social Education' (sexual health, girls stuff, drugs etc) and so on. You then choose your Standard Grades going into third year. At this point you can choose up to six subjects (sometimes 7). During your first two years you monitored and this will determine which level you will do your S Grades at. The preceding statement may seem harsh but when you conisder that it is possible to move up or down level at this point it's quite fluid. In general Maths and English are compulsory along with at least one science and everyone does PE; other than that I can't remember. At the end of 4th year you are finished with S grades and you move onto highers. This is your 5th and 6th years. At this point you can also choose to go to college. When I was at school you had the choice of either 1 year or 2 year highers - it depended on your S Grade results. You can also choose additional S grades (or in my case choose to do O grades in one year).

Completely different to English schools. College and University are different as well.