Top Foil Fencer Matteo Zennaro Talks about Foil New Rules and Other Issues

[gladius]

Following the interview with Salvatore Sanzo, here is an excerpt from a long interview which Schermaonline had with foilist Matteo Zennaro. The entire text (in Italian) can be found at:

http://www.schermaonline.com/scherma...rticle&sid=227


This week Schermaonline carries an interview with another important and well known Italian fencer, Matteo Zennaro, a great foilist who has suffered from injuries some years back which have affected his fencing career.

SCHERMAONLINE:
Let's start with the same question we asked your team mate Salvatore Sanzo: what do you think about the rule changes for foil, both from technical considerations in general and from your way of fencing in particular?

ZENNARO:
I'm not against the attempt to go back to a more traditional type of fencing, but I disagree with the totally disorganized way it was done to achieve this goal.
We see in all sports rules changes, changes in the equipment and a consequent progressive adaptation by the athletes......
The real problem is not so much the change per se, but the total mess in the implementation. No test was conducted after the Olympic games in Athens. For about six months, we, the athletes did not know whether we would have had a year of testing for the under 20, or the new rules would have applied to us also, which is what happened in the end.
In Italy, we started the season with the old machines to then change in mid season and, if this was not enough, this new system for registering the touches has functioning problems which are unacceptable.
Many touches with the point (which is what the new rules are supposed to promote since it is now more difficult to score with the flick) do not register with the apparatus because of technical problems with the impact time.
Now, I don't want to start a debate, but I believe that a SERIOUS testing period is absolutely necessary to make sure that these types of problems don't happen during world cup or any official competition at any level!
We want to prevent the so called "flick"? OK, but then make sure that all point touches work perfectly.
Unfortunately this is not the case. There are problems with the impact times of the tip hitting the target. If the touch is on a soft surface (like the belly) the longer impact time insures that the touch is registered. However, when it reaches a hard surface (like the sternum) often the impact time of the tip is not enough and the touch does not register.
Even if one touch out of 100 does not register, this should happen only because the athlete does something wrong in the execution, not because the calibration of the registering apparatus is wrong!
We then reach the ridiculous with the problem of the hard chest protector under the uniform which has been in use by women as chest protector. Now, because of the natural human nature who wants to win at all cost even "at the limits of what is allowed," the poor men all of a sudden have the terrible need to protect themselves from the opponents touches. Furthermore, since you cannot prevent someone to use additional protection, no specific rules for this have been adopted.
Therefore, we cannot get upset when we are often described a MINOR LEAGUE sport, because we are.
A sport which allows any of this to happen doesn't have credibility.
I believe that we should first specifically work on this to test the new method in the lower [age] categories or by organizing competitions outside the world cup circuit and after further refinement, make it official.
UNFORTUNATELY, this is not what happened.
The other point is a matter of personal opinion: in my opinion foil is now less spectacular and much more boring, but this is only my opinion which I express ... but it remains my opinion!

SCHERMAONLINE:
Do you agree with the policy of the President of the FIE, M. Roch, which sees a fundamental need to spread fencing to countries where there is no tradition for this sport?

ZENNARO:
I agree with the attempt of M. Roch to globalyze fencing in particular to countries which have not had a chance to have a role. It is unthinkable that in 2005 fencing is practiced mainly in 5 countries, but I don't agree with the method used to reach this goal.
And here I stop....

SCHERMAONLINE:
In your opinion, which technical evolution is in store for foil? How do you see the future of this weapon?

ZENNARO:
We are now at a stage in which everyone searches for adaptations more or less technical in nature to the new rules, but there is no doubt that this is a long road before we can reach a level of technical and tactical stability like we had with the old rules.
As of now, we are neither fish nor fowl.
In the beginning I thought that this method would have favored a more technical fencer and I was quite happy, given my own style, but little by little I realized that it wasn't the case.
I noticed in these months that all fencers taller than 6' (180 cm) either have or had big problems to adapt. Think of Cassara or the German Wessels who won the world cup in 2003.
The only one who has adapted immediately is the German Bissdorf who even before had always a very linear (in line) style of fencing.
This said, frankly ... I can't tell you in which direction foil is evolving ... often you don't easily accept something new, but then little by little you start appreciating the eventual merits.

........

SCHERMAONLINE:
What has changed in the preparation of the modern fencer? In your opinion, has the physical preparation become today more important compared with the past?

ZENNARO:
Without a doubt, physical preparation has a central and important role. It always has but as you go on even the small differences come out. Ours is a technical sport, but the physical conditioning influences very much the fencing action which can be too slow or not well executed because of fatigue.

...........

SCHERMAONLINE:
You are about 6' 3" (1.91 m): a giant. With this physique which mother nature gave you, did you ever regret not having taken on a different sport which pays more than fencing?

ZENNARO:
I love skiing, a sport that I find in certain things similar to ours and which sometime I like even more, but fencing is my first love and as everyone knows, you can never forget your first love... For sure if it was for money, there is no doubt that I should have taken another sport, considering that in other sports there are athletes that don't even come close to the level that we the Italian fencers have reached in this sport. Valentina Vezzali, for instance, has no reason to envy Valentino Rossi [world motorcycle GP champion] or Alberto Tomba [world class skier, 5 Olympic medals in 3 Olympics], other than what is in their bank accounts...

.......

SCHERMAONLINE:
Which are your strengths in your fencing? Which are your weaknesses?

ZENNARO:
In fencing I have a talent which mother nature gave me, excellent techniques which my maestro Massimo Omeri taught me, and a physique which even if it gave me some problems (due to injuries) and a certain difficulty to keep my weight, is powerful, strong, and quick at the same time which are all necessary in this sport, in particular if you consider my height and body mass.
All my techniques notwithstanding, my biggest shortcoming is the lack of adequate mental energy.
In short, I never developed that killer instinct which many champions have. To be able to stare at nothing and no one, but to have a precise objective straight in front of me and to reach it.
Maybe this is why when I managed to be part of the strongest fencers in the world by winning important medals, I never really entered the Gotha of the top fencers, even though I feel this is something I can do.

.......

SCHERMAONLINE:
When you'll stop being a competitor (the later the better, obviously), will you become a fencing coach?

ZENNARO:
No doubt that a teaching career will be my next challenge after a competitive career because often high caliber athletes don't turn out as teachers with similar high level abilities. Therefore, this will be an intriguing challenge and this could give me the adrenaline I always need every day on the strip.
I'll start this summer by taking the national instructor test in Norcia [federal fencing master school].

SCHERMAONLINE:
What type of advice do you feel giving to a young foil fencer whose dream is to become a great champion like you? What are the secrets to succeed?

ZENNARO:
There are no secrets: mother nature must have been kind and given you some talents, which by themselves are not enough. You've got to work like a mule for years ... be persistent, and believe that you can do it...

SCHERMAONLINE:
You've had the opportunity to admire great Italian and foreign champions in the recent past and to fence against them. Who was the greatest, in your opinion? Which one made the greatest impression on you? Is there a bout you've seen that sticks in your memory?

ZENNARO:
I've been lucky to fence against many great champions. The one I missed is Fabio Dal Zotto because he quit when I was starting, but I can say that Golubitsky is without a doubt the one who impressed me the most and gave me the most fun!
He gave me the feeling of one with a complete technique like Andrea Borella, combined with the talent of Mauro Numa, something which is almost sublime.
In my experience I've never seen other fencers who have such a complete repertoire of styles, perfect [in execution], with an outstanding mental control [like Golubitsky].

........

Matteo Zennaro: Carabiniere, from Venice, 29 years old, single. His most important results: individual silver at the World Championship in Seoul, 1999, team bronze at Sydney Olympics, 2000, team gold at European Championships in Moscow, 2002, two gold medals Italian Championships in 1998 and 2004.

[Grasshopper]

I noticed in these months that all fencers taller than 6' (180 cm) either have or had big problems to adapt. Think of Cassara or the German Wessels who won the world cup in 2003.
The only one who has adapted immediately is the German Bissdorf who even before had always a very linear (in line) style of fencing.

Wow, I wonder why he feels that tall fencers are at a disadvantage with the new timings...any thoughts?

[kalivor]

Originally Posted by Grasshopper

Wow, I wonder why he feels that tall fencers are at a disadvantage with the new timings...any thoughts?

I suspect that tall fencers have greater trouble dealing with the compressed distance when their opponent counterattacks with the hopes that the new timings will protect them.

Also, younger tall foilists probably flicked more, given that it's easier to get around your opponent's parries if you're towering over them.

[Gav]

I like the fact that the articles are being posted. In fact I am grateful to Gladius for taking the time to translate them. Gladius can you stop putting the emphasis in? I'd like to read the comments without the pejorative use of bold.

[Zelda]

Matteo Zennaro always has been one of my favourite fencers. I remember watching him take a lesson just before the 2000 Olympics, he took a lesson, wearing 2 knee braces, moving like he was about 4 inches above the ground. Though thinkiing back to that lesson I can see how the new timings would affect him, as he modus operandi was very much hit and get the hell out of there.

Overall the italians seem to be saying "hey these timings could work, BUT you really have stuffed up the impimentation!"

[veeco]

Yes, but the initial plan was to use those test timings only in Juniors and Cadets. And I could be wrong, but I think that the Italian federation was one of the federations that demanded these test timings to be used across the board so that their juniors competing in senior tournaments wouldn't have to switch from one set of timings to another during the season...

[Mr Epee]

Gav, you dingle!

The Bold text is in the original... Gladius didn't add it...

I like it.

[rvergara]

I have noticed that the taller the foilist is, the more he flicks. At least around here.

Mr. Epee, the quote in your signature couldn't be more true

[Gav]

Originally Posted by Mr Epee

Gav, you dingle!

The Bold text is in the original... Gladius didn't add it...

I like it.

You're kidding! I'm a dingle alright. Gladius - excuse the wittering of a deluded Scotsman. I'm off to kill a few Haggis...

[gladius]

Originally Posted by Gav

You're kidding! I'm a dingle alright. Gladius - excuse the wittering of a deluded Scotsman. I'm off to kill a few Haggis...

Cheers! Only thing I add from time to time are in [ ] these brackets, when I break the longwinded periods in Italian into more manageable short sentences in English and subjects or objects could become confused. Another editorial liberty I take is to skip the more "local" comments relating to indigenous politics nobody could understand.

As to the height handicap, i.e., why tall foil fencers (>6') have had a harder time adapting to the new rules, this is an explanation provided by al_bern, a pen name of a well known Italian Maestro (on Schermaonline.com):

"Obviously I cannot answer for Zennaro, but to try explaining why, I should point out that the typical foil fencer is generally a bit shorter than 6'. The six footers and taller, under the old rules favored the flicks both in attack and in riposte, directed to the shoulder or the target on the back. Because of their height advantage it was easier for them to reach targets on the upper lines of their opponent. Now that the opportunity to use flicks has been reduced, the advantage that height was giving these [taller] atheltes is reduced."

A sensible explanation...

[cowpaste]

Yes, the ability to flick is reduced, but does that translate into a *disadvantage*?

I'm no expert, but I feel tall fencers would have more problems with quickly collapsing distance due to counter-attacks, as mentioned above.

[keith]

Originally Posted by cowpaste

Yes, the ability to flick is reduced, but does that translate into a *disadvantage*?

I'm no expert, but I feel tall fencers would have more problems with quickly collapsing distance due to counter-attacks, as mentioned above.

for us mere mortals this is true. For the fencers under discussion it is probably less of a problem (vs the larger impact of eliminating the flick).

[gladius]

Originally Posted by Zelda

Matteo Zennaro always has been one of my favourite fencers. I remember watching him take a lesson just before the 2000 Olympics, he took a lesson, wearing 2 knee braces, moving like he was about 4 inches above the ground. Though thinkiing back to that lesson I can see how the new timings would affect him, as he modus operandi was very much hit and get the hell out of there.

Overall the italians seem to be saying "hey these timings could work, BUT you really have stuffed up the impimentation!"

Zelda, I did skip this part of the interview, but your posting prompts me to add this portion about the career threatening injuries of Matteo Zennaro:

........
SCHERMAONLINE:
Your fencing career after a lightning start which topped with the individual silver medal at the Seoul World Championships in 1998, slowed down because of serious injuries. Care talking about it?

ZENNARO:
The sport of fencing has given me a lot, a whole lot, but took away from me a lot also.
It's true that a victory pays you back for one thousand losses. I had satisfactions which I'll treasure inside and nothing can erase them. Unfortunately, this holds also for the bitter pills I had to swallow.
Two serious injuries which stopped my climbing to the top at the most critical moment, forcing me by the way, to stop for two years, and one more year to catch up with the others.
Last, but not least, is Athens 2004: even though you are prepared and you know the outcome, you're really never ready to look from a distance of 5 meters the medal you've always dreamed about, to see on the podium Russia and China with 4 athletes and 4 medals each, and on the top spot only 3 Italians and only 3 gold medals.
The fourth gold medal was there on the table ... and remained there.
All in all, maybe I deserved it too.
Again, as I said in the press conference, I don't blame anyone. My team mates and the CT Andrea Magro couldn't do any thing. If the final score had been like the previous year at the World Championship in Cuba -- where ITALY whipped CHINA, maybe today I'd say something different, but unfortunately, it ended up 45-42, a too narrow margin to make a substitution.

.......

SCHERMAONLINE:
After two important surgical procedures to the same knee, are there any movements or situations on the strip you are not comfortable with or that give you some problems?

ZENNARO:
I broke the cross ligaments of the knee, both meniscus, and the collateral of the right leg which now cannot support even a feather...
More than the movements that I cannot execute, it's the sensation of instability which I feel during some actions.
When I step back very quickly, I always feel that I'm in a precarious situation, but this may be only psychological since this is how I got injured both times...

[kalivor]

Originally Posted by cowpaste

Yes, the ability to flick is reduced, but does that translate into a *disadvantage*?

Not really a disadvantage, but certainly a longer adjustment period than those (shorter) fencers who tended to make thrust-like hits more often under the old timings.

[Grasshopper]

Originally Posted by gladius

As to the height handicap, i.e., why tall foil fencers (>6') have had a harder time adapting to the new rules, this is an explanation provided by al_bern, a pen name of a well known Italian Maestro (on Schermaonline.com):

"Obviously I cannot answer for Zennaro, but to try explaining why, I should point out that the typical foil fencer is generally a bit shorter than 6'. The six footers and taller, under the old rules favored the flicks both in attack and in riposte, directed to the shoulder or the target on the back. Because of their height advantage it was easier for them to reach targets on the upper lines of their opponent. Now that the opportunity to use flicks has been reduced, the advantage that height was giving these [taller] atheltes is reduced."

A sensible explanation...

Wow again. I didn't expect my question to be answered by such a Jedi Knight. This explanation is very good, but I really thought that the stop hit and the attack short, remise strategy would favor taller fencers with the new lock out time. For me, as a tall fencers who used to flick a lot, I found the loss of flicking hurt my game more than the advantage for stop hits and remises helped it...

However, it has given me renewed interest in long straight attacks and counter-time actions.

Finally, I feel that tall fencers who are not taking advantage of the new reversing shoulders rule are missing out. How many times do you find a shorter opponent inside your gaurd, just waiting for the president to say "Halt". There is no more need to desperatly flail behind your back for that miracle touch. Simply switch your feet, pull your hand back, and behold all that exposed target area!