Anyone going to nationals?

[kalivor]

See, the thing is, there are lots of FORMER A's in Canada who choose to pop out of the woodwork now and again.

This is what I think Fencergirl is talking about.

Her coach for example who I am guessing is (M?) is a former national team member, NCAA team member and A ranked fencer.

Where has her A gone? If you don't compete enough in the right competitions throughout the season you will indeed lose your ranking.

Real life takes priority over fencing sadly.

I for one am a former B and now have been downgraded to a C due to my lack of funds.

Damn University.

See everyone in Edmonton!

Well, there are plenty of former As in Canada who were downgraded to Bs when the new system was introduced. It's been made much more difficult to get an A. If her coach is still good enough to be a National Team member in epee, then they really are an A fencer with a C ranking.

But most former As, and even some former National Team members would be incapable of earning an A under the current standards, even in their prime.

It's not entirely "lack of funds" or "lack of competition." They've put in an entirely different system into place for the past couple of years, which (as far as I can tell) is far more likely to knock people down a letter than give them one that they don't deserve. Of course, my observations are skewed towards men's foil, which is what I primarily fence.

And A cards are now an entirely different beast from what they used to be. I can think of a fencer or three who were undoubtably As under the old system, but wouldn't stand a chance in hell of being more than a B now ... and that's just off the top of my head.

[Fencergrl]

See, the thing is, there are lots of FORMER A's in Canada who choose to pop out of the woodwork now and again.

This is what I think Fencergirl is talking about.

Her coach for example who I am guessing is (M?) is a former national team member, NCAA team member and A ranked fencer.

Where has her A gone? If you don't compete enough in the right competitions throughout the season you will indeed lose your ranking.

Real life takes priority over fencing sadly.

I for one am a former B and now have been downgraded to a C due to my lack of funds.

Damn University.

See everyone in Edmonton!

You're right my coach is M ... nice to know that I didn't get things as confused as I thought.

I have no idea if under the new system if M would be an A if she competed in all the right tournaments. If Krol isn’t an A, then M wouldn’t be based on what I’ve seen.

[kalivor]

I have no idea if under the new system if M would be an A if she competed in all the right tournaments. If Krol isn’t an A, then M wouldn’t be based on what I’ve seen.

Krol is currently an A, but hasn't re-earned it yet this year ... three tournaments in which to get two sufficiently good results, or she'll be a B next year.

[Fencergrl]

In Provincials last month (my third tournament) I had Krol in my first round pool and then had to fence her again in my 3rd. round (wasn't I lucky!). She's a one of the nicest people I know but a fierce competitor. Even though we fence at the same club and knew she could beat me with her eyes closed, she didn’t back off for a single second. Some fencers would have backed off a bit knowing they had it in the bag and would have let some points slip through. She didn't and taught me something about competing.

Being new to the sport, I pay too much attention to standings and lose bouts that I should have won or done better at just because I assume someone can beat me. I may be up 3-4 points in my 2nd round and still not believe I can beat my opponent because they placed significantly higher than me after 1st rounds. I’m trying avoid that pitfall by just focusing on my next point and only my next point.

[SJB]

It's not entirely "lack of funds" or "lack of competition." They've put in an entirely different system into place for the past couple of years, which (as far as I can tell) is far more likely to knock people down a letter than give them one that they don't deserve. Of course, my observations are skewed towards men's foil, which is what I primarily fence.

The correlation between letter ranking and funding is related though. If you don't attend both elites, every NAC and Nationals you have little hope of obtaining/maintaing your letter ranking. Regardless of whether it's an A or not. You're looking at spending at least $2,000 a year to travel/compete in all of those.

Your likelihood of earning your letter are intrensically related to your results at those competitions. So really, there is no lack of competition.

It's true though that the CFF regulations are far more strident then they used to be to earn an A. Or a B or even a C for that matter.

[kalivor]

The correlation between letter ranking and funding is related though. If you don't attend both elites, every NAC and Nationals you have little hope of obtaining/maintaing your letter ranking. Regardless of whether it's an A or not. You're looking at spending at least $2,000 a year to travel/compete in all of those.

Your likelihood of earning your letter are intrensically related to your results at those competitions. So really, there is no lack of competition.

It's true though that the CFF regulations are far more strident then they used to be to earn an A. Or a B or even a C for that matter.

Well, an A does need a lot of funding. On the other hand, if you're not competing at that level, you don't deserve an A.

For a B, it's less so. Most are trying to be As, which means joining the high performance program, which means attending both elites, plus Nationals. And then going to international competitions to try to earn the A. So, if you want to keep up with these Bs in the points standings, it only makes sense that you'd need to attend both elites and Nationals.

On the other hand, based on the points given out for Nationals last year, winning Nationals would give enough points to earn a B on its own this year, in pretty much every weapon, and there are certainly smaller tournaments that can shell out enough points for a C with a single result.

Of course, if you're winning those, you could probably earn a better classification by spending enough money on travel and competition

When it comes to the C, though, I have to say, though, that I have a C and have never attended both elites. I didn't attend Easterns or Nationals this year, so it ought to slip to a D, but I think I could've maintained it if I'd bothered to go to either of them. Not both, either. Not to mention that the results were never given to the CFF for one tournament I went to this year, which might have kept me in the C range despite not attending the two heaviest weighted events ... heck, it's not too outrageous to suggest that I might manage to keep it anyways. I'll be close to the cut-off line.

And this is coming from a C who is certainly not a B. Attending Easterns, the other elite and Nationals wouldn't have gained me a B classification. I'd just be more firmly entrenched as a C.

[millsisland]

Partial results are up at http://www.fencing.ca/results/2005_natls_results.htm

McGuire in MF, Sassine in WS

[kalivor]

Partial results are up at http://www.fencing.ca/results/2005_natls_results.htm

McGuire in MF, Sassine in WS

So far I'm two-for-two! (I did make that post in the picks thread, didn't I?)

Haha! Feel the envy of American fencers at how quickly the CFF updates their website!

[kalivor]

Not to mention that the results were never given to the CFF for one tournament I went to this year, which might have kept me in the C range despite not attending the two heaviest weighted events ... heck, it's not too outrageous to suggest that I might manage to keep it anyways. I'll be close to the cut-off line.

... and since foil is done, and I have Excel, I did the calculations ... which put me a half-dozen places back of what I expect will be the cut-off.

Of course, the CFF is fully capable of using some sort of funky math which is either (a) not actually 'math' as I have learned it, or (b) doesn't quite follow the rules they put down, so I'll keep my fingers crossed. Not to mention that quick Excel-ing could produce calculation errors on my part.

[raymac]

Well I just got back a little while ago, the biggest news I have to report is that Brita Goldie (from Epic, in Calgary) beat Sherraine MacKay in the (not 100% here) WE final. From the discussion I heard on the boards, that's a pretty big deal.

Anyway, it was the first competition I've been to, I now know of the yelling that's always talked about on the forums. I think a mild scream has its place after a good touch or to release frustration, but some people take their mask off and go about it for a good 5 seconds, loudly. The women are worse than the men though I would say...

Also, I have some pictures of Brita vs Sherraine, as well as Julie bouting MacKay, and a few other random pics if anyone wants.

I also noticed that one of the women (Julie Leprohon?) not only used a french grip epee, but she pommelled with it as well. This is fairly rare for epee yes?

[Lemberg]

Julie doesn't french grip/pommel. Sherraine and Monique Kavelaars do. And it isn't all that rare.

[Fencergrl]

Wow! Monica Kwan took first in Women's Foil... She's got a this unorthodox style, that has been frustrating the BC Foil fencers…I guess not having perfect textbook technique has it’s advantages… if it works, use it!

[kalivor]

Wow! Monica Kwan took first in Women's Foil... She's got a this unorthodox style, that has been frustrating the BC Foil fencers…I guess not having perfect textbook technique has it’s advantages… if it works, use it!

Given that she already held the #1 spot on the HPP rankings, it can't be considered too much of a surprise that she won ...

[geordie]

Also, Julie doesn't use a french grip which would make it impossible to pommel.
The other french gripper that was in the semis was Ainsley Switzer and she doesn't pommel.

[Fencergrl]

Given that she already held the #1 spot on the HPP rankings, it can't be considered too much of a surprise that she won ...

I apologize for my ignorance. I've been fencing in tournaments 5 months. I didn't know her from any other fencer, except all the women foilist locally were frustrated in their inability to beat her.

Since BC didn't do great in getting into the top 3 positions in a lot of events, I was happy to see Kwan take first.

My post was nothing more than home-province pride.

[Lemberg]

Yeah, we can suer use some of that home province pride...... Kwan is number one!!!!!

Kinda dissappointing to see Tigran Bajgoric miss out on SME medal (at 14-13 for JP Seguin in the bout to make top 4, Tigran excercised a beautiful parry but as he stepped back to take tehparry he found himself out of bounds.. kind of a bad way to lose..) Similarly, Igor Gantsevich had the gold in junior mens epee all but wrapped up, but his cockyness (coupled with Theirry Bourbounnais' determination to finally beat his #1 rival in the final) has caught up to him and he lost the gold medal match 14-15 by basically goofing around the hwole first period. Well, I guess at least he tried to put on a show in teh finals (most of the finals, aside from Sherraine-Brita, Womens Team Foil and Mens Team Epee were incredibly boring). But that is just a case of home club pride I suppose

[raymac]

Also, Julie doesn't use a french grip which would make it impossible to pommel.
The other french gripper that was in the semis was Ainsley Switzer and she doesn't pommel.

well, maybe not normally but the girl bouting either sherraine, catherine, or brita on piste 1 was holding the french grip from the very butt end.

[geordie]

well, maybe not normally but the girl bouting either sherraine, catherine, or brita on piste 1 was holding the french grip from the very butt end.

Okay, I just figured it out...Monique Kavelaars' equipment didn't arrive on time for her first couple of matches and therefore was fencing in some of Julie Leprohon's gear. So if you saw a Leprohon fencing with a french grip at the very butt end it was Monique. There's a very slight chance that it was Claire Voigt as apparently she's using a french grip too now...but I think it was Monique with Julie's stuff on!
I think this clears it up!
Cheers,
Geordie

[Lemberg]

Yeah Claire is french grippin it now too..... Was fun to see her finally beat her older sister, although I don't think Leigh was too happy about it

[raymac]

Okay, I just figured it out...Monique Kavelaars' equipment didn't arrive on time for her first couple of matches and therefore was fencing in some of Julie Leprohon's gear. So if you saw a Leprohon fencing with a french grip at the very butt end it was Monique. There's a very slight chance that it was Claire Voigt as apparently she's using a french grip too now...but I think it was Monique with Julie's stuff on!
I think this clears it up!
Cheers,
Geordie

Haha, I knew I saw Leprohon on a jacket, you can make it out in one of the pictures. That's cool though, thanks for the info.