Cherry Blossom - College Park, MD

[epee1]

Has anyone heard/seen the results posted? I heard it was an A4?? Can anyone confirm this?

[sreckiki]

Originally Posted by epee1

Has anyone heard/seen the results posted? I heard it was an A4?? Can anyone confirm this?

There were 84 fencers and indeed, it was an A4.

But this post should be in the Tournaments and Camps section where you can find some partial results, by the way (thanks to Army Fencer).

[Wafath]

It was. And in all of it, only three fencers got a higher rank, 1 A, 1 B, & 1C.

Three fencers renewed their A, one fencer renewed his C, and three renewed their E's. It surprised me that so few ranks were given/renewed when the competition hands out ranks to 48th place.

I believe this was the strongest competition ever hosted by the capitol division.

W

[jake]

Ludovic Le Meunier won the epee.
Kashi Way won the foil.
Don't know who won the sabre.

[Wafath]

Results: (will be posted on the capitol division web page.)

1,LE MEUNIER Ludovic,DCFC,USA,
2,RICHARDS Dick,DCFC,USA,
3,CZAPANSKIY Max,DCFC,USA,
3,JOBST Kazmer,DCFC,USA,renew A
5,ERBELE Isaac,DCFC,USA,renew A
5,PENA Marcos,PRFC,PUR,
7,BACKES Arne,FAP,USA,renew A
8,NAPALA Evan,CCFC,USA,earned A
9,DUNCAN Corwin,GTPS,USA,
10,ANDERSON Mike,DCFC,USA,
11,SNIDER Jeffrey,DCFC,USA,
12,DIAZ Ivan,PRFC,PUR,
13,TORRES Oscar,PRFC,PUR,
14,WICAS Graham,FAP,USA,
15,COLETTA David,CHBG,USA,earned B
16,LOBANENKOV Ilya,VAF,USA,
17,PENA Jonathan,PRFC,PUR,
18,CUTLER Matt,DCFC,USA,
19,BOWMAN Wayne,OTFG,USA,
20,ARROWSMITH Alan,BFC,USA,
21,O'NEAL Scott,RFC,USA,
22,WHEELER Daniel,DCFC,USA,
23,SCHOETTLER Daniel,BFC,USA,earned C
24,ROTONDI Gregory,SFC,USA,renewed C
25,KING Andrew,GTPS,USA,
26,MORET Eric,DCFC,USA,
27,EVANS Tyler,VAF,USA,
28,LINDSAY Milton,FAP,USA,
29,YAKIMENKO Andrei,FAP,USA,
30,O'BRIEN Patrick,USNA,USA,
31,MELENDEZ Alexandra,PRFC,PUR,
32,PIZA Joel,PRFC,PUR,
33,FRYE Mary,FAP,USA,
34,HOOPES Richard,HFC,USA,
35,WEINER Noah,BFC,USA,
36,ZELENSKY Paul,RFC,USA,
37,PAYE Gregory,BFC,USA,
38,SCHOETTLER Zachary,BFC,USA,
39,BELAVAL Lelani,PRFC,PUR,
40,ELDER Patrick,UMFC,USA,
41,SWICK Kerry,SFC,USA,renewed E
42,JONES Scott,JMU,USA,
43,DOOM Terrie,CHBG,USA,
44,PEPPE Matthew,VAF,USA,
45,LARSON Elizabeth,RFC,USA,
46,SIMONE Christina,FAP,USA,renewed E
47,BRUMBY Maximilian,CCFC,USA,
48,BIGGS Jeffery,SFC,USA,renewed E
49,WRAY Kyle,BFC,USA
50,POORBAUGH Samantha,LIG,USA
51,VINCENT Timothy,TFC,USA
52,WILSON Ivan,OTFG,USA
53,GIBLIN Christina,FIA,USA
53,SIRICO Cynthia,SFC,USA
55,LUCENTE Thomas,RFC,USA
56,KUNZ Jason,SFC,USA
57,SMYTH Sefton,UNATT,USA
58,CASANO Michael,VAF,USA
59,HENRY Mark,CCFC,USA
60,POORBAUGH Mary,LIG,USA
61,WEICHT Wesley,BFC,USA
61,YALOWITZ Adam,DCFC,USA
63,BOURDEAU DE FONTENA Tristan,FCNY,USA
63,MOSLEY Adam,USNA,USA
65,CZAPANSKIY Dana,DCFC,USA
65,PALENQUE Andres,CCFC,USA
67,BROWN Michael,UMFC,USA
68,SALVATORE Christina,DCFC,USA
69,MAISONET Olymar,PRFC,PUR
70,WARD Beth,CCFC,USA
71,SARSFIELD Jeffrey,CHBG,USA
72,CASANO Elizabeth,VAF,USA
73,ALEXANDER Talia,VAF,USA
74,MORET Brighid,DCFC,USA
74,WEICHT Jake,BFC,USA
76,CANARD Brian,BFC,USA
77,ALKEN Amy,FAP,USA
78,KUNZ Edward,SFC,USA
79,GARLAND Gregory,SVC,USA
79,HUNTER Rachel,DCFC,USA
81,CLARK Lauren,BFC,USA
81,SWICK Kyra,SFC,USA
83,LINDSAY Elizabeth,FAP,USA

[sabreman]

>>I believe this was the strongest competition ever hosted by the capitol division.
>>

We hosted two Sabre WCs in the early 1990s. Also the Cherry Blossom was NAC at one time (back in 1980s). Actually was used as model for NACs. Hopefully this is a return to form.

Thank you to all that attended.

[Wafath]

Originally Posted by sabreman

We hosted two Sabre WCs in the early 1990s. Also the Cherry Blossom was NAC at one time (back in 1980s). Actually was used as model for NACs. Hopefully this is a return to form.

I stand corrected. Thank you for the history.

W

[Army Fencer]

Originally Posted by sreckiki

There were 84 fencers and indeed, it was an A4.

And congratulations to you for winning the Chesapeake Challange and getting yourself a sabre.

[epee1]

Thank you so much for posting the results. From everyone I talked to it was a great tournament and very well done. Congrats to the division for yet another well done tournament.

[sreckiki]

Originally Posted by Army Fencer

And congratulations to you for winning the Chesapeake Challange and getting yourself a sabre.

Thanks! But you made my way really difficult...

...and I'm sure you're gonna do better at Chatanooga!

[sundarlia]

Originally Posted by epee1

Thank you so much for posting the results. From everyone I talked to it was a great tournament and very well done. Congrats to the division for yet another well done tournament.

Um, I hate one of my first actual posts to be negative, but I thought the event while really, really strong had a lot of problems due to poor management and lack of forethought on the host club/division. I really expected better since I had heard so much about this event. The seeding problems were really bad and probably what bugged me the most.

I heard that part of the problem with giving out more ratings, at least in foil, was that the event was poorly/incorrectly seeded and that some of the Cuban/foreign fencers were not rated as they should have been and that fencers with national points were just rated based on their letter. Also for the epee a B05 was seeded ahead of A05's with national points in the pools, and that was just one seeding error. Fencing Time is only $50 dollars guys and it will cut down on most of your problems as long as you enter the data correctly.

As if that were not enough fun prizes were not bought/present for at least most of the women’s events, there were not enough strips, not enough equipment, some of the judging was very poor (and with VA, MD, DC and PA to pull from there is no excuse for that!) and a lot of fencers would up having to judge in between their flights or their own pools.

And this is not just me or my opinion. A lot of the comments I have heard from other more experienced fencers are in the vein of "a shining example to mismanagement and poor planning" and so forth. You can read more comments from some of the folks that were there on this forum: http://www.va-usfa.org/cgi-bin/forum...num=1113093218

I hate seeing an event with a good history and rep like the Cherry Blossom get its star tarnished by simple things that should have been done like buying prizes, getting decent judges, having enough working equipment, laying the strips in good time and being able to seed the event correctly.

So the above is pretty negative, but not unjustified I think. I hope that the problems will be corrected for next year and that it will continue to grow until it is similar to the PdT or the DitD type tourneys but that can't happen unless the framework is in place so I thought a bit of "frank and honest" opinions might help point out some of the shortfalls for correction. I understand that there may have been lots going on that I am not aware of, but from the outside looking in that is how I say it. Sorry if I sound overly harsh and please take it as constructive criticism.

[fencerchica]

Would anyone be able to post the results for the open mixed foil event? Please? I'm at work with not enough to do, and am champing at the bit to see how well I placed!

[Wafath]

(I don't have the sabre with me)

Foil:
1,WAY Kashi,DCFC,USA,b05
2,HOFFMAN Joe,OTFG,USA,b04
3,LUGO Jonathan,PRFC,PUR,B05
3,ZAYAS Cedenio,PRFC,PUR,B05
5,CASERTANO Lorenzo,BFC,USA,b05
6,OUYANG Long,DCFC,USA,b04
7,GRAY Paul,FASJ,USA,c05
8,CARRION Marlon,PRFC,PUR,C05
9,PONTICELLO Mario,FASJ,USA,c04
10,MCINTYRE Gregory,PSFC,USA,c05
11,WITTIG Jonathon,BFC,USA,b05
12,WALTERS Anne Marie,UNATT,USA,u
13,POKALENKO Vitali,NIH,USA,c05
14,SEROTKIN Ian,DCFC,USA,c04
15,SHIFF Daniel,BFC,USA,C05
16,FERGUSON Diane,OTFG,USA,b04
17,SIRICO Thomas,UNATT,USA,b01
18,BAKER Elise,CCFC,USA,d04
19,LAWSON Marie,BFC,USA,d05
20,LUCENTE Cynthia,RFC,USA,c04
21,PARRILLA Luisa,PRFC,PUR,A05
22,BAS Krystal,PRFC,PUR,C05
23,SHANER Jared,BDF,USA,d05
24,WALKER Mary Anne,DCFC,USA,e05
25,GENN John,VAF,USA,d04
26,WEIL Brent,VAF,USA,c04
27,AL-MOHAMED Deena,NIH,USA,e04
28,BROWN William,JMU,USA,e05
28,SCHIFFMAN Andrew,BDF,USA,e03
30,AGUS-KLEINMAN Shoshan,UMFC,USA,E03
31,MCMULLIN Erin,SJCFU,USA,c04
32,BOOKWALTER James,VAF,USA,c05
33,SCHNEIDER Pamela,OTFG,USA,D01
34,LEGRYS Samuel,SFC,USA,d05
35,ALBERT Lee,VAF,USA,U
36,PEREZ Priscilla,PRFC,PUR,C05
37,BOOKWALTER Timothy,VAF,USA,u
38,KLOTZ Jerry,NIH,USA,u
39,MARSCHNER Bennett,SFC,USA,e05
40,VERNE Laura,BFC,USA,e05
41,HALBERT Nicole,JMU,USA,u
42,CROWE Peter,BFC,USA,u
43,SVIRYDZENKA Katsiaryn,NIH,USA,U
44,SANDERS Lisa,CASM,USA,u
45,DZIKIEWICZ Joseph,VAF,USA,e04
46,HESTER Chris,JMU,USA,u
47,PRATT Robert,CASM,USA,u
48,LYLE Donna,SFC,USA,u
49,BOURQUIN Jessica,UNATT,USA,u
49,HU Kelly,NIH,USA,u
51,WETSTONE Jason,SFC,USA,e05
52,SANDERS Cecilia,CASM,USA,u

[Wafath]

Originally Posted by sundarlia

Um, I hate one of my first actual posts to be negative, but I thought the event while really, really strong had a lot of problems due to poor management and lack of forethought on the host club/division. I really expected better since I had heard so much about this event. The seeding problems were really bad and probably what bugged me the most.

I heard that part of the problem with giving out more ratings, at least in foil, was that the event was poorly/incorrectly seeded and that some of the Cuban/foreign fencers were not rated as they should have been and that fencers with national points were just rated based on their letter. Also for the epee a B05 was seeded ahead of A05's with national points in the pools, and that was just one seeding error. Fencing Time is only $50 dollars guys and it will cut down on most of your problems as long as you enter the data correctly.

I am not going to comment on the rest of your post, but I will comment on the seeding issues, and point out a few things:

1) there was an error in the seeding of one of the B05 fencers in the epee. He was seeded ~10% higher than he should have been due to a typo, and this was not cuaght until pools had been started. Different software will not remove typos; it will only change where typos are likely to happen. And 10% higher with 14 pools ends up being a wash.

2) If you look closely at the results, with some exceptions, most of the Peurto Rico fencers finished about where they were ranked. And in the US, we do have the concept of a "strong C" or a "weak B".

3) To the best of my knowledge, there is no rule for comparative seeding a non qualifier competition, esp with fencers with points in seven different categories. Please correct me if I am wrong; I still have a lot to learn.

Should we have had more refs & machines? yes.

Were things a little chaotic? Maybe. We did everything we could to maximize the usage of the strips & refs we had, and on a day with 133 fencers, we got the competition completed in 10 hours.

Thank you for your comments. We will make improvements for next year.

W

[sreckiki]

Originally Posted by sundarlia

Um, I hate one of my first actual posts to be negative, but I thought the event while really, really strong had a lot of problems due to poor management and lack of forethought on the host club/division. (...). Sorry if I sound overly harsh and please take it as constructive criticism.

Agree with that even if a few things like the seeding did not bother me that much.

We tried many times to explain to the organization that something is wrong when for example, some guys are fencing the round of 16 while some others haven't fence the round of 32 yet but it didn't help. I even ended yelling at one guy but it didn't work better... (OK, that was really bad and I shouldn't have but at one time, I was really p***** off and finally, I think that helped me a little bit during my bouts ).
I really do understand that sometimes it can be really difficult to run a competition for different raisons. But even if finally I had a great time there, we can't say that the management was fine.

Just one tip. Please listen to the fencers. Most of them have already managed this kind of event and their remarks can help, at least most of the time.

And please be aware that I'm critiquing, not criticizing!

[Wafath]

Originally Posted by sreckiki

Totally agree with that.

We tried many times to explain to the organization that something is wrong when for example, some guys are fencing the round of 16 while some others haven't fence the round of 32 yet but it didn't help. I even ended yelling at one guy but it didn't work better... (OK, that was really bad and I shouldn't have but at one time, I was really p***** off and finally, I think that helped me a little bit during my bouts ).

Yes, that was me you yelled at, and I am glad it helped. I took it with a grain of salt since it wasn't the first time you have yelled at me, and I don't think it will be the last.

What I tried to explain to you then is that we sent out DE's in batches as we had refs & strips available. (the refs do have to eat, you know.) We sent out batches of 3-4 DE slips from the top of the table, down to the bottom as we could. Some of the bouts went a lot faster than others, but no round of 32s were handed out before all of the round of 64s were handed out. No round of 16 bouts were handed out if there were any round of 32s available. But we were not going to hunt down a bout that was already in the hot little hands of a ref if we already had another bout to go out.

The last thing I was going to do that day is hold up the tournament for anything other than a USFA mandated delay or a nuclear war. If I ever let a strip & ref sit idle, we would still be fencing right now.

W

[sreckiki]

Originally Posted by Wafath

Yes, that was me you yelled at, and I am glad it helped. I took it with a grain of salt since it wasn't the first time you have yelled at me, and I don't think it will be the last.

Please could you be kind enough to remind me when I yelled at you except when one of my clubmate who was in the same part of the table and who fenced after me, restart fencing 45 min before me and after you signified me to shut up?????

Originally Posted by Wafath

(the refs do have to eat, you know.)

Oh really??????

Originally Posted by Wafath

We sent out batches of 3-4 DE slips from the top of the table, down to the bottom as we could. Some of the bouts went a lot faster than others, but no round of 32s were handed out before all of the round of 64s were handed out. No round of 16 bouts were handed out if there were any round of 32s available. But we were not going to hunt down a bout that was already in the hot little hands of a ref if we already had another bout to go out.

The last thing I was going to do that day is hold up the tournament for anything other than a USFA mandated delay or a nuclear war. If I ever let a strip & ref sit idle, we would still be fencing right now.

W

I (and some others) disagreed with you yesterday and I still disagree with you today. I won't argue with you longer on this board and you'll certainly think that I'm just an arrogant person. That's fine to me.

Anyway, thanks for all your efforts during this day even if we disagree on many points.

[Wafath]

Originally Posted by sreckiki

Please could you be kind enough to remind me when I yelled at you except when one of my clubmate who was in the same part of the table and who fenced after me, restart fencing 45 min before me and after you signified me to shut up?????

In 2003 over the lack of copper strips for epee.

I apologize if I was rude to you at the table, but there were 3 things ahead of you that required my immediate attention.

Originally Posted by sreckiki

I (and some others) disagreed with you yesterday and I still disagree with you today. I won't argue with you longer on this board and you'll certainly think that I'm just an arrogant person. That's fine to me.

I don't think you are arrogant as much as opinionated, but that goes with the territory. I didn't want to get into an argument so much as explain why things were done. I may have made some wrong decisions, but I did the best I could with the resources I had.

W

[Hamley]

Great job running it. I have only one complain and its a biggie.

No offense to the girl who reffed my DE, but she just couldnt reff at that level. She called many inacurant calls which costed me the bout. My mom evan picked up on the bad reffeing. She was just not a good ref thats all she seemed like a extreamly nice girl. Also i was kinda pissed being first seed in the pool, being gram wicas. And comming out of the pool rounds 17th, loosing then the 48 seed, final 8th. But i do have to admit looking at the results after the pools, seeing 16 A and B's then me, the E. Then a bunch of A and B's was just priceless.

[sreckiki]

Originally Posted by Wafath

In 2003 over the lack of copper strips for epee.

OK, I can't take this one for me because I arrived in DC last year (04/2004).

Originally Posted by Wafath

I apologize if I was rude to you at the table, but there were 3 things ahead of you that required my immediate attention.

Apologies accepted. In return, please accept mine. As I've already expressed, I shouldn't have yelled at you.