Defending in General

[Alain]

Really liked a post by mrbiggs about attacking in épée... so, whichever weapon you practice, what's your most effective defence?

What do you do, how do you do it, when, and why..?

Thanks!

[mrbiggs]

Defense I can do.

Against epee fencers that are about as good or worse than I am, I use my foil skills and parry-riposte. They often don't expect it, and I usually get the touch.

I'm also very good at stop hits to the wrist. My favorite touch is against the fencers who raise their hand when they disengage. I either attack or attempt to counter 6, at which point they parry or disengage, opening up their wrist. Meanwhile, I drop down, and hit straight up into their wrist. Hard to get the timing right, but it's quite the touch when it's works.

If it's not obvious, that was epee.

[AndrewH]

Sabre: grab control of the tempo and play around with it. Use distance to try and draw the attack early- i.e. step in, then back out again. Lots of threats to counterattack. Most importantly, stay unpredictable. Just when the attacker begins to hold because he sees you running away, thats when you go for him.

[howtobrew]

Epee: Retreat and counterattack to the arm (somewhere). This topic really got me thinking that....my defense is not very deep. Next lesson I think I will ask the coach to drill me in parrie-ripostes.
Thanks!
JP

[WhipLash]

foil: maintain distance...they can't attack what they can't reach. and i have long arms and legs....
also tried something new instead of juz defending last fri. a good offense is the best defense! so went in, did a circular motion of the foil (dunno if it's considered a bind) to push opp blade aside, then quick lunge in. worked and won against a better opp

[arkady_tsep]

For me in foil and I'm sure that others would agree that it applies to just about anything, whatever you have to do to regain the initiative is your best move. Whatever it takes to make your opp start reacting to you, instead of you falling into the exact parries and footwork that he expects of you to counter his attack.

In sabre and foil, once you've parried sucessfully your opp no longer has the right of way. Therefore aggressively jump at the opportunity to establish your own right of way and begin your attack. If all you do is parry, parry, parry and retreat, you'll never establish your own right of way and you just give your opp more and more chances to score a touch.

[These of course are my own observations and theories. If anyone knows that something that I'm saying is totally wrong by all means let me know.]

[MHS Fencer]

defense? epee? counterattack!!!!

Well, most of the time that's what I do - sometimes coupled with a step back, sometimes a step in - really by the point that you need to do something with your blade you've either set a trap or are in panic mode - defense begins with distance and tempo - blade actions are all secondary. My favorite defense move is a half step or appel on the half-tempo coupled by a quick jump back to reset the situation - of course it needs to be done repeatedly in quick succession, but it allows you to set up a pattern for your opponent and then break when you attack (I guess attacking and defending really both rely on that all important distance/tempo issue)

[KD5MDK]

Take that extra hop back when they make their lunge to make their attack fall short and then riposte (ok, technically it's a new attack) to mask.

[keith]

well whatever the weapon the best defence is tempo.

[Alain]

Here are some of my fave's (for épée)...

- When defending against a deeper attack, bind from quarte to octave/seconde, riposte,

- Prime. I love it. Sometimes preceded by a circular sixte,

- Parry octave, riposte to foot,

- Circular sixte opposition,

- Flick to (top of) hand, often followed by a parry just in case,

- Whenever my genius plan goes wrong - which is quite often - then I like infighting in general, because I tend to score the hit.

But I always say that the best defence is distance, so if your footwork is good enough (and if you stay sharp), then nothing should hit you. Well... that's the theory!

[jBirch]

I'm with arkady_tsep: I try not to do it.

Defense = reaction which is bad. If by defense though, you mean second intention where I call an attack to a line of my choosing then deal with it how I like, well, that's how I defend.

I like binding high-hand low line stop hits, parry riposting straight attacks (try not to have a "favourite parry"), beat attacking PIL or extended arm. Sometimes I set up an attack, counter-time attack to defend against an opponent who likes to pull distance and stop hit. Feint, call the stop hit, then fleche/flunge when the opponent returns en garde sometimes for the same situation. Sometimes against someone who's a really good second intention dude, I just do a slow attack and that often seems to catch them napping. 'Course feint disengage and feint-one-two. Sometimes a ceding parry against a good beat attacker. Sometimes a lazy hand and a snappy parry. Depends on what works.

If I'm stuck reacting I'll usually try to pull distance using a couple of stop hits, feints and fancy footwork to get the opponent to stop and me get away. Absolute worst is parry riposte reflex (c6 is usually what comes out when I'm not thinking) and I often find myself cutting to head...in epee and foil. If I can get myself back in balance (mentally and physically) then I find it best to start dictating the action again.

James.

[nahouw]

Originally Posted by keith

well whatever the weapon the best defence is tempo.

and distance -- it you control both the tempo and the distance, then you control your opponent

[howtobrew]

Okay, still a rube here....

What exactly do you mean with Tempo? What do you actually do to change to gain an advantage? What defines the tempo, your feet? Hopping? do you hop really fast to confuse the opponent?

I am sure the answer will make sense, but the label is not clueing me in here.
Thanks,
HtB

[jBirch]

Originally Posted by howtobrew

Okay, still a rube here....

What exactly do you mean with Tempo? What do you actually do to change to gain an advantage? What defines the tempo, your feet? Hopping? do you hop really fast to confuse the opponent?

I am sure the answer will make sense, but the label is not clueing me in here.
Thanks,
HtB

Tempo has two definitions.

The technical definition is the amount of time it takes you to do one simple fencing action to a fencing target. It is a function of your ability to move your point and your distance from the target. You gain tempo by feinting, beating, parrying, lunging, thrusting and other blade actions. Basically you make it so that your opponent has to do a complex action and you do a simple action to score. This is called "gaining tempo" and you do it by preparations. The classic way to gain tempo is to beat-attack. You beat their blade in time 1 and attack in time 2. They have to recover their blade in time 2, then attack in time 3. Same with parry riposte: you parry in time 1 and riposte in time 2. They recover in time 2 and remise/counter-parry in time 3.

The second definition is tempo as time. Essentially it is the rhythm of the back and forth between your opponent and yourself. Changing the tempo is the changing of the rhythm so your opponent is off balance and ill prepared for your action. You do this by making big motions, small motions, fast motions and slow motions. With footwork, you can take big steps, small stemps, fast steps or slow steps and they all do different things to the tempo of an action.

Hope this helps.

James.

[D+F+P=Hadouken!]

Defense? Hit them before they hit you!

[Epee Scherma]

My favorite defense in epee is hitting the ungrounded strip and saying, "got you!" right as my opponent is starting his offensive action.

[mrbiggs]

Originally Posted by Epee Scherma

My favorite defense in epee is hitting the ungrounded strip and saying, "got you!" right as my opponent is starting his offensive action.

Haha! I'm going to have to do that sometime.

[ThatReallyHurt]

Kick rear leg back to quickly open up some distance, retreat slower than they're advancing then quickly change direction and attack into their advance.

[howtobrew]

Originally Posted by jBirch

Tempo has two definitions.

The technical definition is the amount of time it takes you to do one simple fencing action to a fencing target. (munch) You beat their blade in time 1 and attack in time 2. They have to recover their blade in time 2, then attack in time 3. Same with parry riposte: you parry in time 1 and riposte in time 2. They recover in time 2 and remise/counter-parry in time 3.

The second definition is tempo as time. Essentially it is the rhythm of the back and forth between your opponent and yourself. (munch)
Hope this helps.

James.

Thanks James!
I knew it would make sense once explained. Thus, Tempo and changing tempo are the way that you attain, and retain, control of the bout.

[D+F+P=Hadouken!]

Originally Posted by jBirch

Tempo has two definitions.

The technical definition is the amount of time it takes you to do one simple fencing action to a fencing target. It is a function of your ability to move your point and your distance from the target. You gain tempo by feinting, beating, parrying, lunging, thrusting and other blade actions. Basically you make it so that your opponent has to do a complex action and you do a simple action to score. This is called "gaining tempo" and you do it by preparations. The classic way to gain tempo is to beat-attack. You beat their blade in time 1 and attack in time 2. They have to recover their blade in time 2, then attack in time 3. Same with parry riposte: you parry in time 1 and riposte in time 2. They recover in time 2 and remise/counter-parry in time 3.

The second definition is tempo as time. Essentially it is the rhythm of the back and forth between your opponent and yourself. Changing the tempo is the changing of the rhythm so your opponent is off balance and ill prepared for your action. You do this by making big motions, small motions, fast motions and slow motions. With footwork, you can take big steps, small stemps, fast steps or slow steps and they all do different things to the tempo of an action.

Hope this helps.

James.

Very interesting. I'm still at the point where I don't think about tempo or distance..... I just do things, when it feels right, and usually it works out. Being able to apply a logical thought process to my fencing is probably the next step.