North Texas Grand Prix, late fee waived

[germanguy]

.....

[Victor]

Hunh.
Now why would they do that?

[Katman]

Originally Posted by Victor

Hunh.
Now why would they do that?

I guess people complained about it? If the late fees were anything like the other SSCC event I attended, then a walk-in fencer would have to pay $90 just to fence one event.

Edit: Looks like $95 for the North Texas Grand Prix. The tournament I attended was the Space City Rendezvous in Houston.

[Victor]

re complaining: I'm pretty sure the SSCC committee would have decided on consistent payment arrangements and pre-reg limits at the beginning of the season. Complaining after the circuit is already under way is ineffective and changes in mid-stream are frowned upon.

[Victor]

Originally Posted by germanguy

I just heared that there will be no late fees ...

Cite your source, please. We need validation of some sort, otherwise this particular rumor-post is only going to lead to anger and resentment at the registration table during the weekend.

... And all fingers will point to "some guy" on the message board posting bad info. You.

[germanguy]

.....

[Victor]

Dude, I'm reading and re-reading the FRED info on a second computer screen window now, as directed by the link you provided.

I see event fees, pre-reg and reg and the door -- with normal, double and triple prices, respectively ... and not a single reference to (as you put it), "No Late Fees."

So? You "heard" something that's not been posted at the official site. Point point point.

[oiuyt]

Originally Posted by germanguy

(and you will not get slammed).

I don't know, having to beat a fairly recent Polish Olympian in order to earn a B (looking at the open men's sabre) doesn't seem too easy to me.... :)

-B :)

[rpgsruleall]

Originally Posted by Victor

Dude, I'm reading and re-reading the FRED info on a second computer screen window now, as directed by the link you provided.

I see event fees, pre-reg and reg and the door -- with normal, double and triple prices, respectively ... and not a single reference to (as you put it), "No Late Fees."

So? You "heard" something that's not been posted at the official site. Point point point.

An email was sent out to everyone registered for the tournament stating that late fees would be waived. Email the organizers if you're still in disbelief.

[Sundevil]

Originally Posted by oiuyt

I don't know, having to beat a fairly recent Polish Olympian in order to earn a B (looking at the open men's sabre) doesn't seem too easy to me....

-B

We were just looking at this tournament and thinking about coming over... One of my team mates is questioning whether Tomaz (or Tomasz) Stusinski was an Olympian - not that it really matters - we did find his name on the 1998 roster for the Polish men's team, but not the Olympics.....

Unfortunately, we didn't pre-register in time and thought there were going to be late fees galore - so we decided not to drive over ('cause it's a 2 day trek for us). Now there's no late fee....bummer!

Maybe next year!

[Victor]

Originally Posted by rpgsruleall

An email was sent out to everyone registered for the tournament stating that late fees would be waived. Email the organizers if you're still in disbelief.

Interesting. I didn't receive such. Please, enlighten us by posting that e-mail, the sender's name, and the date received. I'm always interested in exploring the reasons for delayed changes.

As you might not know, a certain motion was made and unanimously approved at the May 2004 section members meeting: "Future modification of policies and directives of the ops manual for the Southwest Section Circuit Cup will be handled by majority vote by the Southwest Section Executive Committee."

Although the ops manual states (sect.III.C), "Each LOC is free to set the entry fees for Competition," the same paragraph clarifies that "Regular pre-registration will end at 2 weeks prior to the Friday before the event (as that Friday is set up day for the event). Fencers may still pre-register after this date but the fee will DOUBLE. Registration at the door (Friday, Saturday, Sunday) is TRIPLE the regular pre-registration fee."

In other words, the locals can set a fee, but the late multipliers are required.

Also, "Pre-registration on either the AskFred.net system or a separate system must be used (because) it is critical for LOCs to know approximately how many fencers are going to show up."

So.

It would seem that any such last-minute waiving of late fees very clearly goes against what the committee agreed upon at the beginning of the season.

And why would this be important? First, rules are rules. (Duh!) Second, this sort of last-moment switcheroo tends to benefit those who are close enough to make a sudden decision to attend and not those who have to plan longer trips further in advance.

It would be a shame to see someone stepping outside the agreed upon structure.

[Rodeo79]

Victor why don't you do some leg work and contact LSFC the tournament organizers, and ask for yourself.... 2 people confirm that there are no late fees yet you still post a epic on that this is just a rumor... Go become informed...

FRED Tournaments
<notices@askfred.net> to undisclosed
More options Mar 17 (23 hours ago)
I am canceling the late fee policy for North Texas Grand Prix. There will be not be late fee for registering late or walk ins.

Michael Kim
Lone Star Fencing Center
(469) 855-1281

[Victor]

Originally Posted by Rodeo79

Victor why don't you do some leg work and contact LSFC the tournament organizers, and ask for yourself.... 2 people confirm that there are no late fees ...

And thank you for your productive input as well.

When you hear questionable information, the first step is to confirm the source, NOT jump ahead and pester people who have better things to do than decline rumors. So, yeah, I want to clarify the rumor and provide valid information as quickly as possible to anyone who might be tempted to act on rotten word-of-mouth. Second, that confirmation from an official LSFC rep might not be immediately forthcoming ... in the meantime, this rumor sits unaddressed. (As for your suggestion, Rodeo, you don't know I haven't sent an e-mail.)

[flying foil]

Many of the "SSCC" tournaments are not on board with the crapola that the "SSCC board" really wants them to implement- The goal of all the tournaments is to foster fencing and GREAT competitions- not to hammer folks with late fees. I know for the Crescent City Open, much of the reason we are not a SSCC event any longer is that we were not willing to treat our guests with triple fees or to penalize women who want to get a lot of great fencing in- but our overhead is so much higher than other events, we have to get more financial security beforehand to rent the space and secure directors (and make sure they are fed and watered).

North TX organizers are much the same way - reasonable folks- just wanting to make sure the infrastructure is in place to support the event.

If you are ever in a quandry as to coming to an event after fees have been raised, I urge anyone to just contact the organizers- if they are jerks, chances are the tourney won't be much fun anyway! Bring a strip or a director as a thank you and you would be in like flynn!! (Errol?)

As to Tomasz - not only a great fencer - but SUCH a nice guy-

[Victor]

Yeah. Representative goverments suck.

[Rodeo79]

Hmmm one wonders why you are the only one who "provides valid information". All the information provided so far about the absense of late fees has been valid. You have been provided with a link to Freds, that no longer mentions late fees as it did previously. You have been provided with a copy of the email sent out to all registered fencers by Fred's, along with contact information. Yet this is still a rumor, gossip, rotten word of mouth, and/or whatever else is listed in your thesaurus.

[fencerX]

Originally Posted by Victor

Although the ops manual states (sect.III.C), "Each LOC is free to set the entry fees for Competition," the same paragraph clarifies that "Regular pre-registration will end at 2 weeks prior to the Friday before the event (as that Friday is set up day for the event). Fencers may still pre-register after this date but the fee will DOUBLE. Registration at the door (Friday, Saturday, Sunday) is TRIPLE the regular pre-registration fee."

In other words, the locals can set a fee, but the late multipliers are required.

[...]

It would seem that any such last-minute waiving of late fees very clearly goes against what the committee agreed upon at the beginning of the season.

[...]

It would be a shame to see someone stepping outside the agreed upon structure.

The "agreed upon structure" is in effect an agreement requiring LOCs to tamper with price levels, and terms and conditions of sale. Therefore it's a price fixing activity.

Remember that the fact all prices are not identical does not indicate the absence of a conspiracy. The agreement to adhere to uniform price discounts or increases alone is price fixing.

http://www.usdoj.gov/usao/eousa/foia...7/ant00008.htm

Let's see ... the Southwest Section has a price fixing conspiracy that's operating across state lines ... let's offer Victor immunity along with placement into the witness protection program and send the rest of the section to big house!

OK, maybe not. The point is price fixing activities generally aren't a good idea, even in cases where they aren't likely to be prosecuted. Price fixing restricts competition, and can also harm innovation and reduce efficiency. While the section might have had certain goals in mind while establishing their scheme, picking price fixing was a poor way to go about it.

[Victor]

(shrug) Hey, fine. Get angry at ME if you want. I'm just pointing out an inconsistency that might end up costing trusting people more money than they were expecting.

1. Rules were set.
2. Someone says those rules are being set aside.

It's gonna be a shame when a fencer shows up expecting to pay a certain amount of money only to discover (horrors!) that his info wasn't legit in one way or another.

I've done my good deed for the day. Tally ho and ta-ta!

[Victor]

Originally Posted by Rodeo79

You have been provided with a link to Freds, that no longer mentions late fees as it did previously.

"Previously" is the keyword here. When this message thread started, it DID point to a page with late fee info.

[fencerX]

Originally Posted by Victor

(shrug) Hey, fine. Get angry at ME if you want. !

Why do you think anyone's angry at you? You're the one we're offering the immunity and witness protection deal to!

Originally Posted by Victor

(I'm just pointing out an inconsistency that might end up costing trusting people more money than they were expecting.!

Fair enough. And I'm just pointing out a consistency (price fixing) that might end up costing everyone more money than was necessary.