Least Corrupt Government?

[audiomyst]

I was talking with my friend recently, who was complaining about Philadelphia's inspection rules, or something. Honestly, I didn't really know what she was talking about . Probably because I've never hired a plumber before, which is what she was mainly focused on. Something about how its pretty corrupt, and the plumbers pay off the inspectors. Well, something involving bribes, inspectors, and plumbers.

So anyway, that lead to a discussion on what the least corrupt government is. What country, in your opinion, has the least corrupt government? (If it interests you, my friend said Sweden. I don't know how valid that is, because my knowledge of Sweden's government is fairly limited.)

[scrapinpeg]

Somalia. Because it doesn't have a government.

[Philistine]

Originally Posted by audiomyst

{snip}
So anyway, that lead to a discussion on what the least corrupt government is. What country, in your opinion, has the least corrupt government?

According to the Transparency International Corruption Perception Report, it's Finland.

Sweden is ranked 6 (out of 146 countries). The US is tied for 17th (with Belgium and Ireland).

--Philistine

[audiomyst]

Originally Posted by Philistine

According to the Transparency International Corruption Perception Report, it's Finland.

Sweden is ranked 6 (out of 146 countries). The US is tied for 17th (with Belgium and Ireland).

--Philistine

Thanks for the the article, guess my friend wasn't far off! So according to that Haiti is the most corrupt (out of the those countries)...

[Inquartata]

Wouldn't it be ironic if the compilers of that report were bought off by the Finnish government...

[mrbiggs]

Originally Posted by Inquartata

Wouldn't it be ironic if the compilers of that report were bought off by the Finnish government...

Watch out. Just because they're Finnish, doesn't mean they won't hurt you.

[PeterGustafsson]

Hi!

Originally Posted by Philistine

According to the Transparency International Corruption Perception Report, it's Finland.

Sweden is ranked 6 (out of 146 countries). The US is tied for 17th (with Belgium and Ireland).

--Philistine

A few notes on why Sweden fared so high:

1. In Sweden, it is difficult to hide wealth.
All IRS returns in Sweden (except those of the very few people who are protected against specific criminals) are open to the public. The papers routinely publish the important figures of the IRS returns of the top-1000 most known celebrities each year. I can phone the local IRS office, and demand to get the taxed income of any Swede, without divulging my own identity, or giving a reason for the question. The IRS will then tell me the figure, but will not notify the person about the request.

This makes it hard to use a large amount of bribe money - if you spend in a opunent way, neighbors/journalists/jealous people will notice the discrepancy between your stated income, and your spending habits. The paper readership and the DA will sound find out.

2. It is impossible to hide your identity in Sweden.
All Swedes are assigned Personal Identity Numbers at birth, and people coming here also get them when they get their residence permit. These numbers are used extensively - by both state and private organizations - to identify people, and they are used in such a way that they are routinely divulged to other people. Not only that, they are also constructed in such a way that it is very difficult to take an incorrect number and getting away with it. For example, my PIN is: 660216-5315 This means that I am born 1966, February (02) 16th. The 53 refers to a region in Sweden, in my case, I was born in Gothenburg (people born outside of sweden get a few numbers out of the 00-99 series, usually over 90). The 1 in 5315 is a gender bit, odd numbers to males and even to females. The final 5 is a parity bit. The consequence of all this is that if anyone would want to steal my identity, they would have to been about my age, preferably be able to speak with a Gothenburg accent, be male, and not look foreign-born in order to not arouse suspicion. Identity theft is therefore well nigh impossible in Sweden, and that is why I dare post my PIN. Another side of this is that it is extremely difficult for anyone who wants to hide corruption money by stashing in it a bank account under a taken PIN.

3. Most people in Sweden get their IRS returns done for them by the state.
Unless you have income earned in a not previously controlled way, doing your IRS return in Sweden amounts to signing the one done by the state, and adding whatever extra incomes and deductions you may have. The tax law is written in such a way that most people have little, if any, of either. How does the state prepare your IRS return then? Simple. The IRS has - by law - access to your bank accounts in Swedish banks, income receipts from your employers, data from the stock exchange, etc. Only self-employed people and top bosses in firms generally have an economic situation where the IRS can not prepare their returns for them.

4. The whistle-blower laws are strong in Sweden.
Since the late 1700eds, there has been a whistle-blower law in Sweden, stating that if information gets to the press from within any kind of organization (a few exceptions, maninly among military and health care) it is illegal for those within the organization to try find out how the information got out, and who the involved people are. This law was enacted by a very undemocratic king, who wanted to capitalize on the large jealousy among Swedes to root out bad civil servants. Now, it is viciously protected by the press, and leaders of state-funded organizations know better than to get burned by this law.

As you see by now, it is really hard in Sweden for a civil servant to take bribes and use the money without arousing suspicion.

There are other kinds of reasons for why Sweden fares so well in this respect, but those sociological, rather than legal, reasons will wait for later.

However, it is often said here that for the average Swedish male, jealously is a stronger drive than the sex drive.


Have a nice time!

Peter Gustafsson

[Zilverzmurfen]

Originally Posted by PeterGustafsson

...preferably be able to speak with a Gothenburg accent...

Aaah, but you don't speak with a Gothenburg accent Peter!
Gone astray, have you..?

And thanks, that was quite informative even for me.

[audiomyst]

Originally Posted by PeterGustafsson

Hi!



A few notes on why Sweden fared so high:

1. In Sweden, it is difficult to hide wealth.
All IRS returns in Sweden (except those of the very few people who are protected against specific criminals) are open to the public. The papers routinely publish the important figures of the IRS returns of the top-1000 most known celebrities each year. I can phone the local IRS office, and demand to get the taxed income of any Swede, without divulging my own identity, or giving a reason for the question. The IRS will then tell me the figure, but will not notify the person about the request.

This makes it hard to use a large amount of bribe money - if you spend in a opunent way, neighbors/journalists/jealous people will notice the discrepancy between your stated income, and your spending habits. The paper readership and the DA will sound find out.

2. It is impossible to hide your identity in Sweden.
All Swedes are assigned Personal Identity Numbers at birth, and people coming here also get them when they get their residence permit. These numbers are used extensively - by both state and private organizations - to identify people, and they are used in such a way that they are routinely divulged to other people. Not only that, they are also constructed in such a way that it is very difficult to take an incorrect number and getting away with it. For example, my PIN is: 660216-5315 This means that I am born 1966, February (02) 16th. The 53 refers to a region in Sweden, in my case, I was born in Gothenburg (people born outside of sweden get a few numbers out of the 00-99 series, usually over 90). The 1 in 5315 is a gender bit, odd numbers to males and even to females. The final 5 is a parity bit. The consequence of all this is that if anyone would want to steal my identity, they would have to been about my age, preferably be able to speak with a Gothenburg accent, be male, and not look foreign-born in order to not arouse suspicion. Identity theft is therefore well nigh impossible in Sweden, and that is why I dare post my PIN. Another side of this is that it is extremely difficult for anyone who wants to hide corruption money by stashing in it a bank account under a taken PIN.

3. Most people in Sweden get their IRS returns done for them by the state.
Unless you have income earned in a not previously controlled way, doing your IRS return in Sweden amounts to signing the one done by the state, and adding whatever extra incomes and deductions you may have. The tax law is written in such a way that most people have little, if any, of either. How does the state prepare your IRS return then? Simple. The IRS has - by law - access to your bank accounts in Swedish banks, income receipts from your employers, data from the stock exchange, etc. Only self-employed people and top bosses in firms generally have an economic situation where the IRS can not prepare their returns for them.

4. The whistle-blower laws are strong in Sweden.
Since the late 1700eds, there has been a whistle-blower law in Sweden, stating that if information gets to the press from within any kind of organization (a few exceptions, maninly among military and health care) it is illegal for those within the organization to try find out how the information got out, and who the involved people are. This law was enacted by a very undemocratic king, who wanted to capitalize on the large jealousy among Swedes to root out bad civil servants. Now, it is viciously protected by the press, and leaders of state-funded organizations know better than to get burned by this law.

As you see by now, it is really hard in Sweden for a civil servant to take bribes and use the money without arousing suspicion.

There are other kinds of reasons for why Sweden fares so well in this respect, but those sociological, rather than legal, reasons will wait for later.

However, it is often said here that for the average Swedish male, jealously is a stronger drive than the sex drive.


Have a nice time!

Peter Gustafsson

Thanks for the info! I've learned alot more about Sweden's government today (not that I really knew anything to begin with ). Its certainly different in the US, what caught my attention was the Personal Identity Number part. I know several people here who have had their identities stolen.

[PeterGustafsson]

Hi!

Originally Posted by Zilverzmurfen

Aaah, but you don't speak with a Gothenburg accent Peter!
Gone astray, have you..?

Född på Sahlgrenska, bodde på Majorna tills jag var 8, farsan jobbade på Chalmers. Han fick dock jobb på Luleå Tekniska Högskola 1974, därav dialektförlusten.

Minste grabben är född här i Kristianstad, men talar inte Skånska för det - på hans dagisavdelning är det 2.5 svenska barn, och 9.5 med utländsk härkomst, han utgör bägge 0.5-orna.


Ha det bra!

Peter Gustafsson

[Soldier]

...same to you, buddy!

[Inquartata]

Originally Posted by mrbiggs

Watch out. Just because they're Finnish, doesn't mean they won't hurt you.

Just as long as they don't Finnish the job.

[Inquartata]

Peter, all of your safeguards depend upon one assumption: that all transactions between corrupt officials and their purchasers occur in Sweden. Monies paid elsewhere and retained in foreign bank accounts---or for that matter under the mattress---could escape notice entirely, no?

I would not care to give up so much of my privacy for the illusion of greater security...

[Soldier]

Originally Posted by Inquartata

Just as long as they don't Finnish the job.

That was a swede pun.

Norway I can beat it...

[Inquartata]

It cannot be Dane-ied...

[Have At You]

Viking-A, you're hurting my stomach

[ThatReallyHurt]

Originally Posted by PeterGustafsson

Hi!



Född på Sahlgrenska, bodde på Majorna tills jag var 8, farsan jobbade på Chalmers. Han fick dock jobb på Luleå Tekniska Högskola 1974, därav dialektförlusten.

Minste grabben är född här i Kristianstad, men talar inte Skånska för det - på hans dagisavdelning är det 2.5 svenska barn, och 9.5 med utländsk härkomst, han utgör bägge 0.5-orna.


Ha det bra!

Peter Gustafsson

Jag förstår inte vad du säger...

[LUDICROUS]

Good to see NZ is 2nd.

Now If only I could corrupt the PM to pour millions into fencing

[JyJy]

Originally Posted by Inquartata

Just as long as they don't Finnish the job.

No, we just make you write a thesis about how easy Finnish grammar is.
Or alternatively you can choose to go to Lappland and castrate a few hundred reindeer in the old-fashioned way. Take your pick

JyJy

[Zilverzmurfen]

Originally Posted by JyJy

No, we just make you write a thesis about how easy Finnish grammar is.
Or alternatively you can choose to go to Lappland and castrate a few hundred reindeer in the old-fashioned way. Take your pick

JyJy

Eeeeeeewwww!
That's actually not an easy choice...