Terminology Question

[howtobrew]

What is a remise?

Is there a list of common terms and definitions somewhere? The FAQ just seems to be a Search engine, and if you don't know what to search for, it is not terribly useful. Likewise if you get a list of posts using the term, but not necessarily explaining what it is.
Thanks!
John

[peet]

The word remise is used in a more or less narrowly defined way by different people, but a common, less narrow usage is essentially: "an attempt to hit after the original attack has failed for some reason (either because it was parried, missed, or whatever)"

as in :
"The attack from left is parried, the riposte from right arrives, and the remise from left is out of time. Touch for right."

HTH,

-p

[howtobrew]

AH! Thanks! Now I remember, my coach has been teaching me that "lunge, half step, lunge again routine".

[edew]

Read the rule book.

It's t.8(d)1

[oiuyt]

Originally Posted by howtobrew

AH! Thanks! Now I remember, my coach has been teaching me that "lunge, half step, lunge again routine".

Note also the definition of redoublement, which immediately follows that of remise cited by Eric.

What you're describing from your lesson would normally be described as a redoublement rather than a remise.

-B :)

[downunder]

difference between a remise and a redoublement is that a remise is in the same line, whereas a redouble is in a different line.

When refereeing, remise covers all possibilities.

[parrythis]

Redoublement - a new action that follows an attack that missed or was parried; see also Reprise.

Remise - immediate replacement of an attack that missed or was parried, without withdrawing the arm.

Reprise - renewal of an attack that missed or was parried, after a return to en-garde ; see also Redoublement.

So the difference may be somewhat subtle. The redoublement distinguishes itself from the remise by the fact that it is a new action rather than a continuation of an existing one. The reprise distinguishes itself by having the fencer return to en-garde.

[Alain]

Well, I thought...

Remise: continuation of an action (i.e. your lunge falls short, or is parried) - in the same line as before. For example, you lunge direct, your opponent parries quarte... you angulate your point and hit with a remise.

Redouble: continuation of an action (i.e. your lunge falls short, or is parried) - in a different line from before. For example, you lunge direct, your opponent parries quarte... you hit on the other side of their blade (or on the leg/foot in épée) with a redouble.

[oiuyt]

It's one of those bits of fencing terminology which has acquired different definitions depending on who is using the words (and, in some cases, context).

Alain's definitions match the way I was originally taught.

The most common useage that I currently hear uses remise for both direct and indirect replacements using just handwork and uses redoublement for replacements that also involve additional forward footwork. I very rarely hear reprise used at all, as most people disconnect the two phrases with the return to guard. When I use the terms I generally follow the conventions outlined in this paragraph. I've found that they are more easily and commonly understood and that I have less "correction" of what other people say if I go with these rather than insisting that people learn what my original master taught me.

I would be unsurprised to find that there are regional differences in what the most common definitions used are.

-B :)

[howtobrew]

Thanks guys, I really appreciate your help! If I can ever return the favor with a homebrewing question, just ask.
John

[oiuyt]

Originally Posted by howtobrew

Thanks guys, I really appreciate your help! If I can ever return the favor with a homebrewing question, just ask.
John

You could return the favor with homebrew rather than with homebrewing questions.... :)

-B :)