New dealer in town!

[New Dealer]

I am in the initial planning stages of becoming an equipment dealer here in the Southern California Division. I’m in the process of investigating my initial product line and getting the paperwork together, so it’ll be a while, but I’m aiming for starting up just after Summer Nationals.

I’ll probably be selling mostly Allstar (although I’ll sell other brands as well), if for no other reason than all the other dealers in California sell Uhlmann! My initial focus will be on the small, inexpensive stuff that’s always breaking -- foil/epee wires, barrels, tips, springs, screws, etc., as well as sockets, guards, pads, and some maintenance equipment. I’m also going to try and be available for more than two days a week, 4 hours each day! Let’s face it, most fencers do no maintenance until the day before a tournament, and that’s when stuff breaks and can’t be easily replaced if no one’s open. I will grow into larger priced items like blades and clothing in the future.

The questions for every one are (and it ties in with the dealer poll nicely), as a consumer, what do you want from a dealer? What manufacturers would you stay away from, even if the stuff was free? What would you buy even if it was slightly higher in price? Would it make a difference, if you were in Fresno, for example, if I could ship you specific Allstar stuff in a couple of days, versus the week or more from the East coast?

Please let me know. I want to serve fellow fencers as best I can, and your input will help me do so.

Hey Hey, new dealer!

Well first off, what is your little name gonna be called?
What I look for in a dealer, is customer service, almost 100%. I want to be able to explain to you what i want if you don't have it, you know? Like if you don't know what i'm talking about, i wanna be able to explain it.
Anyhoo, i'm a so-cal fencer, and i do believe that its a b*tching idea to have more than 8 hours of operation in a fencing dealer. That, and Fr. Calhoun always buys out the damn stuff i wanna get from so cal!
If i were you, i would carry as much stuff as possible- but don't carry the crappy stuff. Just scrape the sh*t off the stick, and carry uhlmann, allstar and france-lames or whatever. I hope this info proved a bit helpful. As a socal fencer, i hope i really do see you out there. Who knows, maybe you'll take FencingPost's place in my heart...

gman


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Pain is only weakness leaving the body.

[New Dealer]

Originally posted by Slim_Grady:
Hey Hey, new dealer!

Well first off, what is your little name gonna be called?

I’m not quite sure yet, although there are several possibilities. The wife’s suggesting “Touche’ 84” (the 84 comes from the year 1984, a rather significant year in my life). However, I’m leaning toward something a little more blatantly fencing. My current four choices are “Point in Line Fencing”, “Prise de Fer”, “La Piste”, and “Parry-Riposte.”

The problems with the names are that “Point in Line” is the name of a club in Texas. “Prise de Fer” is such an esoteric term that only fencers will get it, and although that’s my target clientele, should I open a storefront in the future, I’d want the name to draw in people off the street to see what the store’s about (and, therefore, the sport itself). “La Piste” sounds like a French restaurant. My favorite is “Parry-Riposte,” but nothing’s been decided yet.

What I look for in a dealer, is customer service, almost 100%. I want to be able to explain to you what i want if you don't have it, you know? Like if you don't know what i'm talking about, i wanna be able to explain it. [/quote]

I can be good at that. I have a slight speech impediment, so I’m quite used to having to repeat myself if I garble the words. I also understand when someone’s groping to describe something. I do it myself all the time. If it comes to it, I can take all the time you need to describe something to me.


Anyhoo, i'm a so-cal fencer, and i do believe that its a b*tching idea to have more than 8 hours of operation in a fencing dealer. That, and Fr. Calhoun always buys out the damn stuff i wanna get from so cal! [/quote]

Oh my, yes. I know all about So Cal being out of foil/epee wires after Father’s been there. That’s one of the prime reasons I’m starting up business myself.


If i were you, i would carry as much stuff as possible- but don't carry the crappy stuff. Just scrape the sh*t off the stick, and carry uhlmann, allstar and france-lames or whatever. I hope this info proved a bit helpful. As a socal fencer, i hope i really do see you out there. Who knows, maybe you'll take FencingPost's place in my heart...

gman[/quote]

Well...I’d LOVE to start with a full line of gear from screws to FIE clothing, but in order to get going in the first place, I’m going to have to start with the least expensive stuff. I’m narrowing it down to gear that normally sells for $15.00 or less. If sales go well, I’ll expand into blades. Clothing items come last, unless things really heat up. We’ll see what happens. It’s going to be a long fight to get the business solvent, and I’m operating in a niche business, but I think I can at least provide a service for those fencers panicking before a tournament.

What do you define as cheap gear I should avoid? I want as much input as I can get.

As far as replacing Fencing Post in your heart (and pocketbook), I certainly HOPE so! Saul’s a nice guy, but business is business, after all.

Then again, Saul and Linkmeyer may just use their greater business experience and grind me into the ground.

As the saying goes...”He who dares, wins.”

Carpe Diem (Seize the Day)

Hmmm...that’s another possible name

[New Dealer]

Originally posted by Slim_Grady:
Hey Hey, new dealer!

Well first off, what is your little name gonna be called?

I’m not quite sure yet, although there are several possibilities. The wife’s suggesting “Touche’ 84” (the 84 comes from the year 1984, a rather significant year in my life). However, I’m leaning toward something a little more blatantly fencing. My current four choices are “Point in Line Fencing”, “Prise de Fer”, “La Piste”, and “Parry-Riposte.”

The problems with the names are that “Point in Line” is the name of a club in Texas. “Prise de Fer” is such an esoteric term that only fencers will get it, and although that’s my target clientele, should I open a storefront in the future, I’d want the name to draw in people off the street to see what the store’s about (and, therefore, the sport itself). “La Piste” sounds like a French restaurant. My favorite is “Parry-Riposte,” but nothing’s been decided yet.

What I look for in a dealer, is customer service, almost 100%. I want to be able to explain to you what i want if you don't have it, you know? Like if you don't know what i'm talking about, i wanna be able to explain it. [/quote]

I can be good at that. I have a slight speech impediment, so I’m quite used to having to repeat myself if I garble the words. I also understand when someone’s groping to describe something. I do it myself all the time. If it comes to it, I can take all the time you need to describe something to me.


Anyhoo, i'm a so-cal fencer, and i do believe that its a b*tching idea to have more than 8 hours of operation in a fencing dealer. That, and Fr. Calhoun always buys out the damn stuff i wanna get from so cal! [/quote]

Oh my, yes. I know all about So Cal being out of foil/epee wires after Father’s been there. That’s one of the prime reasons I’m starting up business myself.


If i were you, i would carry as much stuff as possible- but don't carry the crappy stuff. Just scrape the sh*t off the stick, and carry uhlmann, allstar and france-lames or whatever. I hope this info proved a bit helpful. As a socal fencer, i hope i really do see you out there. Who knows, maybe you'll take FencingPost's place in my heart...

gman[/quote]

Well...I’d LOVE to start with a full line of gear from screws to FIE clothing, but in order to get going in the first place, I’m going to have to start with the least expensive stuff. I’m narrowing it down to gear that normally sells for $15.00 or less. If sales go well, I’ll expand into blades. Clothing items come last, unless things really heat up. We’ll see what happens. It’s going to be a long fight to get the business solvent, and I’m operating in a niche business, but I think I can at least provide a service for those fencers panicking before a tournament.

What do you define as cheap gear I should avoid? I want as much input as I can get.

As far as replacing Fencing Post in your heart (and pocketbook), I certainly HOPE so! Saul’s a nice guy, but business is business, after all.

Then again, Saul and Linkmeyer may just use their greater business experience and grind me into the ground.

As the saying goes...”He who dares, wins.”

Carpe Diem (Seize the Day)

Hmmm...that’s another possible name

[space_cadet]

La Piste, if pronounced correctly, sounds the same as La Pissed, which then you might as well call your store "The Urination Station". That's my marketing train of thought.
Here are some suggestions for other names "A Fencing Post, not to be confused with The Fencing Post" and "Fencers Unlimited" which can be abbreviated to FU.

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Cadet à Space

[New Dealer]

Originally posted by space_cadet:
La Piste, if pronounced correctly, sounds the same as La Pissed, which then you might as well call your store "The Urination Station". That's my marketing train of thought.
Here are some suggestions for other names "A Fencing Post, not to be confused with The Fencing Post" and "Fencers Unlimited" which can be abbreviated to FU.

Oh yeah. THAT'LL get me business!

[Purple Fencer]

Originally posted by space_cadet:
La Piste, if pronounced correctly, sounds the same as La Pissed, which then you might as well call your store "The Urination Station". That's my marketing train of thought.
Here are some suggestions for other names "A Fencing Post, not to be confused with The Fencing Post" and "Fencers Unlimited" which can be abbreviated to FU.

Uriniation Station? Gad! He'd have to start selling really bizzare porno tapes on the side to justify that one!

Actully, though, Fencers Unlimited isn't all that bad. Except for ther fact that his opening list of products IS a bit limited. Maybe New Dealer can change that. I know I'd buy from someone who had good gear that was nto sold out all the time (thank you, Father Calhoun ), and was - most importantly - available on those Fridays and Saturdays when I've screwed up my last epee wire.

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Sam Signorelli -- I'll be mellow when I'm
DEAD!

[edew]

Fencing is still a relatively small market. It doesn't help to be too competitive with other fencing vendors, as many other vendors have learned. It's better to be cooperative than to be competitive.

For example, Fencing Post now sells Blue Gauntlet equipment, and when one vendor is low on something, they either buy in bulk from another vendor, or direct their customers to that other vendor. Thinking that you have to take on directly vendors like The Fencing Post or American Fencers (or Le Touche of Class or Linkmeyers in LA) is both short-sighted and detrimental to your business. It's not that one of them will feel the heat and retaliate. It's that perhaps ALL of them will retaliate, and you'll be pummelled by everyone from American Fencers to Zivkovic.

Smart and successful business does not require head-to-head combat against (especially!) established companies.

[d8m2k]

Rumor has it that Saul and the Fencing Post will be moving to San Diego sometime in the near future. That alone may affect your business plan.

[ledgerto]

Please, let me make a suggestion. I have been totaly frustrated with two different dealers who promise delivery, then I wait...and.....wait....and wait.....try to call to make sure it's been shipped...call...call....call.... can't get ahold of....wait some more....get my drift?

If you are out of stock or there is a delay in shipping for some other reason call back and let the customer know. One little call can save frustration for your customer and they will think you are a bit more professional. I would definately order again from someone who is upfront with me.

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Old dogs CAN learn new tricks!

[New Dealer]

Originally posted by edew:
Fencing is still a relatively small market. It doesn't help to be too competitive with other fencing vendors, as many other vendors have learned. It's better to be cooperative than to be competitive.

For example, Fencing Post now sells Blue Gauntlet equipment, and when one vendor is low on something, they either buy in bulk from another vendor, or direct their customers to that other vendor. Thinking that you have to take on directly vendors like The Fencing Post or American Fencers (or Le Touche of Class or Linkmeyers in LA) is both short-sighted and detrimental to your business. It's not that one of them will feel the heat and retaliate. It's that perhaps ALL of them will retaliate, and you'll be pummelled by everyone from American Fencers to Zivkovic.

Smart and successful business does not require head-to-head combat against (especially!) established companies.

Eric,

You are entirely correct. My comment about Slim Grady moving his business to me once I get up and running was mostly joking. I KNOW Saul and Linkmeyer have it all over me in terms of experience and product. Remember, I also mentioned that they’d probably kick my tush while I was getting going.

However, the fact still remains that SoCal Fencing’s hours are highly inconvenient for the major equipment provider in the 3rd largest division in the USFA. You’re close enough to American Fencing to probably physically go to the location, and they’re open normal business hours. SoCal is not. My whole purpose is to provide an alternative source.

I’ve also seen what you describe re vendors helping each other. At the Long Beach Invitational, I saw Saul buy some epee guards from Le Touche of Class. I’d imagine they’re selling at cost, since it makes no sense for Saul to buy from Le Touche retail, then mark up to his sale to cover the purchase. They may have bartered, for all I know.

Originally posted by d8m2k:
Rumor has it that Saul and the Fencing Post will be moving to San Diego sometime in the near future. That alone may affect your business plan.

Perhaps, but since my initial target clientele is in the SoCal Division - 100 miles + from San Diego - I wouldn't think so, at least not that much. Saul moving to SD will certainly help that division, though, and for the same reason that I’m trying to start up.

Originally posted by ledgerto:
Please, let me make a suggestion. I have been totaly frustrated with two different dealers who promise delivery, then I wait...and.....wait....and wait.....try to call to make sure it's been shipped...call...call....call.... can't get ahold of....wait some more....get my drift?

If you are out of stock or there is a delay in shipping for some other reason call back and let the customer know. One little call can save frustration for your customer and they will think you are a bit more professional. I would definately order again from someone who is upfront with me.

Absolutely. I appreciate the same thing when I buy from someone. Both American Fencing Supply and Blade were very upfront with me when I’ve purchased items from them, and, as a customer, I appreciate it more than I would a cheap cost. I am still working on my delivery methodology. Most likely it’ll be via UPS so I can track the shipments. If next day delivery is needed, and it’s too late for UPS, I might add the UPS next day fees to the order and drive the items over to the fencer or his salle, if I’m close enough to do so. The costs to the purchaser would be the same either way.

I appreciate all the feedback, guys. Even the admonishment from Eric (Keeps me more or lest honest and realistic). Keep it coming.

[space_cadet]

To New Dealer and Purple Fencer,
I was only kidding about the store names.

To New Dealer,
To answer your question (I'm not in the so-cal area) "What do you want from a dealer?", I would want a selection of all fencing items at competitive prices.

Correct me if I'm wrong, you want to run a business selling fencing supplies under $15 marketed towards the So-cal fencing community and be open for more than two days a week at more than four hours a day and be competitive enough to draw business away from other mail-order fencing suppliers?

I would like to challenge your idea by being the devil's advocate.
1. The market you are focusing in on is too small to make your business expand if not keep it afloat. Triplette, The Fencing Post, American Fencers Supply, Santelli, Blade-Fencing, PBT and others not only supply locally but to the entire US fencing market.
2. Since you aren't and can't offer blades or uniforms, you can lose business to customers who want to get all items at one place to other suppliers.

3. Fencers aren't shopping every week or month. They re-stock when things break down (you yourself mentioned things needing to be replaced before a tournament). That means you could be open for weeks and days without selling a thing. Can your business handle that?

4. You're questioning if people are willing to pay a higher price for convenience of availablility. If your business is relying on customers who need parts in a hurry, that's going to hurt sales because that doesn't happen often. Customers realize they can get the same parts cheaper elsewhere and stock up on it.

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Cadet à Space


[This message has been edited by space_cadet (edited 04-05-2001).]

[Stryder]

Space Caddy makes a good point. If your target group is the much sought after "fencers desperate for $8 worth of fencing trinkets the night before a tournament" demographic. Then you aren't going to be rolling in it right away. Perhaps you could test the waters first be getting some product and taking it to some tournaments. Do that for a year, including some product that is uniquely yours to improve your recognition, then open a storefront. You'll be that much wiser.

Names:
"Prise d fir" sounds like it's French for "Really good fur" and if I think about it later at night, I am sure there are countless puns to be had.
"Carpe Diem" isn't bad. Over used, but not bad.

Call me unimaginative, but how about something like "SoCal fencing equipment" Or "Los Angeles fencing Equipment" Although that one might get you some unwanted requests for trenchcoats and once-used firearms.

[New Dealer]

Originally posted by space_cadet:

To answer your question (I'm not in the so-cal area) "What do you want from a dealer?", I would want a selection of all fencing items at competitive prices.

Correct me if I'm wrong, you want to run a business selling fencing supplies under $15 marketed towards the So-cal fencing community and be open for more than two days a week at more than four hours a day and be competitive enough to draw business away from other mail-order fencing suppliers?

I’m sorry. I didn’t state it, but this is not going to be a full-time storefront operation. To start off, it’s going to be primarily via Internet and local word of mouth out of my home. The being open for more than SoCal’s hours simply meant that I would be available a little longer, particularly closer to tournament time. They also have no Internet presence. Mine would be a small operation at the start. I’m NOT quitting my day job just yet...I’ve got a mortgage to think about.

I would like to challenge your idea by being the devil's advocate.
1. The market you are focusing in on is too small to make your business expand if not keep it afloat. Triplette, The Fencing Post, American Fencers Supply, Santelli, Blade-Fencing, PBT and others not only supply locally but to the entire US fencing market.

2. Since you aren't and can't offer blades or uniforms, you can lose business to customers who want to get all items at one place to other suppliers.

3. Fencers aren't shopping every week or month. They re-stock when things break down (you yourself mentioned things needing to be replaced before a tournament). That means you could be open for weeks and days without selling a thing. Can your business handle that?

4. You're questioning if people are willing to pay a higher price for convenience of availablility. If your business is relying on customers who need parts in a hurry, that's going to hurt sales because that doesn't happen often. Customers realize they can get the same parts cheaper elsewhere and stock up on it.

[/quote]
Okay, I’ll take the challenge.

1. I’ve gotta start somewhere. My start up finances are going to be a bit limited, which is why I’m starting with the small stuff. Growth WILL be slow, I know, if at all. However, unless I hit the lottery, I know I won’t have anything resembling a nationwide business yet, if ever. I’m fully aware that it might never get bigger than a divisional business. Again, remember that I won’t be depending on this to support myself full-time. If I was, I’d be going the whole nine yards and opening a fully stocked storefront.

2. I acknowledge this. I don’t have much of a choice. I’m trying to fill a smaller niche, at least at the outset. The whole idea of any start up business is to find a niche and fill it, no matter how small or specialized. I know an attorney who ONLY does client bankruptcy hearings for attorneys who don;t have the time to spend all day in court for a 2 minute hearing. Half of the time he’s not really even needed at the hearing, but he’s there just in case. He only charges a small fee to the case attorney, but he’s got a lot of business in Los Angeles.

It really depends on your expectations. It may not sound like it, but I DO have a concept of the realities of a business. My dreams aren’t pie-in-the-sky...more like pie-on-a -ladder. I’m a bit more realistic than it might seem

3. I believe this was answered previously. It’s a good point, however.

4. Same as above.

I think the problem here is that my original post gave the impression of a big operation from the get go. As I’ve said, that’s not the plan. I understand that I might run in the red the entire time, I might barely break even, I might just make enough to pay for my tournament entries for a year, or I might get lucky and make a few bucks to supplement my currently income.

Regardless of the end results, I feel my fencers in my division (and others) would not be hurt by another outlet for supplies, no matter how small or how poorly run.

Keep it coming, guys!

[Gav]

I wish you well. Although your target custom is a very small marketplace it can be quite competitive. Personally I've never had any bother with any vendor that I've used. I will prefer a vendor that's friendly and courteous and also doesn't mind helping me get the weapon spec I want. So if you plan to start up stalls - be helpful.

One service you might want to consider is the provision of an armoury service. I myself would love to be able to hand over weapons to someone, to tweak and fix, but very few peope out there seem to want to.

Dunno what the market would be - fencers your input please!!!

Anyway make sure you have plenty of stock. If you give a delivery date - deliver on that date.

Sorry if I've reiterated any point anyone made but it's late and I'm pretty tred.

[space_cadet]

To New Dealer,
Ah, you've answered all my questions. Sounds like you want to be the "Avon lady" of fencing supplies. Minimal overhead, flexible hours, easy access for customers, no store front.
Have a happy day.

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Cadet à Space

[New Dealer]

Originally posted by Stryder:
Space Caddy makes a good point. If your target group is the much sought after "fencers desperate for $8 worth of fencing trinkets the night before a tournament" demographic. Then you aren't going to be rolling in it right away. Perhaps you could test the waters first be getting some product and taking it to some tournaments. Do that for a year, including some product that is uniquely yours to improve your recognition, then open a storefront. You'll be that much wiser.

Names:
"Prise d fir" sounds like it's French for "Really good fur" and if I think about it later at night, I am sure there are countless puns to be had.
"Carpe Diem" isn't bad. Over used, but not bad.

Call me unimaginative, but how about something like "SoCal fencing equipment" Or "Los Angeles fencing Equipment" Although that one might get you some unwanted requests for trenchcoats and once-used firearms.

Rolling in it? Hell, I’ll be lucky to be trickling in it I thought about setting up a booth, like you suggested. However, I noticed that very few people actually buy at local tourneys. Le Touche of Class occasionally set up at SoCal tourneys a couple of years back. I don't think he made enough sales to recoup the gas costs up from Long Beach. At sectional and national events people do buy. At locals, I didn't see much purchasing. it’s a though, though. I may still try to do it next season.

“Really Good Fur”? Great...that means my first customers will be from PETA I wasn't even serious considering Carpe Diem, for the exact reason you mentioned.

SoCal Fencing Equipment is already taken, and Los Angeles Fencing Equioment’s just too close of a name. I’m still thinking about it.

Originally posted by Gav:
I wish you well. Although your target custom is a very small marketplace it can be quite competitive. Personally I've never had any bother with any vendor that I've used. I will prefer a vendor that's friendly and courteous and also doesn't mind helping me get the weapon spec I want. So if you plan to start up stalls - be helpful.

One service you might want to consider is the provision of an armoury service. I myself would love to be able to hand over weapons to someone, to tweak and fix, but very few peope out there seem to want to.

Dunno what the market would be - fencers your input please!!!

Anyway make sure you have plenty of stock. If you give a delivery date - deliver on that date.

Sorry if I've reiterated any point anyone made but it's late and I'm pretty tred.

Nope, I don't mind.

I was actually thinking of providing a small armory service, probably limited to rewires of weapons. I don't trust myself to balance anyone else’s weapon yet.

As I've said before, the items I plan to start out with a very inexpensive, even at the retail level. That way I WILL have sufficient stock.

Originally posted by space_cadet:
To New Dealer,
Ah, you've answered all my questions. Sounds like you want to be the "Avon lady" of fencing supplies. Minimal overhead, flexible hours, easy access for customers, no store front.
Have a happy day.

Sorry, I don’t look god enough to be the Avon lady! You pretty much nailed it, though. I'll grow it when I can.