Grip question

[jspierre]

I've often heard people say the first thing you should do with a grip (ortho) is cut it down. I think they mean, trim the tang end that extends beyond the break in the wrist, since this inhibits free movement of the wrist.

How do people "cut" the handle? Seems like a hard thing to do, no?

Do people believe in the supposed benefits that result? Are they more meaningful in epee than foil?

[DJ Apostrophe]

I dont cut mime (i fence epee btw), i like the little bit of balance it adds, however, if i were to fence with a german grip i have found that sometimes (depending on manufacturer) the 'long' german shape will bang into my wrist on ocassion...
ive been using a V3 for a while now without any issue from the extension...

[oiuyt]

Hi,

Most people do NOT cut down their grips... if more people wanted them shorter they'd be manufactured that way. Trust me, I used to armor (and fence) for a team where the year before the armorer had decided that chopped grips were the thing... one of the most annoying things in the world trying to get enough weapons that people are happy with when no one likes the modified grips and nearly every grip your team owns has been "improved" in such a non-reversible manner.

There's dozens of grip designs out there, find one that you like that doesn't impede your movements (shouldn't you be using your fingers for nearly everything in the first place? Granted a shorter tang helps in prime, but done correctly even THAT'S not a problem). If all else fails and you still have a problem, THAT'S when you make the personal decision that YOUR grip needs to have bits removed.

Incidently, some grips don't have long extensions over the wrist (some (all?) of the Zivkovik grips spring immediately to mind) so if that's really something you need, look around. It's a LOT easier to find a grip you like than to worry about taking a hacksaw to a grip you don't. If you DO decide to cut your grips down a hacksaw with a blade designed for metal should do the trick.

-B

[neevel]

Pistol grips are made of cast aluminum, which isn't hard, so a hacksaw with a blade for metals will do the job handily.

Whether and how you cut a grip is purely a matter of personal preference. In addition to shortening up the rear extension, another very common modification is to shorten up the neck of the grip (you may find a grip that fits well in your hand, but is too long up front). Filing the body of the grip to reshape it to your tastes is also easy to do.

The rear extension is there for a reason-- its resting against the root of the thumb serves as counter-balance to the weight of the blade (as the pommel on a French or Italian does), and gives another leverage/control surface for blade actions. If giving that up in exchange for the ability to make greater angulations for infighting fits with your own game, then fine, but it's not something that you should do just because a lot of other people you know do it. If you want, try it with one grip and see how it works for you.

-Dave

[three_hundred_fifty_five]

[quote]Originally posted by jspierre:
<strong>I've often heard people say the first thing you should do with a grip (ortho) is cut it down. I think they mean, trim the tang end that extends beyond the break in the wrist, since this inhibits free movement of the wrist.

How do people "cut" the handle? Seems like a hard thing to do, no?

Do people believe in the supposed benefits that result? Are they more meaningful in epee than foil?</strong><hr></blockquote>


You should ask these "people" you often hear if they mean the tang of the blade, because that makes more sense. You always cut down the tang of the blade unless is comes pre-cut if you are fitting a pistol grip.
Yes, you can cut and shave down parts of a pistol grip to make it feel better. I choose a grip that feels right so I don't have to modify it. The only part I can think of cutting down is the rear extension. And even then, that would mainly apply towards the long German grip which has an obviously long extension. To shorten that part on any other model would take away the ability to leverage the grip in one direction, thus ruining your grip. Another person already described how the rear extension is useful.
<img src="graemlins/jawa.gif" border="0" alt="[Jawa]" />

[Stryder]

While some people DO cut off the rear extension of the pistol grip, most skilled fencers do not.

What is done by a majority of foilists and many epeeists, is shorten what has been called the "Neck" of the grip. The part that comes in contact with the bellguard.
It is a good idea for most competitive fencers to do so because it moves the center of gravity forward, increasing blade speed and making power actions like binds, pris de fir, and flicks easier to do.
I would advise against doing within the first year or two of competition however. The grips are made the way they are because most people don't have the hand strength that experienced fencers have. Until your hands are quite strong you need that extra cm of leverage to wield your foil properly. When your hand gets stronger, you will find your grip feels bulky and awkward, cut it down only when you reach this point, but even then do it in small stages, no more than 2-3mm at a time. If you take too much off, you will be buying new grips and handing these down to your little sister. If you take some off too soon your fencing will suffer, as will the tendons in your wrist and hands.

PS: For the advanced fencers and their respective armourers. When you cut the grip down, cut it at a bit of an angle, matching it to the amount of cant the fencer likes in your tang. This not only makes the modified weapon come together a bit more like the manufacturer intended, it does away with that pesky problem of getting your tightening tools stuck against the inside of the grip.

[goldbaker]

Two quick comments from someone that has broken a lot of fencing equipment. Cutting down the rear extension usually will do more harm than good unless you can't get a comfortable grip otherwise. If it doesn't dig into your wrist or intefere with parries in prime, don't do it.

Cutting off the neck of the grip depends on your sense of balance and how long your thumb is. If you're thumb's already up against the bell (like mine), cutting the neck may be a mistake.

Unless you're trying to be a serious competitor at the NAC level, it probably won't make enough difference to be worth the frustration. If you do cut the necks on your grips down, be sure that you have enough thread on the tang to get the grip back on securely. Also, if the cut isn't smooth, the grip may come loose easily.

If you've got a weapon together and it's working properly, think twice before you pull it apart to "make it better." If you've got to re-wire anyway, then go ahead and experiment.

[peircer]

I cut the rear extension off on my foils and epees as soon as I put them together. I'm so used to it, I can't stand not having them cut down. It does take some trial and error to get the cut right though.

[Purple Fencer]

Derek Cotton is a big proponent of grip cutting. When he showed me how to cut mine, I found I developed a good more point control and atrted missing the lame by a quarter inch less and less. The trick was to cut the correct amount...the first time, I cut too much and my hand was crammed into too small a space.

All the grips I've cut have been aluminum, and a hacksaw goes right thorugh them. Stryder mentioned cuttung at an angle, and he is correct. Get a metal file to take care of the rough edges after cutting it down.

DON'T forget to cut the notch for the wire, though!