Leon Paul FIE Epee Blades

[achilleus]

As a dedicated lover of BF blades, who just can't afford $100+ per blade that may last as short as a month, I'm trying lower cost alternatives.

LP has received many glowing reviews from some of the posters here, specifically touting their durability and lightweight, 2 things I love in a blade.

I'm curious, however, about the overall feel of the blade. The BF's have the right feel in my opinion. Weight towards the forte, with a nice stiffness for point control.

So, how do the LP's feel? I tried them a while back and remember them being...floppy.

[D+F+P=Hadouken!]

Originally Posted by achilleus

As a dedicated lover of BF blades, who just can't afford $100+ per blade that may last as short as a month, I'm trying lower cost alternatives.

LP has received many glowing reviews from some of the posters here, specifically touting their durability and lightweight, 2 things I love in a blade.

I'm curious, however, about the overall feel of the blade. The BF's have the right feel in my opinion. Weight towards the forte, with a nice stiffness for point control.

So, how do the LP's feel? I tried them a while back and remember them being...floppy.

They are rather floppy, and the point control is a little odd. It takes a little practice to get used to them, but once you learn to control the floppiness, you can do some very sick stuff, like wrist flicks from prime, or flicks to the back of the neck from infighting. But they dont parry or beat very well, so you may be better off with a vniti.

[achilleus]

Originally Posted by D+F+P=Hadouken!

They are rather floppy, and the point control is a little odd. It takes a little practice to get used to them, but once you learn to control the floppiness, you can do some very sick stuff, like wrist flicks from prime, or flicks to the back of the neck from infighting. But they dont parry or beat very well, so you may be better off with a vniti.

That's what I remember...

(Although, I can hit flicks to the wrist and back with a BF, so...)

I liked the durability of the vniti's, except for the weight. I didn't like the weight. I had some great success with 'em, but I prefer lightwieght weapons. It really helps refine point work, and saves on the tendonitis...

Any other feedback?

[Gav]

I use LP FIE blades.

Depends on the blade that you buy. They come in differing stiffness levels. I for one use a medium flickiness and roate them as they become floppy. Sometimes they seem to soften up quite a lot.

I would always recommend try before you but so that you can pick out your preferred choice, They are my preferred blades though. They last longer than BF's and don't seem to get as rusty,

[elberto]

my first look at the v form blade and i had an image in my mind of the thing breaking and that thin blade just skewering my opponent...

That sort of put me of.. but I did use a few and they have been great - longer lasting, not as heavy, more consistent, easier to rewire and when they break they either just split or break with no sharp bits (even the non FIE!).

Actually made me enjoy fencing epee more (as if that woudl be possible!!) and made my opponents look at me strangely (well.. more strangely than they usually do!!) as I was probably the first in adelade to use one (a few years ago..!).

There are quite a few used out there now but the majority of companies are still using the traditional form of the blade.

But I would recommend (what status have I got in the world of fencing?!) using them - they do take some getting used to and as I said they last longer and I was not kind to my epees (they took some evil bends and either snapped back or were able to be "unkinked" although the permanent downward bend I managed to make be less than the FIE's 1cm requirement!)

[CvilleFencer]

I went from BF FIE blues to the LP blades because I almost burst into tears every time I snapped one, which was way to often for my budget. The LP blades have a very different feel than the BF and to be honest the first time I got one I said something to the effect of "That is just wrong, and it looks like it will snap the first time I hit someone with it" so it lived in my bag until I snapped a couple of blades and it was the only one left.

A tourney is not the best place to learn to use a new and different weapon but by the end of the day I was really surprised by its durability and was getting used to the feel. I used it a practice a couple more times and I got more and more used to the feel and I guess I adapted my fencing just a bit. I now find myself occasionally able to get some really amazing (to me anyway, for my skill level) hits with them such as a pretty little wrist flick off of a counter disengage and "underhanded" as in the blade bends the wrong way for a minute, shots to the underside of the hand/forearm.

It is a bit of a tradeoff, and in all honesty if I had unlimited funds I think I would prefer the BF FIE blues (by just a smidgen) just because they feel so right, but for the money, the durability, the light weight and the overall quality of the LPs I think they are the best thing going in epee blades under a $100 dollars that I have ever used.

Moral of the story is that it will take a week or two of practice to get the feel of the blade and understand what it likes to do but everyone I know that has given them an honest chance has switched over unless they have money to burn.

Another blade that has impressed me recently, although I have yet to fence with it, is the new PS Forge FIE blades from Prieur. Apparently they have their own forge now, or are running a new line of machines out of their FL shop but the have a wonderful feel to them which reminds me a great deal of a very light BF FIE blue blade. They are pretty cheap also, around $80 or so wired IIRC. Blue Gauntlet and The Fencing Post had some at the last NAC but several of the ones I saw had obvious defects in the blade (Wavy steel, deformed groves, not completely straight) so my initial impression is maybe pretty cool, but I think I will let them work the bug out before I drop almost a Franklin on a blade when I am very happy with my $50 LP's. If you go with that option I highly suggest you wait until the KC NAC and take a close hard look at them yourself and not go through mail order, but you new that already I am sure!

Best of luck and I hope all that helped. If you do switch please let us know what you think of it.

[Alex_Paul]

The press in which they were formed had been wearing some months ago so the blades had been gradually getting more flexible but thehis has been fixed now so they have stiffened up.

We are the only manufacturer in the world who actually measures the flexibility of each blade and we etch it on the forte. This measurment is defined as the deflection caused by a 200g weight hung from a blade clamped 70cm from the tip. Legaly they can be anywhere between 45mm and 70 mm deflection but most of ours fall between 45 and 58. If you want a stiff blade (which will feel more like a BF) then you can specify a stiffness or range of stiffnesses when you buy so that you can buy on line with more confidence. If you ask for a 45 though you may have a bit of a wait as we don't necessarily have all of them in at all times so you would be better to specify a range of say 45-49.

They are lighter than other blades and they really do last longer but as Cville says they do feel different.
A sponsored coach actually bought one of the origionals in for a re wire Tuesday, it was hand formed in 3 seperate presses and had a different cross section and tang to the modern ones. He has been using it regurlaly since he got it which must make it more than 10 years old! I offered to buy it back as a piece of LP history but he wouldnt sell at any sensible price!

[CvilleFencer]

Hey Alex, a fencer at our club has a blade that confounds me as it looks for all the world like a shiny LP non-FIE but here is the thing... It is Allstar and I think it is an FIE blade! It has a good feel and he fenced a many years ago (not sure how long), took several years off and is now getting back into the sport.

For my fencing trivia collection, did LP ever supply Uhlmann/Allstar with blades or were they just making a look alike of yours for a while? If so when and why did they stop? Thanks in advance for the info Alex/Barry!

[JEC]

Alex,
If you are interested in something that is LP history, email me, I can send you pictures of a wired epee (wire is broken) that I bought from the estate of a person who fenced until the 50's. The guard has a Leon Paul inscription, the blade is fairly stiff and has a horseshoe emblem on the top. The point has screws on the side but they have no travel; the tip does inside the barrel. It is missing one screw, and the wire is broken at the place it crosses the guard. The grip is french and the blade has no threading as a piece snaps between the grip and pommel, and the pommel screws into it. When I bought it, I fence with it in 2001 and it was working. Unfortunately, later, the wire broke (or was broken).
JEC

[telkanuru]

The Boston Fencing club has a very old LP box. Looks like epee only I think, and like it was made between 1930 and 1950...

[Barry Paul]

We did supply allstar lots of non F.I.E. blades some years ago. Not sure about F.I.E. Blades the should have our mark on them if they are ours and F.I.E.

On the epee the broken bits is a brass insert which we still use on the French blades. If you can send a picture of the epee to barry@leonpaul.com or post it on the site for the Net members to see.

Picture of the old epee box would be good it was probably one of the first we made and will be slightly younger than the first boxes made in Italy or France.

[Mike O]

I have to (humbly) disagree with the comment above that LP Epee blades aren't good for beats & parries. While their design lends itself to varying degrees of flexibility in flick like actions, there is VERY little flex in the blade on the horizontal axis (even in the foible of the blade), making them very responsive in parries and especially beats. I fence absence of blade a lot, with occasional strategic beats and prefer them because they are very light and responsive. That said, I generally seek out LP blades toward the stiff end of the spectrum.

[Barry Paul]

Mike I think you are correct it is not any thing I have given any thought too, in fact I remember reading a post from an epeeiest who complained he could not flick side ways with the Leon Paul blade because they were too stiff in this direction. So that should make them better for parrying in this direction.