Fencing.Net - Your Guide to Fencing & Fencing Equipment

aisha · 12-14-2004, 12:05 AM

Hello everyone,

I am posting part of an earlier message I put elsewhere, after it was recommended that it really belonged here. So here it is,(despite my trying to get a handle on this on my own)...after asking one dealer about his lames his reply was:

"competition quality meets all requirements for USFA competition /stainless steel Lame material, model "INOX",--The electrical resistant between any two points of our Lame material not greater then 4 Ohms, for USFA test "not be more then 5ohms". So we have 1 ohms reserved for future use of the vest and its qualification for competition".-I don't know what that means. Is this good? and what is "INOX" anyway? A brand? a type? His lames are 50$ and yet I see others described as good that are 100$. Thanks for your help!!!

So, could someone help answer my questions above? Thanks so much!

Best,

Aisha

CvilleFencer · 12-14-2004, 12:49 AM

Okay, here is the deal. At big comps such as a NAC your equipment gets tested. What gets tested depends a bit on what you fence but if your weapon uses any kind of lame material it will be checked as will your mask and cords.

When the Armorer tests your lame he is checking for damage and resistance to conductivity. If the resistance is above 5 ohms it is time to by a new lame. Some types of lames run higher than others. A good Uhlmann or LP lame out of the bag will usually run about 0.6-1.0 ohms (although this is by no means a hard and fast rule). Inox is a type of steel that used to be a great indication of quality and durability but with so many Chinese and former USSR countries cranking out lower quality "Inox" vests with lower thread counts and inferior materials the only way to really be sure your lame is worth the effort is to by from a reputable vendor.

Cheaper lames often are made with inferior steel thread, although it may still be stainless, have fewer metallic threads per inch, be made of cheaper material or have a lower nickel content so the lose their conductivity much more quickly that a quality lame.

If you are looking for cheap, I really recommend the Fencing Post JL/Shanghai Sports lames. They last a fair amount of time (average 6 months or more) and are fairly cheap (about $60). Blue Gauntlet also makes a cheap lame for about 65 but they use copper wire instead of stainless and in my experience are not as durable and long lasting, but even if they were they would still develop green spots and leave their wearers smelling like a sweaty penny. Blade also makes a decent budget lame but if you get one of the tie dye ones be prepared for a swift kick in the *** from every fencer that is not completely bereft of taste.

If you are willing to shell out some real money on a lame that will last a good long while (average 1-2 years) get a Leon Paul, Uhlmann/Allstar (they are the same company), PBT, Priuer, Santelli (if you can find them), Cartel, Negrinni, or god help me, a Triplette lame. Just be aware the Triplette lame may eat/shred your jacket, hang like a garbage bag and shock you on occasion but it will last a good long time. There are folks who think that Triplette kit descended from heaven and offers a tailored fit but they tend be clustered below the Mason/Dixon line and have not seen their shoes without bending over in years.

I on the other hand happened to know for a fact that the only truly divinely endorsed equipment is made by Leon Paul (that’s right, God is a fencer, he fences epee, wears a Sydney Jacket and loves the Comfort Plus mask. He does however wish that LP would make a copy of the Zivkovic BIII grips and offer their unis in larger sizes).

Seriously Triplette seems to be getting better (I met the new owners this weekend) and seem committed to fixing some of the past problems. They are also offering some gorgeous colors for their Super Duty lames. If you buy a lame on ebay from some Russian or Chinese guy that assures you it is as good as the Uhlmann lames but only $15 your next purchase should probably be lots of Vaseline. You will most likely need it.

aisha · 12-14-2004, 10:06 AM

Thank you for your help!

Best,

Aisha

esgrimista1 · 12-14-2004, 01:26 PM

The Santelli lame is the only lame I have found that does not turn green and get dead spots in tropical climates. With them out of biz or missing, those of us in trop. climates need to find out where they got their fabric, or get another manufacturer to make the jacket using the same fabric. Anyone have any suggestions?

esskreemr · 12-14-2004, 02:24 PM

I second Cville's very complete post.

If you plan on fencing electric alot and you sweat considerably, a good quality lame will cost more money up front but will save you money in the long run.

I bought an Uhllman lame and am very pleased with it's ability to stand up against my sweat's ability to turn anything green!

neevel · 12-14-2004, 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by esgrimista1

The Santelli lame is the only lame I have found that does not turn green and get dead spots in tropical climates. With them out of biz or missing, those of us in trop. climates need to find out where they got their fabric, or get another manufacturer to make the jacket using the same fabric. Anyone have any suggestions?

Santelli used the same lame fabric that Uhlmann and Allstar use for their lames.

-Dave

darius · 12-14-2004, 03:07 PM

Quote:

Santelli used the same lame fabric that Uhlmann and Allstar use for their lames.

Yeah, but I think it might be attributable to the liner, which is this heavy scotchgard-esque material, which wicks sweat .... back into your jacket. I've got a Santelli lame and an Uhlmann one, and they're definitely the same material, but the Uhlmann one is much lighter and breathes much better.

It also seems to get dirty more quickly.

darius

neevel · 12-14-2004, 03:15 PM

Yep, Santelli used a much heavier backing fabric-- good if you wanted a little padding to take the sting out of hard hits, bad if you didn't want to be wearing a personal sweatbox.

foilz · 12-15-2004, 01:36 AM

[quote=CvilleFencer]There are folks who think that Triplette kit descended from heaven and offers a tailored fit but they tend be clustered below the Mason/Dixon line and have not seen their shoes without bending over in years.QUOTE]

I just read your post, received this day. As someone who has not seen his shoes (Adidas) in years, I heartily object to your observation, among others, presented comprehensively, if not with brevity, on this page. And I had thought that Virginians stood steadfastly with Georgia. As it happens, I have family in Charlottesville! I may ask them to come a-callin, just as soon as they finish huntin' black bears in the near-burbs of C'ville, pick their teeth, and high-tail it down the road from Ivy. I'm sure they'd love to see you. Besides, those of us in the Deep South never heard of Triplette. We do business with fine, long-standing firms in London, Paris and New York, and do what we can to get their goods around the blockade.

sabersaber · 12-15-2004, 01:22 PM

THANKS for the help. Will get our next jackets from Allstar/Uhlmann - what a relief! We have tried the BG jackets, PBT and a couple of other, all have died extremely quickly even with washing and great care. Only the Santelli's have held up so will now invest in the Uhlmann's.

CvilleFencer · 12-15-2004, 03:31 PM

Quote:

I just read your post, received this day. As someone who has not seen his shoes (Adidas) in years, I heartily object to your observation, among others, presented comprehensively, if not with brevity, on this page. And I had thought that Virginians stood steadfastly with Georgia. As it happens, I have family in Charlottesville! I may ask them to come a-callin, just as soon as they finish huntin' black bears in the near-burbs of C'ville, pick their teeth, and high-tail it down the road from Ivy. I'm sure they'd love to see you. Besides, those of us in the Deep South never heard of Triplette. We do business with fine, long-standing firms in London, Paris and New York, and do what we can to get their goods around the blockade.

Have them swing by the CFA club on Sundays. I am not hard to find (biggest guy in the room) and love to meet new people! Do they fence by any chance (and I am not talking about either chain link or chicken wire)?

foilz · 12-15-2004, 09:33 PM

Cville, no fencers up there, sorry. But we are overdue for a trip to Albermarle, and I will bring my gear. Cheers!

CvilleFencer · 12-16-2004, 01:06 AM

That would be very cool. I will even break out my foil gear! :-) We have another fencer, and epeeist, that is also a big sport and competition shooter and a fox hunter (barbaric and vile practice that it is) so he may be able to hook you up with some other fun things for you to do on a vacation in lovely Albermarle!

oso97 · 12-16-2004, 01:37 AM

Try the Estoc lames. High nickel content, and wear like iron. And believe me, if Texas in the summer doesn't qualify as a tropical climate, I don't know what does. I've got one that I use in club that is used twice a week, regularly, by some fencers who know how to sweat, and its going on three years old. Still passes regularly at competitions.

Zelda · 12-16-2004, 08:55 AM

I swear by Leon Paul Lames - in 6 years of fencing I am only on my 2nd one, and the first one is still working, I just got one for comps only. They are light, and fairly easy to clean - (shower after comp and hang in hotel bathroom to dry overnight).

remise · 12-16-2004, 11:37 AM

Several lames at the NAC's failed that fencer's said were "new". They just weren't tested yet.

trragan · 12-19-2004, 11:17 PM

[quote=CvilleFencer]There are folks who think that Triplette kit descended from heaven and offers a tailored fit but they tend be clustered below the Mason/Dixon line and have not seen their shoes without bending over in years. [quote]

Pardon me, but you live below the Mason/Dixon line.

whtouche · 12-20-2004, 12:54 AM

Ok, so we've established that santelli lames use the same material as uhlmann and allstar, so I think an interesting question to answer would be how many types of lame material are out there and what lames use which?
The type leon paul uses looks alot like the type that pbt uses too, but Im not positive.
Any others?

CvilleFencer · 12-20-2004, 01:29 AM

Quote:

Pardon me, but you live below the Mason/Dixon line.

You have a firm grasp of the geographically obvious. Like it or not I am currently below the Mason Dixon line, henceforth my familiarity with the aforementioned situation. What, big easy folks can't appreciate a joke unless it involves mudbugs?

As an aside I finally got a look at the TCA FIE kit, specifically their FIE Unitard, today. Fortunately there is only one FIE unitard in the US at the moment according to its owner other than the original that was cut for Walter. The material is identical in weave, feel, etc to the Duelist kit (their masks also seem to be the same as Triplette!), which was a bit of a surprise to me!

trragan · 12-20-2004, 01:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CvilleFencer

You have a firm grasp of the geographically obvious. Like it or not I am currently below the Mason Dixon line, henceforth my familiarity with the aforementioned situation. What, big easy folks can't appreciate a joke unless it involves mudbugs?

As an aside I finally got a look at the TCA FIE kit, specifically their FIE Unitard, today. Fortunately there is only one FIE unitard in the US at the moment according to its owner other than the original that was cut for Walter. The material is identical in weave, feel, etc to the Duelist kit (their masks also seem to be the same as Triplette!), which was a bit of a surprise to me!

I had to give someone a hard time, and you were here.

We in New Orleans can take jokes about anything. Heck, it's New Orleans, we have to put up with tourists all year. Thus, a good sense of humor is a requirement. Just kidding, we love tourists. Anyway, I king of agree with you about Triplette. I dont know about their lame's but if they are like any of their clothes I don't want one. I do have a Triplette mask that is manufactured by Garjardoni, which I guess is what you're saying from where Duellist also purchases.

Merry Christmas.