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View Poll Results: Minimum sportsmanlike behavior? | |
Smiling at your opponent.
|     | 9 | 8.18% | |
Admitting when your opponent's touch is good (or yours misses).
|    | 44 | 40.00% | |
Offering to loan equipment when his breaks.
|    | 10 | 9.09% | |
Giving your opponent's Significant Other a ride home and massage while he finishes the competition.
|    | 11 | 10.00% | |
Setting up a scholarship account for your opponent's children.
|    | 1 | 0.91% | |
Beating the snot out of the referee for not deciding in your opponent's favor.
|    | 10 | 9.09% | |
I disagree with the premise of this poll.
| | 25 | 22.73% | 
08-26-2004, 05:15 PM
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#1 | | Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 1,021
| Sportsmanlike behavior (a poll)
Obviously, there are some major discrepancies in what constitutes "sportsmanlike" behavior. I think we can clear this up with a very precisely worded, unbiased poll.
What is the minimum range of "sportsmanlike" behavior that you feel a fencer should follow? | 
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08-26-2004, 05:59 PM
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#2 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: St Kilda, Melbourne, Victoria, Australia
Posts: 605
| Who reads the post's title anyway? You do.
Well I voted for saying "yeah I was hit" but I think it changes. If your opponent starts swearing when they make a mistake and they show little or no sportsman like qualities then don't acknowledge the hit - they don't deserve it.
Up against begginers and people who are sportsman like then you really should say if your hit. Even if it's a one or two hit affair - although that's not likely.
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08-26-2004, 06:39 PM
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#3 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Savannah, Ga
Posts: 6,024
| If someone asks if they can borrow equipment I will probably loan it to them if I can spare it. However, my actually offering equipment is very much dependent on: my mood, the state of my equipment, the person in need of said equipment.
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08-27-2004, 12:12 PM
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#4 | | Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 1,021
| Polls like this raise other questions as well: Do the many touches fencers experience in their athletic activities lead them to become "touchy" about their sport in general? Do repetitive impacts from opponents' weapons drive a sense of humor out of fencers? Are fencers more likely to imagine attacks and counterattacks in other areas of their lives as well? | |
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08-27-2004, 10:58 PM
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#5 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Western PA
Posts: 399
| You should respect your opponent to the largest possible extent because they are giving up their time to fence you. I do everything possible to respect them on the strip and off - My opponents make me a better fencer and I could not owe them more. | |
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08-27-2004, 11:08 PM
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#6 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Western PA
Posts: 399
| Bleh, got cut short. I voted for the arguing with the referee in favor of your opponent as I have done this and seen it done (Story Mode):
As a first year sabreur, I was attending a classical (Pre electric) sabre meet. Now one would think that this would be complete chaos, which it well would have been, except for the fact that the participants and the referee often got into arguments. The participant would acknowledge a touch if one was recieved, with little exception, but as soon as the ref called halt the corner judges would signal their opinion, hence there were times where my opponent was asking the referee to give the touch to me, and on other touches I was asking the same for him. (Dry CAN be fun if you have honest opponents) | |
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08-28-2004, 01:59 AM
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#7 | | Just Joined
Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: California
Posts: 23
| Sorry, don't really understand what you are saying. | |
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08-28-2004, 09:41 AM
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#8 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: New Jersey
Posts: 4,971
| Quote: |
Originally Posted by S. Hunter Bleh, got cut short. I voted for the arguing with the referee in favor of your opponent as I have done this and seen it done (Story Mode):
As a first year sabreur, I was attending a classical (Pre electric) sabre meet. Now one would think that this would be complete chaos, which it well would have been, except for the fact that the participants and the referee often got into arguments. The participant would acknowledge a touch if one was recieved, with little exception, but as soon as the ref called halt the corner judges would signal their opinion, hence there were times where my opponent was asking the referee to give the touch to me, and on other touches I was asking the same for him. (Dry CAN be fun if you have honest opponents) | This illustrates why fencers should by and large stick to their job (fencing) and let the referees (and if dry competition, the side judges) do their job (officiating). It may be courtesy to acknowledge a touch (it can also be ostentatious showing off), but it can also be inaccurate.
Take a sequence like: attack from left, stop cut and parry-riposte from right, remise from left. Several possible hits from each side - when the fencer holds up his hand to acknowledge a hit, which of those actions is he acknowledging? Does he really have a better view than the officials? Should he really be preempting the decision of the referee?
Dry CAN be fun if you let the officials do their jobs. If you want to acknowledge a touch, it can be gracious to do so at the right moment: when the ref polls the judges watching you, and they both shrug and say 'abstain' but you know you've been hit - then acknowledge the hit. Otherwise, let them do what they're supposed to do
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08-28-2004, 06:07 PM
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#9 | | Fencing Expert
Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: greece
Posts: 3,362
| Quote: |
Originally Posted by Victor Polls like this raise other questions as well: Do the many touches fencers experience in their athletic activities lead them to become "touchy" about their sport in general? Do repetitive impacts from opponents' weapons drive a sense of humor out of fencers? Are fencers more likely to imagine attacks and counterattacks in other areas of their lives as well? | Upon reading the answers to this thread, I think the answers to the first 2 are obvious.
And for those who get all uppity about a salute at the end of the bout, how many remember when the rule just called for a handshake? The ending salute was instituted for audiences. I still remember how all the competitors thought it was the lamest thing. The reason why they were giving out black cards for no salute was because the competitors just would shake hands and walk off.
It's funny how so many people are attached to it yet this sacred tradition only started in the mid 90's....
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08-29-2004, 02:27 AM
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#10 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 364
| Ahaha. Please tell me I'm not the only one that gets this. | |
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08-29-2004, 12:10 PM
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#11 | | Fencing Expert
Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: greece
Posts: 3,362
| Quote: |
Originally Posted by ViewtifulMisho Ahaha. Please tell me I'm not the only one that gets this. | Judging by the responses, and Victor's follow up that was virtually ignored...
I'd say that Victor, you, and I seem to be they only ones...
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We're no threat, people, we're not dirty, we're not mean
We love everybody but we do as we please
When the weather's fine,
We go fishin' or go swimmin' in the sea
We're always happy
Life's for livin', yeah, that's our philosophy
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08-29-2004, 03:56 PM
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#12 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Ithaca, NY
Posts: 1,011
| These are parody threads. Go back to FYAD.  
Also, that's rather neat to discover that saluting only came about in the mid-90s. Ha ha.
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The solution to your problem is to fence another weapon.
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08-30-2004, 07:20 AM
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#13 | | Curmudgeon-in-Chief
Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Somewhere in your nightmares!
Posts: 22,924
| The rule may have debuted in the 90's---I don't recall. The practice, however, did not. It used to be customary to salute both before and after the bout, as well as at la belle. ( I started fencing in, well, never mind, but before the 90's.  ) | |
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08-30-2004, 01:22 PM
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#14 | | Fencing Expert
Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: greece
Posts: 3,362
| Quote: |
Originally Posted by Inquartata The rule may have debuted in the 90's---I don't recall. The practice, however, did not. It used to be customary to salute both before and after the bout, as well as at la belle. ( I started fencing in, well, never mind, but before the 90's. ) | We seem to be fencing very different people... 
I also fenced before the 90's, and I can not recall anyone saluting at the end of the bout. A handshake was sufficient for all.
I remember that everyone started practicing saluting afterward to make it become habit. So many people nearly had accidents, in the club, as fencers realized they were too close after the action. They could no longer score, and take the mask off immediately since they might be hit in the face by an errant salute.
It was the first change, that I can recall, that the FIE did for audiences. Audiences expect fencers to salute, and who are we to disappoint?
__________________
We're no threat, people, we're not dirty, we're not mean
We love everybody but we do as we please
When the weather's fine,
We go fishin' or go swimmin' in the sea
We're always happy
Life's for livin', yeah, that's our philosophy
Last edited by achilleus; 08-30-2004 at 02:36 PM.
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09-07-2004, 04:06 PM
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#15 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Fresno, California
Posts: 2,092
| Hi all! I've been on hiatus for a few months because my stupid computer screwed up and wouldn't let me type, only read. Anyways, I think the basics of manners is enough. I give a polite salute, not the 3 point, just an extension and a nod, to the opponent, ref, and spectators. I give a little salute to everyone at the end, and shake my opponents hand. When fencing "dry" I admit when I'm touched, and if my opponent thinks I'm being untruthful when I said I was not hit, I simply say give him the point. basic politeness is usually enough.
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09-08-2004, 12:56 PM
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#16 | | Senior Member
Join Date: May 2003 Location: Londinium
Posts: 439
| Quote: |
Originally Posted by achilleus I also fenced before the 90's, and I can not recall anyone saluting at the end of the bout. A handshake was sufficient for all. | That's what I remember too. Just the salute at the beginning and the handshake at the end. We would also salute at La Belle tho.
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11-14-2005, 07:55 PM
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#17 | | Epee fencing addict
Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Glenwood, ny
Posts: 2,168
| I voted for: Giving your opponent's Significant Other a ride home and massage while he finishes the competition.
because that's just the caring, sensitive, unselfish kind of guy I am. Just a small sacrifice so my fellow fencer can fence a little longer.
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I ain't as good as I once was, but I'm as good once as I ever was. - Toby Keith
"We have met the enemy and he is us." - Pogo | |
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11-14-2005, 09:40 PM
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#18 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 5,483
| As much respect as they deserve..... I will not respect a loser... or a jerk, for that matter. Salute and shake hands is about it.
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"I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. And from this side only! The flight of a half-man, half-bird. Dinosaurs nuzzling their young in pastures where strip malls should be. Cookies on dowels. All those moment, lost in time. Gone, like eggs off a hooker's stomach. Time to die" -Phil Ken Sebben
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11-14-2005, 09:42 PM
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#19 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Boston, MA
Posts: 4,326
| Ack! Undead thread! | |
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11-14-2005, 11:09 PM
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#20 | | Senior Member
Join Date: May 2003 Location: Arlington, VA
Posts: 4,127
| Quote: |
Originally Posted by parrythis I voted for: Giving your opponent's Significant Other a ride home and massage while he finishes the competition.
because that's just the caring, sensitive, unselfish kind of guy I am. Just a small sacrifice so my fellow fencer can fence a little longer. | what about giving your significant other a ride home and a massage?
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