$50/yr for USFA membership

[FoilyGeezer]

We're currently paying over $50 a kid for an eight week Park & Rec Soccer program. $50 is a pretty good deal.

I can't speak for other areas, but in CT, there is ample opportunity for the casual fencer to enter non-USFA sanctioned club and even a few divisional events that don't require joining the USFA. In comparison with what the average fencer spends gearing up for you're average competition, I think the USFA membership is a fairly trivial expense.

[qatet]

Originally Posted by mfp

A couple more:

USA Shooting
Adult: $35
Junior: $20
http://www.usashooting.com/membersapp.html


US Canoe and Kayak
Adult: $55 (up from $40)
Junior :$25 (unchanged)
Family :$110 (up from $95)
http://www.usacanoekayak.org/articles/newfees.asp

And I could be utterly wrong, but it seems that there might be certain, uhh, manufacturers would would happily underwrite the shooting to keep the membership prices low, despite the fact that it's another weapon sport.

[fencergal33]

I think it all depends on several things...

What area you fence in, and how well is fencing supported there. Is it an affluent are? Are there hundreds or even thousands of fencers within a 2 hour drive? Are there a lot of local and National level tourneys held there?

Here's the thing....I have a crap job. I have to work many hours to earn that, and it could pay something like say, the phone bill. What does my $50 a year entitle me to. A crappy little piece of cardboard, and a magazine a few times a year. If I want to compete, I have to drive at least 4 hours in most cases. When I get there, I then have to pay an entry fee, hotel, gas, food, etc. It's not about the $50 to me, it's about the $50 on top of everything else. The $50 doesn't even entitle me to a discounted entry fee at ANY tournaments (local or otherwise). So where's the incentive to drive membership?

[qatet]

Originally Posted by sabreur

I hate to say it, but $50 is pretty trivial, and I imagine a good chunk of it goes for insurance.

The USA Swimming fee is the same amount, and I was amazed by the amount of insurance and safety information on their site--I mean, what the hell can happen at a swim meet? Someone falls from running on the deck? There are no pointy objects, no one whacking each other, nobody is going to drown (these are people who spend hours a day in the pool...).

Weird.

MR

Does US Swimming include diving? If so, that would be the insurance.

There are some really beautiful facts that I used to know as a lifeguard about what you could expect to pull out of the water in diving accidents - basically 18-25 year old males. (enough mass to really make the dive and hit the bottom, enough stupidity to, well, really make the dive and hit the bottom)

Maybe every association should just double its fees for 18-25 year-old males.

[oiuyt]

Originally Posted by Inquartata

I wonder if that isn't at least partially the idea. The USFA is concerned about the ever-increasing numbers at tournaments overwhelming their administrative resources and making for long delays, etc. The best mechanism for reducing demand is to raise the price...

At MOST the USFA is interested in keeping national tournament numbers manageable. The USFA VERY much wants to increase membership.

For what it's worth, the insurance costs to the USFA are a very small portion of the membership fees. Mostly what you're buying with your membership is general administration of the national office, membership services (insurance is one of these, as are things such as the development grants that are made to clubs, the rebates to divisions/sections, credit card processing fees, etc.), marketing (which primarily consists of American Fencing and the National Newsletter and media relations administration), and volunteer administration (all the various committees, small discretionary funds (order of $500) for the various officers, etc.). The costs of the programs listed here are more than the USFA brings in in membership dues.

While insurance might be one of the largest benefits offered as part of USFA membership, it's a relatively low-cost benefit. American Fencing costs more than your insurance does (true even after counting the off-setting advertising revenue generated). Running the organization at all chews up most of the membership dues.

-B :)

[oiuyt]

Originally Posted by fencergal33

The $50 doesn't even entitle me to a discounted entry fee at ANY tournaments (local or otherwise). So where's the incentive to drive membership?

*TOURNAMENT ANNOUNCEMENT*

I'd like to announce the 1st Annual "Brad's giving a break to USFA members" Open. To be held in my backyard this Sunday. Open to everyone, all three weapons will be contested in this quaint, outdoor, traditional New England farmtown location. Non-usfa event, so don't expect any ratings changes. In fact we aren't even giving out any prizes. Self-refereed and I don't guarantee that the organizer will even be present. All weapons to be contested dry. Entry fee $250/weapon. USFA members (cards will be checked at registration) can enter for a discounted rate of only $100/weapon. SAVE UP TO $450!!!! USFA membership can be purchased at the event. Pre-reg discount, any entries received more than 27 minutes before the start of fencing will be entitled to a $18/weapon discount (to qualify all fees must be paid at time of pre-registration). All events will be contested simultaneously beginning at 10am. Tournament will be held rain or shine, regardless of number of entries. Tournament results may or may not be made public after the event in one or more of here on fencing.net, posted on a sign in my front yard, or submitted for publication in American Fencing and Escrime magazines. Contact me via PM if you're interested in competing.

Better? :)

[fencergal33]

Not what I meant and you know it.

[JEC]

Brad, you forgot to add the cash discount vs credit card .

[DJ Apostrophe]

geez brad... with that kind of tournament i don't know if it would fit in your backyard... (chuckle)

-w

[FoilyGeezer]

Originally Posted by fencergal33

Here's the thing....I have a crap job. I have to work many hours to earn that, and it could pay something like say, the phone bill. What does my $50 a year entitle me to. A crappy little piece of cardboard, and a magazine a few times a year. If I want to compete, I have to drive at least 4 hours in most cases. When I get there, I then have to pay an entry fee, hotel, gas, food, etc. It's not about the $50 to me, it's about the $50 on top of everything else. The $50 doesn't even entitle me to a discounted entry fee at ANY tournaments (local or otherwise). So where's the incentive to drive membership?

What it won't give you is a better job, lower phone bills, or closer tournaments. It won't help you place better in the competitions, or give you a break on gas, hotel, food, etc.

I think what Brad was allegorically trying to get at is that it isn't $50 on top of everything else, it is $50 that leads to everything else. As an association I think the USFA is geared pretty well toward giving people a pretty frequent opportunity to compete, and a pretty consistent format for doing so. And that's only getting better. I've been in associations where the membership fee was literally just the tip of the iceberg (price out what joining a decent country club runs, plus private golf lessons and greens fees for a round or two of golf a week, and that's just recreational, not competitive and fencing starts to look pretty darned cheap).

As much as we gripe about how the events are run, they are pretty much a known quantity for the people who enter them. MOSTLY everyone knows what to expect, and believe me, that ain't the case in all sports.

I work three crappy jobs, have two kids in the sport, and have to maintain their equipment, provide for their lessons, and cart them back and forth with me. We do this instead of having cell phones, and cable TV. I think its a bargain, myself.

[oiuyt]

Originally Posted by DJ Apostrophe

geez brad... with that kind of tournament i don't know if it would fit in your backyard... (chuckle)

-w

S'okay, we can run multiple flights. Oh, no lighting for bouts starting after dusk, forgot to mention that. There's a Wal-Mart not too far away, they might carry glow-sticks that we can attach to the weapons....

JEC- Cash only. Checks or "in-kind" donations might be accepted pending individual negotiation. Perhaps I'll take PayPal for pre-registrations.

Whether or not there's going to be a 2nd Annual "Brad's giving a break to USFA members" Open depends on people like YOU! Come out and support this brand new event. All proceeds will be used to help fund Brad's living/fencing (is there actually a distinction to be made here?) expenses. Not to mention by helping build this into the premiere event in the country, you'll be helping to (indirectly) support the USFA (afterall with a huge cost savings such as the potential $450/person EVERYONE will want to join the USFA!). Heck, why not. I hereby agree to donate 20% of all profits from this tournament to the USFA. If we make this event large enough the USFA will be able to fully fund all activities from it and will never again need to increase membership dues. Not to mention I'll be rich. And the tournament will take about a year to run. As implied by DJA my yard is not particularly large. In fact it could reasonable be described as particularly small.

Okay, enough of that (some might say too much of that) (but I'm not one of them) (I like parenthetical remarks (just in case that wasn't previously clear)).

-B :)
*who appears to be in a somewhat more whimsical than usual mood today*

[prototoast]

Originally Posted by oiuyt

*TOURNAMENT ANNOUNCEMENT*

I'd like to announce the 1st Annual "Brad's giving a break to USFA members" Open. To be held in my backyard this Sunday. Open to everyone, all three weapons will be contested in this quaint, outdoor, traditional New England farmtown location. Non-usfa event, so don't expect any ratings changes. In fact we aren't even giving out any prizes. Self-refereed and I don't guarantee that the organizer will even be present. All weapons to be contested dry. Entry fee $250/weapon. USFA members (cards will be checked at registration) can enter for a discounted rate of only $100/weapon. SAVE UP TO $450!!!! USFA membership can be purchased at the event. Pre-reg discount, any entries received more than 27 minutes before the start of fencing will be entitled to a $18/weapon discount (to qualify all fees must be paid at time of pre-registration). All events will be contested simultaneously beginning at 10am. Tournament will be held rain or shine, regardless of number of entries. Tournament results may or may not be made public after the event in one or more of here on fencing.net, posted on a sign in my front yard, or submitted for publication in American Fencing and Escrime magazines. Contact me via PM if you're interested in competing.

Better?

Okay, I have $100 in my wallet, and I think I can bike to your place in under 30 minutes... so I'd better not be the only one showing up.

[Army Fencer]

Originally Posted by oiuyt

Whether or not there's going to be a 2nd Annual "Brad's giving a break to USFA members" Open depends on people like YOU!

Are you going to have a backyard next year?

[Scott Allen Abf]

Originally Posted by Inquartata

I wonder if that isn't at least partially the idea. The USFA is concerned about the ever-increasing numbers at tournaments overwhelming their administrative resources and making for long delays, etc. The best mechanism for reducing demand is to raise the price...

If they really wanted to discourage fencers from joining the USFA then they ought to be drawn and quartered.

[scarlet_woman156k]

it's just $50!!! And thank god for that! My training/competing/traveling/equipment expenses are becoming insane. I wish airline tickets were as cheap as an annual membership.

Seriously, we all need to remember, that for every person who becomes a member (I believe this is accurate info.): $3 goes to your Division and $1 goes to your Section, so they can do the things that Divisions and Sections need to do.

For those of you getting your panties in a bunch, let's get off the USFA's back, and SUPPORT it instead of dogging it. Sheesh. I think they are really becoming a stellar organization over the last few years. The magazine has actually become a worthwhile read (for example)...except the articles still tend to have that "wagging finger" angle at fencers with that arrogant tone I cannot stand. They are really becoming more well-rounded from what I see from my chair, and I can only hope for more improvements.

[OffTarget]

Can anyone tell us how long the fee was $40? Maybe its just inflation. I am a director of a non-profit recreation group with a membership of a couple thousand. We had to up our fees for the first time in several years just to keep the administration up to par for what the membership expected from us. It is a fairly low cost activity (hiking) (I like parentheses too) and many of themembers had concerns about the increase at first. But in the long run membership went up, even if there was a momentary dowturn at first.

So, it seems to me that the USFA is just keeping up with rising costs.

[edew]

It was $35 for the longest time, so I'm guessing it was bumped to $40 after the last quadrennial, 2000. But strikes me as being $40 even before then.

I have been a life member since 1992, so I don't know how much the fee is.

If you know in your heart that you'll be involved in fencing for a long time (as I am), pay for the life membership. It's cheaper in the long run.

[FoilyGeezer]

Originally Posted by oiuyt

Whether or not there's going to be a 2nd Annual "Brad's giving a break to USFA members" Open depends on people like YOU!

I'm so THERE Brad! The only thing I ask is that you let me sell bottles of my new performance enhancing malt beverage, to help me defray the entry fees. It's cold, refreshing and if you drink enough of it you'll feel just like Sanzo (in Sydney). So folks, plan to get your fencing goggles on, because as King Henry said at Agincourt "If you can't get pi$$ed and stab a few foemen, what's the point in going all the way to France?" (or something to that effect).

BTW the aformentioned sports drink will be bottled in familiar Samuel Adams bottles and will be available for a mere $10 a bottle (a small price to pay for a shot at being a legend (at least until we get the photos developed)).

!!!!!

[prototoast]

Originally Posted by edew

It was $35 for the longest time, so I'm guessing it was bumped to $40 after the last quadrennial, 2000. But strikes me as being $40 even before then.

I have been a life member since 1992, so I don't know how much the fee is.

If you know in your heart that you'll be involved in fencing for a long time (as I am), pay for the life membership. It's cheaper in the long run.

Sure, I'd love to be a lifetime member... but it unfortunately requires a large sum of cash which I do not have.

[D+F+P=Hadouken!]

What if the USFA had an open for all ages, sexes and rankings. Anyone in that weapon with a valid card can fence. That would be a big smackdown tournament, and I gotta say, if there were enough refs and strips and all, it would be the tournament to end tournaments. Think about it, you could have it aboard an aircraft carrier with tents pitched all about.