Asking for your suggestions

[Rima]

Dear Freinds:

I as an Iranian female fencers who have played fencing for about 12 years in Foil and then in Sabre, would like to ask you to help me in making the most important decision in my sport life.

Frist of all, let me introduce myself more clearly. As you all may know, regarding to the rulles and regulations implied by our government, we were not allowed to participate in any international competitions during the last 11 years.
Therefore I had to participate only in the local competitions and have got several medals in these championships like the bronze medal from the moslem women competitions in Sabre individual and team events held in Iran on year 2000. I also have got the first place in my country female sabrists since 2000 till now.
Recently some rulles have been changed and Iran's female fencers got allowed to participate in the international championships.
In this regard I participated in the regional olympic qualifying competitions and also in the asian championship held in philipines on April, 2004. But unfortunately I couldnt act well. I didnt earn no good place in these games. I couldnt even show any of my own preferences.
Actually my brains were locked during the bouts!.
Everybody told me that was because of so much stress which normally raises for your first participation in an official competition.

Regarding all the above mentioned pionts I should say that I have faced with a blind alley in my sport life! I am a 30 years old player, I have tried hardly in fencing and I am sure that I can be a real good fencer if I have good facilities which are not accessable in my country like a professional trainer and so on but what can I do?
I have passed a long depression after the qualifying competitions and now I want to do something right about my fencing life.I love fencing and it worths alot to me but regarding to the current situation, I'll have to leave fencing away from my life because there is no hope for me anymore.

Now, I would like to ask you about 2 points as follow:

1- what is the maximum age of doing fencing professionally? I mean, what is your opinion about the maximum age of the one who wants to play fencing professionally.

2-some new idea has come to my mind recently to pass this blind alley. the idea is to apply to earn an athlete scholarship from an american university which has some good fencing facilities, but I dont have any idea about how to start my application. My question is about the suggestion you may provide to help me to apply or any further information you may suggest me in this regard.

Having your kind ideas would be highly appreicated.

[bryce_d]

You sound pretty determined, and I wish you the best in accomplishing your goals.

1- what is the maximum age of doing fencing professionally?

I don't know, honestly. I think as long as your knees don't give out and you're able to move, you have a reasonable chance at staying competitive. As your body gets slower, your mind is hopefully adapting to make up for it. There are people competing in the vetrans events who can beat any decent fencer. This is a lifetime sport.

I dont have any idea about how to start my application.

You've got internet access, so look up some universities online. Contact their admissions department and tell them what you're looking for, and they'll point you in the right direction. It can be complicated, so hopefully you can find a friendly soul to help you get everything sorted out.

I don't know who the major competitive fencing universities are now, so hopefully someone else can post with a list.

For now, check out:
New York University (http://www.nyu.edu/)
Notre Dame http://www.notredame.edu/newndc.nsf/jshome.html
Penn State (http://www.psu.edu/)
Texas A&M (http://www.tamu.edu/)
University of Texas (http://www.utexas.edu/)

I'm pretty sure these colleges have fencing programs.

Even if you don't get in to a top-ranked fencing program in the USA, you'll at least have access to collegiate and/or regional and national tournaments, where you can usually find a pretty high level of competition in the US. Good luck, and let us know if you need anything else.

Bryce

p.s. Don't stop competing. The best way to get better at fencing in tournaments is to fence in tournaments.

[hscoach]

Try looking up scholarships in a search engine under "Woman Ssport Scholarship" I know there are some foundations that offer partial scholarships for women athletes. Good Luck.

[kalivor]

1- what is the maximum age of doing fencing professionally? I mean, what is your opinion about the maximum age of the one who wants to play fencing professionally.

Giovanna Trillini of Italy is 34, and won a silver medal in women's foil yesterday. If you stay healthy, it looks like you'll still be young enough to have a shot in 2008.

[Rima]

Thank you for all your kind replies.
I am really exited to know that there are still some upportunity for me in the fencing world.
I will try in applying for the scholarship.
But as a matter of the competing, I should say that if I stay in Iran there wont be any possibility for me to continue it.
anyway, I will try to stay updated.

Again, Thank you all.

[hscoach]

I hope you noticed I spelled "sport" wrong. Also, colleges vary in price throughout the US. You might want to look at the overall price a college will cost with or without a scholarship. If you already have a degree you might be abel to attend as a "graduate assistant", maybe teach a language class or two. If you go to the USFA website usfencing.org hit "Find a Club" and then hit NCAA. You will get a list of the colleges with fencing. Of course, the coaches vary greatly in coaching skills.

[oiuyt]

There are 25 Division I women's fencing teams in the US.

http://web1.ncaa.org/ssLists/sportBy...WFE&division=1

Note: Texas A&M and U. Texas (listed by bryce_d above) are club teams rather than varsity programs. NYU (also listed by bryce_d) is division III and therefore cannot give athletics scholarship money.

Many of the division I teams either cannot give athletics money (any of the Ivy league schools) or do not give money for fencing. I know somewhere on the NCAA website there's a list of how many scholarships are offered by each school in fencing but I haven't been able to locate the page yet.

This page has information for foreign student-athletes:
http://www1.ncaa.org/membership/memb...oreignstudents

And of course there are a number of non-athletics scholarship options available at nearly every US college or university.

Hope this helps a bit.

-B :)

[JEC]

What is the maximum age of doing fencing professionally?

There is no truly professional fencing in the US. You can argue that the top fencers of some european countries are professionals within the police force of their respective countries.

[Rima]

Dear Oiuyt:

Thank you for your comments. Actually I dont know what Division I ot II or III mean. Is there any reference to study in this matter?

Thanks, Rima.

[GGK]

Thank you for your comments. Actually I dont know what Division I ot II or III mean. Is there any reference to study in this matter?

Hi Rima,

There are some age restriction to compete for an NCAA Division I school, I think they have an upper age limit of 25. But I don't think Divisions II & III has that age restriction. A good place to check is http://www.ncaa.org/ .

Just as important is if you are going to a University to fence you need to look at the coach.

Luck,
G

[JEC]

Universities place their athletic teams in one of three divisions based to some degree in the competitiveness of those athletic teams. In addition, some Universities might have a Division I fencing team, but a Division III football team. The problem with fencing is that there are very few scholarships, and only Division I fencing "varsity team" can provide them. There are university clubs such as the University of Texas in Austin who compete very well among university clubs that are not part of the NCAA, the national organization for varsity teams.

My bet is that you have a better chance of getting an scholarship in the US as an Exchange student from an underrepresented region based on academic qualifications, than through a fencing scholarship in the US.

[oiuyt]

Both Div I and Div II schools can give athletics scholarship money (with different restrictions), while Div III programs cannot. Whether or not they actually do is another question and varies school to school and sport to sport within a given school. Every NCAA school is in a specific division for all of their sports but have the right to "play up" in one sport (either or both genders of the sport). Additionally fencing is a bit more confused than most because the national championships are a combined event across all three divisions. You will, therefore, find some division III schools which refer to their fencing programs as division I programs even when they are not.

Best places to get information are http://www.ncaa.org for general information and the athletics department of specific schools for school-specific information. There's a LOT of material out there and it is NOT easy to wade through to get a clear picture.

The age restriction isn't actually a maximum of 25. Here's a quote from the NCAA (which is where you should check ANY information given on this forum):

21 Year Age Rule for Division I
In Division I only, if a student-athlete has participated as an individual or as a team representative in organized sports competition, that kind of participation during each 12-month period after his/her 21st birthday and prior to initial full-time collegiate enrollment will count as one year of varsity competition in that sport. Any participation in organized competition during time spent in the U.S. armed services will be excepted.

You may wish to consult with the student-athlete's current college's athletics director to determine exactly how many seasons of varsity competition he/she may have used. Please contact the NCAA membership services staff at 317/917-6222 should you have further questions.

So it depends on whether or not what you have done counts as "organized sports competition" by the NCAA.

For what it's worth, there are relatively few fencing scholarships available. Just from a numbers point of view it would be much easier to pay for college through some other means rather than counting on fencing. If the age-limit rule means you have no division I eligibility remaining then that would pretty much block the few fencing scholarships that do exist. Given that you're 30, the first step would probably be to talk to someone at the NCAA and determine whether or not you'd be eligible for scholarships. If the answer is no, then you've just saved yourself a bunch of time. If it's yes then they should be able to steer you in the right direction for who to talk to next.

Contact info for the NCAA is:
NCAA
Membership Services
P.O. Box 6222
Indianapolis, IN 46206-6222
317/917-6222 (phone)
317/917-6622 (fax)
800/638-3731 (NCAA Hotline)
www.ncaa.org


Hope that helps.

-B :)

[JEC]

Brad,

Thanks for the clarification, but what are the theoretical and real differences for scholarships between Div. I and II schools?

Moving to Temple?? Can you say more about it?

JEC

[oiuyt]

Brad,

Thanks for the clarification, but what are the theoretical and real differences for scholarships between Div. I and II schools?

Moving to Temple?? Can you say more about it?

JEC

Good question, and one I don't have an answer to. At some point I was told that there was one, possibly in the amount that can be covered (tuition vs. tuition + room & board vs. tuition + room & board + other expenses?)? In any case there are only 3 Div II fencing schools, UCSD, NJIT, and Wayne State. I've heard Wayne State offers scholarships. Don't think either of the other two do, although I don't know one way or the other. Each of the three divisions are administered under slightly different rules which show up in things such as recruitment (when you can talk to an athlete, etc.). Lots of details like that that I suspect I am about to have to learn (up until know my knowledge has all been either as a former division III athlete or due to be being the type of knowledge-seeking geek that actually reads through the documents on the NCAA website just out of idle curiosity). Mmmm, that segues nicely into the answer to your second question.

As of this coming season I'm going to be the assistant fencing coach at Temple (officially as of 3 days ago). So yeah, moving from Western Mass (and UMass) to Philadelphia in the next week or two. Waaaaay too many details that I haven't taken care of yet (like reserving a truck to move my stuff, etc.) that REALLY need to get done. Meh, it's not like all the trucks are going to be booked by college students moving around the country this time of year or anything, right? :)

-B :)

[darius]

Thread hijack: Congratulations, Brad! Take good care of Marla; the UR team is going to miss her to death!!

Where does that leave UMASS coachwise?

darius

[hscoach]

Sorry RIMA this is for OIUYT. If you are goign to be in the Philadelphia area come visit Fencing Academy of South Jersey. We are only a few minutes away and have 3 A saber fencers.

[D+F+P=Hadouken!]

Dear Freinds:

I as an Iranian female fencers who have played fencing for about 12 years in Foil and then in Sabre, would like to ask you to help me in making the most important decision in my sport life.

Frist of all, let me introduce myself more clearly. As you all may know, regarding to the rulles and regulations implied by our government, we were not allowed to participate in any international competitions during the last 11 years.
Therefore I had to participate only in the local competitions and have got several medals in these championships like the bronze medal from the moslem women competitions in Sabre individual and team events held in Iran on year 2000. I also have got the first place in my country female sabrists since 2000 till now.
Recently some rulles have been changed and Iran's female fencers got allowed to participate in the international championships.
In this regard I participated in the regional olympic qualifying competitions and also in the asian championship held in philipines on April, 2004. But unfortunately I couldnt act well. I didnt earn no good place in these games. I couldnt even show any of my own preferences.
Actually my brains were locked during the bouts!.
Everybody told me that was because of so much stress which normally raises for your first participation in an official competition.

Regarding all the above mentioned pionts I should say that I have faced with a blind alley in my sport life! I am a 30 years old player, I have tried hardly in fencing and I am sure that I can be a real good fencer if I have good facilities which are not accessable in my country like a professional trainer and so on but what can I do?
I have passed a long depression after the qualifying competitions and now I want to do something right about my fencing life.I love fencing and it worths alot to me but regarding to the current situation, I'll have to leave fencing away from my life because there is no hope for me anymore.

Now, I would like to ask you about 2 points as follow:

1- what is the maximum age of doing fencing professionally? I mean, what is your opinion about the maximum age of the one who wants to play fencing professionally.

2-some new idea has come to my mind recently to pass this blind alley. the idea is to apply to earn an athlete scholarship from an american university which has some good fencing facilities, but I dont have any idea about how to start my application. My question is about the suggestion you may provide to help me to apply or any further information you may suggest me in this regard.

Having your kind ideas would be highly appreicated.

I think that the most important thing is to not let your will be destroyed and to keep your hope alive. If believe that you can do it, and you work hard at it, than anything is possible!

[edew]

You're hardly too old to be out of competition. First off, we know there are women in their 50s who have attended Olympics in fencing. Of course, that was before the tougher rules to qualify. Unfortunately for you, the asian countries are getting very strong and the competition in that zone will be even tougher.

You might want to consider moving to a different weapon. Look at the field and see which other weapon might be a better bet for qualifying to the Olympics. I think women's foil in asia might be a better bet. Women's epee is pretty much locked up by the Chinese and Koreans. Women's saber by Chinese.

As for athletic scholarships, NCAA rules have a maximum age of 25 for NCAA eligibility (modulo Brad's comments). Since schools aren't going to give out scholarships for those who can't compete, I doubt you can acquire an athletic scholarship in the USA for fencing.

Besides, while the USA is doing great in fencing, and will be doing better, it's not as though other countries don't have good fencing programs. Many Middle Eastern fencers make the holy trek to Germany or France for training. I believe Maged Shaker (Egyptian foilist) trained for many years in Germany. Do you training in those countries, as their costs are way lower than the USA's training center costs.

[mfp]

In any case there are only 3 Div II fencing schools, UCSD, NJIT, and Wayne State. I've heard Wayne State offers scholarships.

Wayne State does offer scholarships. This year's NCAA champion in women's epee was a 27 year-old Wayne State sophomore from Ukraine.

[Rima]

I think that the most important thing is to not let your will be destroyed and to keep your hope alive. If believe that you can do it, and you work hard at it, than anything is possible!

Thank you for your comment. Yes I beleive the same. actually I have kept an unreachable hope for more than 10 years alive. the hope was participating in an international and official fencing competition! when I started the fencing as a female fencer in my country, participating in an offiicial competition like asian championship was realy unreachable but after about 11 years, it is not so more unreachable. but now, I think if I wait for 10 years later to be allowed to have some good facilities, I will loose all my chances to be a real athlete. That's why I am trying to earn a better opportunity to play fencing. besides, there are alot of trouble for being a female athlete in my country which I think there are the same problems in all 3rd world countries.