I have joined the Dark (Epee) Side....

[HilandDoug]

I was pretty excited last night, as I got my first official epee lesson. One of the things the coach told me that I thought was pretty cool was that the first line of defense is the point, next the bell, then your feet. He jokingly referred to the blade as "35 worthless inches of steel" that's only good for keeping the point "out there." At one point, I noticed I was grinning so big it made my face hurt, I was having so much fun. I even told my coach I felt like a kid with a new toy.

So here's my question: Have any of you that have switched to epee, of fence both or all 3 weapons, had any particular areas of training that helped or hindered the transition to epee?

[Moonitic]

I'm sure you had a blast, Doug! Jim said that once my footwork gets back to where it should be (whenever that is), I can try sabre! TOO funny! But if Jen could do it, I could too!

[DamedEscrime]

I have also just started with the epee. My coach had been after me for sometime to try it. I have to admit it, he was right, I do enjoy it though you'll have to pry my foil out of my cold dead hands.
The problem I am having now is that I suddenly feel like my arm is too short. I really have to work hard to hit the long armed guys at my club. They seem to have an advantage in that respect.
Other than the bruises I am receiving I am having fun with it.

[damianip]

The four things that immediately killed me when I first switched to épée from foil were:

• Maintaining the proper distance
• Parrying less and when I did, doing it properly
• Eliminating extraneous weapon actions in prep
• Losing the slight timing hitch in my attack (still working on this)

There are many other things but for me they were the killers.

Paolo

[Miguelito]

I only spent a couple of months fencing foil before switching to epee, so this is definitely my humble opinion. However, I imagine that if you've been fencing foil for some time it may be difficult to get accustomed to attacking into attacks. I would imagine that you may tend to react by parrying and miss opportunities to pick off your opponent's hand or arm as they extend to attack. Also tactics like a reverse lunge (I think that's what it's called) may seem really wierd at first. (It's basically a backward jump (limiting your target area)while extending your arm into an attack.)

Hope this helps,
Miguel


Como dice el viejo refran, "El que persevera alcanza."

[Dragoneye]

Hi guys,

I fenced foil for a couple years before switching to epee. Not surprisingly I had all of the usual problems upon switching - parrying too much, et cetera. As well my foil game started to suffer. However, I made the decision to exclusively fence epee for a couple months and it made all the difference in the world. The break from foil allowed me to solidify, if you will, the distinctions between the two weapons. As a result I was able to fence foil and fence epee, instead of, as I was in the beginning, doing some bizarre hybrid mess in each weapon. If that makes any sense....

Of course, all that being said, I prefer to focus in one weapon. So, once again, I only fence epee (except when helping teach).


Cheers,

Dragoneye.

[Gajuith]

I concentrate on epee, but I try to practice with foil from time to time to build better form. I never thought that I parried too much...I parried when attacked but I have never been taught anything diffrent...Anyone here have any examples on when a parry would be a bad idea when attacked?

[forte']

Sometimes for me, someone will launch an attack that I know I will have little chance to parry. Either I was napping or they are just plain better. In epee a viable tactic is to forgo any attempt to parry and counter attack, hoping for a double touch.

[swordsen]

Interestingly enough there are times in epee when parrying an attack is the last thing you want to do. As was pointed out at the begining of this thread, our tip is your first line of defense, instead of parrying, hit. Remember, if someone is attacking you, they have opened their target.

[FoilFencer2001]

Based on things I read before taking lessons, I planned to study foil before anything else. But as fate would have it, a guy in my club kept asking me to fence (epee) with him and I, not wanting to miss any opportunity to practice, said yes.

For a while, I kept feeling as though I craved more foil action. I was taking foil lessons but almost all my practice work with classmates was epee.

Now, a few months later, I think I am slipping slowly into an epee mindset. Instead of feeling that I'm missing out on more foil action, I look forward to the last hour of class, when I get to fence with my epee-wielding buddy!

Part of me still fears I'm doing things "backwards" by taking on epee before becoming a solid foil fencer. I get different opinions from guys in my club.

I suppose I need to talk to our teacher next week and get some advice.

Either way, I'm working hard and having a great time!

[MikeHarm]

I've switched to Epee as my primary weapon now, and hope to compete in it a bunch this upcoming season.

Mike

[Inquartata]

Gee, and I always thought that "the Dark Side" referred to sabre!

I started with foil, lo! these many decades ago. I didn't like it, but it was all that my coach taught so I hadn't much choice. When I started at University, the classes were also foil-only, and I confirmed my dislike of it. BUT, there was a club as well, and I went straight into sabre.

Alas, there are far fewer sabreists than either foilists or epeeists, so eventually I equipped myself with epee impedimenta just in order to get more fencing time. I like it well enough, and I do OK at it, although I cannot always control the impulse to cut ( not too productive with epee ). I also have to fight the tendency to move too fast and too much, another carry-over from sabre.

I've never had a lesson in the weapon, though, so my "technique" consists of using the bell as an itsy-bitsy shield, and occasionally trying to jab the arm or do a stop-thrust...

[Sildar]

I too did a year or two of foil before switching to epee, and I've found that attacks into preparation, counter-attacks with opposition, and stop thrusts do you a world of good in epee once you get a feel for the timing. As Bruce Lee taught, you ultimately want to merge your offense and defence into the same motion, rather than rythmically switching between offense and defence. Also, try not to get caught up in multiple feints, it'll get you killed. And ditto damianip's advise.

[epeemike81]

Originally posted by Gajuith:
<STRONG>I concentrate on epee, but I try to practice with foil from time to time to build better form. I never thought that I parried too much...I parried when attacked but I have never been taught anything diffrent...Anyone here have any examples on when a parry would be a bad idea when attacked?</STRONG>

How does fencing foil get you better form? Especially for epee?

It would be a bad idea to pary if:

• Your opponents arm is open to a counter attack on the way in
• your opponent is attacking deep target and you can pick him off before he hits.
• Similar to above: your opponent attacks toe.

Bottom line is that there are many times in epee that a stop hit is better than a pary. If you take the time to pary in these situations, you may not get the touch. The bigger problem with parries from foil/epeeists is that foilists do not hold the blade during the riposte. So in epee, they pary, release, get hit with the remise, and THEN hit the riposte. But, without ROW, that is their opponents touch.

-m

[Cutter]

Funny, but I have always heard that the "dark side" was sabre.

[tinasam]

This proves how off I really am...
I was going to start learning fencing on sabre, but in my club there are no sabre fencers for me to learn off of. This being the case I decided on epee. I have never had a single foil lesson as of yet. I am training solely on epee, and will be going to sabre when and if we ever get a trainer in that field.

[Stryder]

That is a really bass-akwards approach, Tina.
(Or Sam, as the case may be.)

No offense to the epeeists in the room but the footwork and timing and entire mindset of epee is antithetical to that of sabre. (Is that really a word?) Epee will teach you patience, in sabre you need agression. Epee will teach you that you can stand still, in sabre that could get you a card for throwing the bout! (joke) If you can't practice sabre, I strongly suggest that you use foil to tide you over. You can learn to be an agressive foilist and that will translate perfectly into sabre.
If it were me, I would work on sabre without an opponent until I found one. Practice a lot of footwork and watch some sabre video tapes for actions that you can try to emulate.

Epee and sabre are opposite ends of the spectrum. Foil is somewhere in the middle, depending on current trends and which referee you have.
(Right now it is way over towards sabre.

[HilandDoug]

Cutter, I seem to remember some posts from a few months ago that claimed Epee was the "Dark Side." I fenced sabre in college after starting with foil. Never touched an epee (while I was sober) until last Tuesday (July 31).

Thanks, everyone, for your input. I look forward to more!

[big poppa]

Doug, it was me big poppa. Epee is the dark side and Im being seduced by it

[HilandDoug]

You and me, both, BP! It's a lot of fun, especially the way Right of Way isn't in the rules, it's implied on the strip! Just like the REAL DEAL! And even Nadi said it was the closest thing to a real duel in (sport) fencing.