Need DE advice

[cowpaste]

(foil) So...what do I do when I lose 15-0 in a DE...to straight, first-intention attacks? 15 of them. I suck.

[noodle]

it really depends on what the problem was.
maybe your problem was weak distance. if so, work distance.
maybe your problem was weak parries. if so, work parries.
maybe your problem was you were attacking into them if they had ROW. if so, work some drills that program ROW into your head.
maybe your problem was that you were fencing someone just plain out better than you. if so, there's not much you can do exacept train hard and get better.

there are a lot of possible problems. but in general, if you're losing to straight attacks, work all of the above mentioned, you're probably lacking in all 3. unless, of course, you got owned by someone with superior skills.

[rtran]

I would think your biggest problem was distance. You should try and see if you get hit by first intention attacks from other opponents of similar stature.

[cowpaste]

This guy was shorter than me. We would kinda stare at each other for a few seconds in lunge distance...then POW! I'm hit. I guess you could argue that my distance was really bad. I never backed up for my parries. Then again, it's not like I could do it in time. :/

[Schiavona]

This guy was shorter than me. We would kinda stare at each other for a few seconds in lunge distance...then POW! I'm hit. I guess you could argue that my distance was really bad. I never backed up for my parries. Then again, it's not like I could do it in time. :/

CowP, sounds like you was HIP-NO-TIZED, boy!

[dunastor]

We would kinda stare at each other for a few seconds in lunge distance

?????????????????????????

You actually are within lunging distance for several seconds? without doing anything?

[J.Harris]

Not that you should really cherish my advice because I've been in all of two DEs and one of them I lost 15-0 myself but if I were fencing from lunge distance and found I couldn't parry I'd try fencing from step-lunge distance.

[Philistine]

This advice is from a sabre fencer--so it doesn't necessarily translate directly--but when you are at lunge distance (or any distance where you can hit him and he can hit you) you can't just maintain distance.

You've got to do something. At beginning levels--either attack or retreat. At higher levels, you can be setting up, inviting, preparing countertime or something else. But in all instances, you need to be doing something.

--Philistine

[dunastor]

here here...

[jeff]

I'm with the other guys - without any additional evidence it sounds like distance, and that you were too darn close! Move around - don't ever just stand their in striking distance unless you are the one striking!

[epeefencer74]

The 3 seconds rule applies when you are in your "kill zone". You have 3 seconds to do something, otherwise you're just a sitting duck.

[cowpaste]

Oh, I was doing stuff. I played with his blade and stuff. It was fun. I think he liked it. It caused him to shoot at me very quickly and nail me.

Anyway, this guy is the number 2 ranked Thai fencer. Number one is Nonthapat. He was way more skilled than I am. I actually tried following the advice I read on this site about marching. At 13-0, I tried a funky little march. It kinda worked because it caused him to open up a bit, but he ducked right when I attacked, which caused me to off-target.

[Artisan]

The 3 seconds rule applies when you are in your "kill zone". You have 3 seconds to do something, otherwise you're just a sitting duck.

3 Seconds? That's a lifetime. The folks I fence will nail you the moment you step into the zone if you aren't already doing something to otherwise preoccupy them. At lunge distance, somebody better be getting hit or running away!

[swordsen]

If you are close enough to hit someone and you aren't trying to hit them then you need to get out of hitting distence. Obvious exception of course is if you are trying to get him to hit you so you can parry riposte or other counter offensive action. but I am with the rest. distence is your friend and in this case, it seems to have been your problem.

[mollusk]

I agree with the previous posters. It sure sounds to me like distance was the problem, but if I understand things correctly both of you were way too close when your opponenet's attack started. Perhaps you could have used this. It seems likely to me that your opponent did not feel threatened when you moved into lunge distance because both of you were there for quite some time before the final action. Against this opponent I would try a slow advance with a slow extention (probably in a low line). Since his mindset is to attack when you get to this distance he may not feel treatened by your slow advance and extention. In fact he may not even see your extention as his focus is elsewhere. When the counter attack comes just finish smoothly. If there is no counter attack you still have lots of options, the simplest of which is to finish your attack. The important thing is that you have now changed what is going on in the bout and you are forcing your opponent make an adjustment to what you are doing.

[whtouche]

While I agree that distance seems to have been the main problem here, I think we're missing a key componant in fencing up to one's ability against anyone: Confidence.
Too often people fencing people that they don't believe they have any reasonable chance of defeating are 'scared' to fence up to their ability because they feel everything they do will be defeated by this monstrous opponant - so they lose without even trying. I've been guilty of this in the past, it usually manifests itself in getting worked into a pattern and getting hit repeatedly the same way, or repeatedly trying an action and having it fail over and over again because you're afraid to try some of the other things maybe you haven't practiced as much.
You just have to tell yourself, hey....If I attack and use XYZ action, the worst that can happen is I'll get scored upon, and if it's going to happen anyways I might as well not take it laying down.

Sometimes the opposite situation is true, and someone of 'lesser' skill will do great against a superior opponant because they can just relax and have fun and experiment with actions. It doesn't seem to have been the case here tho.

So relax, enjoy yourself and think, what is the worst that could happen? And you'll come up with no reason to be scared.
(note I'm not accusing anyone of being afraid of anyone, just that confidence seems like it was an issue in this case and perhaps this advice helped)

[glowstix]

dude, i say forget what the score was and learn from it. you already said this guy was way better than you. what i would like to know is that if after the first one of those stare down hits, why you didn't open the distance a bit more. when i'm up against C and higher guys i usually give myself way more distance since these guys can probably nail me in single intention.

[Aeric]

Human reaction time is usually not enough to catch these guys, because they can launch an attack in less time. They don't "react" when they lunge, they plan it. So their reaction time is really a lot less than you can deal with.

That's why practice helps. It trains the muscles to out smart the brain's reaction time.

[shlepzig]

1. The result is probably because he was a much better fencer than you. The DE structure puts the top ranked fencers against the bottom. If you had just made the DE's from your pools, that would put you at the bottom and he at the top.

2. Sounds like he got to pick the time and caught you at a time when you were unable to respond.

3. Distance sounds like it was a big problem for you. I try to encourage people to think that when you are outside of Advance Lunge distance is when you are planning what will happen, when you are at the Advance Lunge Range is when things are starting to happen, when you are in the lunge/extention range, things are already happening and you want to be part of what is going on. You were at lunge distance and were not involved in what was going on.

Shlep.

[morael]

This isn't exactly good sound advice, and what everyone else said is much more sensible and better in the long run, but... you might be able to score one measly point against someone like that by doing something outrageous and unexpected--like your march. Or even a fleche. But don't play at it. Don't think about it, even (at least while you're doing it.) Throw yourself into it 100 percent. It'll probably work only once, because then they'll be more prepared, but at least you'll have that one point to gratify your ego!