The Michael Marx lunge

[wflaschka]

This last weekend I was going through my old video-tapes, trying to digitize some of them. I have video of the 1990 Nationals for Men's Foil.

In this clip, Marx (r) faces off against highly accomplished fencer David Littell. Littell is an Olympian, and also a contributor to this site. So, I left in one of his touches. But this clip is mostly about MMarx. (The last action is for Marx. That odd shoulder/head bob before Marx attacks -- didn't that used to be called an ollie-oop? The way Marx uses his upper body, I haven't seen (or rather, noticed) since Romankov.) In the end, it was Marx, Pavese, Littell, Yu placing 1..4. And I'm not absolutely certain about the 1990 date... it was writ on the vhs tape.

6.3 meg QuickTime movie
2.3 meg QuickTime movie

[Artisan]

Yikes! At the end of the clip there's a lunge redouble lunge followed by a marching attack and a final lunge that spans from the on guard line to the two meter line that hurt my groin just looking at it...good stuff.

[K Degnon]

Walter - Do you have any footage of with Ed Muful? I remember he had a lunge that was about half the strip, and I think there probably just a handful of guys that could parry his attacks (certainly not me in any case). I keep telling people that I fence with about him, but I don't think words could describe what his footwork was like.

[The0ne]

wow, great set of actions! Foil style has definitely changed since their day, although you can see the similarities. Set-up for the counter-attack, marching attack. . . What's especially interesting is that it seems like these two both used the marching attack quite often but don't flick often (on those clips anyway), which just goes to show the FIE that flicks are not the reason ROW is the way it is today. . .

[The0ne]

It also really, really looks like Mike Eskin is sitting right behind the table for that bout. . .

[wflaschka]

Walter - Do you have any footage of with Ed Muful? I remember he had a lunge that was about half the strip, and I think there probably just a handful of guys that could parry his attacks (certainly not me in any case). I keep telling people that I fence with about him, but I don't think words could describe what his footwork was like.

Wow... that name brings back memories. I don't know what became of him, or even if he is still fencing. I remember being afraid of him... I'm almost certain he knocked me into repercharge a few times. I absolutely remember fast, clean footwork (I think my coach pointed it out to me); IIRC, I was able to take care of his hand pretty easily, but he killed me with distance.

But I don't have him on video. I have some Uriah Jones lesson footage, and I'm going to be digitizing some more 1990 video of Marc Pavese, James Borin, Ben Atkins... shot when I was in the U-19 finals w/ them. But apart from that, I got NOTHIN! I'll have to check, but I'm sure that's the last cool video I have.

If anybody has old VHS tapes of fencing, let me know. I'll make them into DVDs for you. This stuff needs to be preserved.

[noodle]

walter,

if its something you're interested in, i can help host some stuff on my university club's webspace. we [theoretically] have unlimited bandwidth and disk space. if you want, i'd be glad to test those limits if you want to put more clips online but don't want to spend your own bandwidth.

[Craig]

Some great names being tossed out there. I fenced against Mufel when he was at Penn State and he got me with the powerful lunges and great distance. He also had his own ballestra that had some extra distance to it. Instead of hitting with the flat of the foot on the jump portion of the ballestra, he would strike with the heel and that made for a much faster and longer action. The heel strike added forward momentum to the foot via the rebound.

I worked that action into my fencing and could do it but it would hurt like hell if I did it more than twice per bout.

Here's another name: Murat Yurokoglu. He was Ed's roommate at PSU and one of the fencers I looked up to when I started fencing in Atlanta. Murat had about the fastest/cleanest hand I've seen. Where Mufel would beat you with distance, Murat would beat you with fast blade work.

Craig

[Craig]

BTW - Walter: Keep posting clips! These are great. I'll have to set up a video section of Fencing.Net to archive the video clips.

Craig

[edew]

It also really, really looks like Mike Eskin is sitting right behind the table for that bout. . .

Mark Stasinos.

[fencerontheline]

Ed Mufel... I bought a blade of his(89 BF, and I got one of his gigantic bellguards) from Zaddick a long time ago. I think he quit, and is now with his family in Jersey- but I could be getting old names mixed up. I heard he had crazy-clean footwork and a really nice hand- with good feints and clean changes of lines.... I also heard why he fenced lefty (he was actually righty, but he put his right hand through a pane of glass....).

I know a lot of these 'old-timers'(hehe) from stories I'd heard- but maybe there could be a section devoted to old timers and stories... making into 'living legends' or the whatnot. these clips are great too.... It's a lot like modern fencing, just a ton straighter....

[edew]

There were the three "Marks" that dominated fencing from Columbia in the late 80s and early 90s: Marc Pavese, Mark Kent, and Mark Ellingson. They were all very good fencers, with Pavese being the better of the three.

He did get schooled by Michael Marx at the 1992 or 1993 Nationals (or some NAC) where Marx came down the strip winding his blade like he's turning a crank to start a motor. Pavese just caved in and Michael nailed him. Did it twice, I believe.

[K Degnon]

Here's another name: Murat Yurokoglu. He was Ed's roommate at PSU and one of the fencers I looked up to when I started fencing in Atlanta. Murat had about the fastest/cleanest hand I've seen. Where Mufel would beat you with distance, Murat would beat you with fast blade work.

Craig

Actually, I think I might have some VHS footage of Murat fencing that I might be able to dig up. Unfortunately, I was his opponent, and I think the bout involved me losing like 5-0 or 5-1.

[wflaschka]

Noodle -- Feel free to mirror any and all of the video clips I've put up. I don't have any aspirations for making an online fencing library, but I do hope for these clips to get spread around and copied everywhere -- that way they'll never be gone forever. Craig -- I like the idea of a central repository for videos! Though I agree w/ noodle, & think that the bandwidth will get frightening!

I have more video from the 1990 National Championships, the bouts -- Pavese vs Yu, Littell vs Yu, Marx vs Pavese for gold. Since people seem interested, I'll put up a few more clips like this from those bouts. After this latest set of captures, I think I'm tapped out -- the rest of my footage is from Fencing Footage stuff.

Actually, I think I might have some VHS footage of Murat fencing that I might be able to dig up. Unfortunately, I was his opponent, and I think the bout involved me losing like 5-0 or 5-1.

K Degnon -- I'm sincerely interested in preserving all the video possible. If you'd like, PM me for my address -- I can capture the video off the VHS, and then send it and a DVD back to you. The cost -- one-way shipping; I'll ship back. Let me know.

[wflaschka]

Noodle -- Feel free to mirror any and all of the video clips I've put up.

PS -- plus, I'll send you links before I post them here so you can get a copy too, in case you're able to mirror them.

[fencerontheline]

You mentioned Sasha Romakov's body.... What does he do that's different? Because I've been taking lessons with him for almost a year now, and he doesn't do anything strange except when he takes counter-parry to flank.... cause he's so crazy-fast and his body kinda wiggles oddly... like a fast-parrying jello

[noodle]

PS -- plus, I'll send you links before I post them here so you can get a copy too, in case you're able to mirror them.

cool. i'll mirror them. i'll also use this opportunity to test out a <a href="http://www.archive.org/web/freecache.php" target="_blank">new service</a> i've been wondering about

i was thinking for a while about trying to set up a video storehouse somewhere on our server and asking for a (very) optional paypal donation of like a buck or something to go to our club account as a fundraiser.

[wflaschka]

You mentioned Sasha Romakov's body.... What does he do that's different? Because I've been taking lessons with him for almost a year now, and he doesn't do anything strange except when he takes counter-parry to flank.... cause he's so crazy-fast and his body kinda wiggles oddly... like a fast-parrying jello

It's hard to describe... more of a feeling I get. Some of Marx's moves remind me of Romankov. You can see it every now and then, the upper torso does a bob (or a feint) which is disconnected from the hand. Many good fencers can disconnect hand and foot, but disconnecting hand, foot and torso is rarer. In the middle of the clip, Marx bobs and then lunges and then extends -- it's something you'd do if you were really focusing on tempo (tempo without speed). And the ollie-oop touch at the end -- very Romankovy. (Aside: At a fencing camp, once, Marx told us the story of how he'd beaten Romankov at a tournament; a good story.)

To see Romankov's body-feinting, there's the "Stuttering Clown Attack" videoclip on fencingfootage. But there are other actions from the 1989 World Champs that are more reminiscent. I recently re-watched a lot of Romankov for the Foil Fencing Actions cd-rom, and I'm left with a whole bunch of un-quantifiable impressions of fencing styles.

Anyhow, it has been a long time since I've seen a fencer use the upper body like that. I can't think of any (right now); I think you have to be very relaxed and self-confident. Marx had it worked into his game.

[wflaschka]

cool. i'll mirror them. i'll also use this opportunity to test out a <a href="http://www.archive.org/web/freecache.php" target="_blank">new service</a> i've been wondering about

i was thinking for a while about trying to set up a video storehouse somewhere on our server and asking for a (very) optional paypal donation of like a buck or something to go to our club account as a fundraiser.

Feel free to use any of these clips to help raise funds for your club! Let me know if you try it, and how you did it... I may do something similar for my club.

[fencerontheline]

Maybe sean mcclain does the bobbing thingy too.... have you noticed that on him too?