FIE, sirrah, FIE

[telkanuru]

Has anyone had any experiences with the Cartel Escrime 800N FIE Jackets/knickers. I'm specifically curious about fit and comfort. I'm looking for a jacket that's pretty much skin tight.

I also have heard that the Estoc FIE jacket is pretty good. Any reccomendations there?

(Yes, I'm buying a kit)

[telkanuru]

*sigh* random chance it is then

[neevel]

I don't think Bruno has anyone lined up to be a Cartel distributor in the US. I'm not even sure if he's interested (back when he was running Soudet he didn't seem to place a high priority on keeping a U.S. distributor).

Joe Biebel has an Estoc FIE uniform and is pretty well satisfied with it. It's a nice, light uniform. Swordmasters (i.e., Scott Harkey aka Swordmaster on the board here) carries them.

-Dave

[Swordmaster]

Gee thanks Dave, now I've lost my anonymity!
Just kiding.
Telkanuru, I would be happy to talk with you about the finer points of the Estoc FIE Uniform. I know you would rather hear from a fencer who has one, alas there are none on this board at the moment. I have sold over $50,000 worth of them in the past 3 years (believe me it was dishearting at first selling against the big German guys and the Chinese guy that wants to give everything away). Now we are starting to get a great reputation among those who have dared to step outside the box. Maybe I should ask some of my clients to let me give them as references. There is a young lady who finished 5th in the women's epee Div1 Olympic Trials that likes them so much she is on her third jacket (she has out grown the first two) and I am having it custom made in France for her (it cost about 30% more than normal for that) and she is willing to wait and pay for it. Joe has told me that he is very please with his uniform, but Dave would know better since he is in the same club as Joe Biebel, Men's Veteran Foil World Champion.

[telkanuru]

Drop a few names, why don't you I'm sold, you'll get my order as soon as I get my paycheck

A question of fit, though. I'm currently in a size 40 jacket, 32 knickers, both of which seem to be the right fit, but the charts claim that those are for people 5'7" ish, while I'm 6'1". Eeeek? Will the 10cm rule kill me?

[P00Man]

Estoc makes great stuff. i was looking for the proper company to fit my body type (im very slim and lean) and was also looking for a company that made something of quality (the german stuff (Allstar/Uhlmann) has gone SO FAR DOWNHILL...) anyway, i first saw an Estoc lame at Blade Fencing's place in new york and wanted something of that quality. I asked someone on the board here the name of the company cause i forgot. I then found their stuff for sale on Sword Masters (great place, by the way) and bought a lame and an electric glove for sabre. Both are expertly tailored and of exquisite quality. I plan on getting the FIE whites and another non-electric glove for practice. If you are lean and slim this is the company for you.

By the way, Sword Master, when will you be getting in more of the Estoc Sabre Masks, ive been waiting to order one for around a month now...

[Swordmaster]

POOman,
Sorry but there will not be any of those particular masks for the forseeable future. I was getting some inconsistancies in the quality of the mesh and lame so I spoke with my partner in France and we decided not to buy any more masks from that source. Unfortunately, that was the most comfortable mask on the market, but safety in this game is paramount. If you haven't done so, why don't you post a review on this website. Thanks for the kind words!
telkanuru,
The newest design of Estoc trousers have a very high waist band so you should be safe from the 10cm rule (and the danger of exposing your flank). The waist is closed with three large buttons and has elasitc for need expansion. If you are expecting to grow I would suggest buying a size larger jacket than you would normally and having it tailored for now. A couple of well placed darts in the back should do the trick!

[P00Man]

wow, thats horrible about the mesh and lame, what were the particulars of the problems? Is the lame on the masks different than the lame on the lames and glove, or is it just built poorly (which i wouldnt have expected), cause thats the best stuff ive ever found, and ive looked.

[P00Man]

damnit, that mask has been the only thing delaying my next order, i dont want to drop another 200 on a mask im gunna hate. I hate the nylon lining in all the new masks, that gargabe has got to go, burns the face. Do you know of any masks with a lining of something along the lines of cotton. I figured the Estoc would be lined with this from the pictures, 'the most comfortable mask in the world' jargon and the fact that their whites are lined with cotton.

[prototoast]

damnit, that mask has been the only thing delaying my next order, i dont want to drop another 200 on a mask im gunna hate. I hate the nylon lining in all the new masks, that gargabe has got to go, burns the face. Do you know of any masks with a lining of something along the lines of cotton. I figured the Estoc would be lined with this from the pictures, 'the most comfortable mask in the world' jargon and the fact that their whites are lined with cotton.

The Negrini sabre mask has a much softer lining than the german (allstar, uhlmann) stuff. I highly recommend it.

[Swordmaster]

wow, thats horrible about the mesh and lame, what were the particulars of the problems? Is the lame on the masks different than the lame on the lames and glove, or is it just built poorly (which i wouldnt have expected), cause thats the best stuff ive ever found, and ive looked.

Yes the lame was different. It was being totally manufactured by a company known as Le Mask in Paris. The mesh had irregularities that would allow a punch tester to penatrate the mesh. Plus the hole size was on big side of just under the limit. The lame material was a kind of polyester material like the Infinity lame is made of. Since that time, I have found out that they (the Le Mask company) was putting a false FIE mark on the back tang.
So if anyone has one of these "FIE" masks and tries to use it in a FIE competition it will be confiscated and most likely destroyed.

For these reasons I am know carrying the Negrini FIE Sabre mask, which I concider the best constructed on the market. It does have a synthetic lining, but it is rather smooth compared to the Uhlmann or Allstar. It does have a wierd chin cup that some people don't like. But mask are kind of like shoes, you have to try them on to see if they fit.
I will be at SNats in NC come by and try one on for size.

If you really want a cotton lining I would suggest sending your old mask (if the mesh is still in good shape) to Bill Hall in Mass. He is one of the few people in the world that can rebuild a sabre mask. If you ask him to put cotton in the inside of the mask, he can do that. He can replace everything on a mask except the mesh and it is not that expensive, less than $100.

[P00Man]

nah, i need new mask and was actually looking at a negrini (the old model) before i got my Uhlmann and only didnt order it cause i would have had to ship it from itally, and if the size wasnt right... Anway, i may buy the negrini and have it refinished. Thanks

Too bad about that falsity though, the Estoc looked like a great mask.

[neevel]

Yes the lame was different. It was being totally manufactured by a company known as Le Mask in Paris. The mesh had irregularities that would allow a punch tester to penatrate the mesh. Plus the hole size was on big side of just under the limit. The lame material was a kind of polyester material like the Infinity lame is made of. Since that time, I have found out that they (the Le Mask company) was putting a false FIE mark on the back tang.
So if anyone has one of these "FIE" masks and tries to use it in a FIE competition it will be confiscated and most likely destroyed.

These are the fake FIE masks that we encountered at the armory during Summer Nationals in Austin in 2000. They were being sold by Blade. They were resoundingly failing the punch test. With some you barely had to apply any pressure to get the tester to pop through. Even the ones that passed did so only just. It's not just a question of avoiding using them at an FIE tournament-- I wouldn't consider them safe to use anywhere. If there is anyone out there using one of these, for your own sake replace it ASAP.

-Dave

[P00Man]

i cant beleive a company would put a fake FIE label on a product AS WELL AS not making it well enough to even pass the tests...
Hopefully estoc comes out with a new FIE sabre mask, cause i really love their stuff, and i think im going to buy that Negrini soon.

[DHCJr]

You don't list how long you have been fencing, but you may have missed France Lame masks at the New York World Cup. They used different size mesh on the side. You didn't have to push the punch through. It dropped through.

The Directre Technique overruled Joe Byrnes, but because of his fortitude, we are allowed to punch any FIE mask if we feel there may be a problem.

[P00Man]

ive been fencing for a little over 2 years, im pretty sure France Lames has been out of business/defunct for a little longer than that no?

[telkanuru]

Ok, order's in, and swordmaster has now sold $50,347 worth of estoc FIE gear I'll review when I get it!