Armour!

[telkanuru]

I guess this goes here. I know not where else to put it.

Does anyone have a good method for making real chainmail? What wire do you use? How do you make the links? I know how to arrange the links, but the making seems to not be working as fast as it should...

[prototoast]

If you think it's going too slowly, you're probably doing it correctly. I don't know the details of the process, but from people I know who have done it, it is really, really, really slow!

[Mergs]

Check one of the SCA sites.

[Inquartata]

Butted mail: cheap, easy, but inauthentic. ( It was never used in Europe except in late period parade or display armor, or as repair links for rivetted mail. It was used in Asian suits, but usually made differently, ie Japanese mail=each link was 2 or 3 turns. It's what most people including me started with, but increasingly the trend is toward rivetted mail of varying degrees of authentic construction... )

Anyway, explore...

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/trevor....rmour/mail.htm

http://www.mailleartisans.org/articles/index.cgi

And here's a primer on rivetted mail, including the tools used.

http://home.tiscali.be/klauwaer/malien/engels.html

And with probably far more information than you need or want to know, the Mail Research Society, run by Erik Schmidt, who's about the most knowledgeable person in the world on the subject at this point:


http://www.erikdschmid.com/TMRS_1.htm


P.S. The correct term is mail, just mail ( or to be really pedantic 'maille' ). The word is from the old French for 'link' or 'chain', so as you can see 'chainmail' is redundant, rather like calling your fencing mask a 'maskmask'.

[telkanuru]

Gee, thanks a ton! And I think I will go around referring to my mask as a maskmask. Those old anglo-saxons loved redundancy anyway. One of the first words in Beowulf is 'theodcyninga', or king-king!

[Inquartata]

OK, telkanurutelkanu...oh, never mind.

[Strytllr]

*laff*

True, very true. Of course, the term chainmail has been so ingrainted into our culture that it's actually an accepted term in the dictionary. *shrug*

Telkanuru, I've been making maille (Chainmail, mail, chain, etc. whatever) for going on about 12-15 years, give or take.

There are things you might want to consider. First, do you want it actually authentic... I mean, do you want it historical? If so, you're looking at spending approximately 600-1000 hours of work to make a full halberd. The authentic looking (budded) takes anywhere from 400-600 hours of work, depending on how fast you can work it and how much care you put into it. I've seen some pretty sloppy maille. Authentic maille would be made with somewhere between 16 guage and 18 guage wire. Some people will tell you that anything less than 16 is stupid and inauthentic, but I've seen proof that period museum pieces were closer to 18. Of course, that's all mild steel. For your purposes, I would strongly suggest stainless steel (if using fire and rivets) or galvanized if using butted.

There's another option if you want things to go quicker, be less historically accurate, but still nice looking. Aluminum. It's our friend. Your suit (if you're indeed building a suit) will weigh considerably less, it will keep a nice shine, will take less time to work on and build and did I mention it weighed considerably less???

anyway, The websites Inq gave are all good sites. I have a few more, but not on this computer. If you want me to send them to you, give me a PM.

Good luck!!

Strytllr

[telkanuru]

Yeah... I just watched the LOTR extra footage, and apparently some people don't have any finger prints anymore because they assembled armour for 2 years straight.

[npkeith]

On the topic of alternative (Non-period) metals for maille, I remember seeing a site on the web of someone who was selling titanium links by weight. You could only make butted mail, but it was A) even lighter than aluminum, and B) availiable in lots of pretty anodized colors.

Did a quick google - try this link: http://www.dcwireworks.com/rings/rings.html

[telkanuru]

Thanks all. And I mean that (someone thinks I didn't, the first time).

My problem wasn't with the actual assembly, but the making of the links, so thank for the link about the links Otherwise, it's a bit tedius, and hard on the hands, as my wire cutters are crappy.

My current plans are for a link shirt. If I want, I guess I could always lengthen it to the knees with a split for mobility. No coif (or whatever the head covering is called), because picking links out of your scalp is painful

[Strytllr]

*laff*

If you're going to be doing large scale cutting, you're best off finding an alternative to wire cutters. They work ok, but they can be slower and more muscle fatiguing than other ways.

I've seen the use of a dremel tool cutting blade before. I haven't personally got it to work to my satisfaction, but others I know have a wonderful time of it. Unless you have immense patience (something I do not), don't plan on getting to those knee extensions. At a certain point, all you'll want to do is drop it. Oh, and I'd definitely plan on a 5/16 inner diameter at the minimum. 1/2 is good too. it'll make your suit go faster...

The coif, if properly made shouldn't pull too much of your hair. Of course, it's that "properly made" part that's more full of holes than the maille.

Oh, npkeith, I've looked into that titanium wire. WOW!!!! Sure, it's lots lighter than steel (about 1/2) ... but it's 4 times the price! anodize aluminum. it's far, FAR cheaper.

Later,

Strytllr

[telkanuru]

The links of a coif only get imbedded in your scalp if you get hit there with a blunt object. A complaint of knights of years gone, if I remember correctly. Oh, the pain.

[Inquartata]

Get yourself a pair of mini bolt-cutters to cut your links. They are compound hinged and your hands will thank you. Mine are about 10 inches long and have cut probably a hundred thousand links, everything from stainless to galvanized to soft iron and a haubergeon worth from spring steel.

If you want to buy the links instead of making them, in addition to De Cordene ( noted above ) I've also heard good things about The Ring Lord:http://www.theringlord.com/index.shtml

They also sell tools, wire, etc.

[Schiavona]

Why would anyone want to wear mail anyway? It's about as much fun as walking around wearing 3 layers of clothing-all sopping wet. Plate! Now there's the ticket!

[Inquartata]

Because it "breathes"...unlike those personal ovens from the 15th century.

[Artisan]

if you're making butted mail, consider using solder core wire; used in the jewelry trade. Butt ends, heat - link closed permanently - and... its silver on the outside without being too expensive.

[Schiavona]

Inquartata-I was thinking more 17th cent-basket hilted broadswords(or schiavonas) on the battlefield and rapiers in the streets! English Civil war, "Down the Roundheads!" Good Times (as seen form the comfortable 21st cent)

[Inquartata]

What, you like schiavonas? I would never have guessed!

[Schiavona]

My wife says I'm subtle.